Speaker placement priority.

[kink56]

Just wondering how other people think on this matter.  Placing various Heritage speakers to optimized the bass response is most of the time not the best placement for imaging and soundstage.     Way back before I even knew about the concept of imaging and soundstage, I placed my Klipsch speakers in the corners to get the most bass.    That was 40 years ago!  

 

Now I place my Klipsch (or any other speaker for that matter) where I get the best 3-D soundstage and specific location imaging results.  That means my bass extension is not optimized.  No matter though, I have a stereo pair of subwoofers for that. 

 

So, what is YOUR priority when it comes to speaker placement. Could be one of the two I mentioned or it could be some other priority entirely. 

[MEH Synergy]

I agree with what you are saying.   There is Def a balance between bass response by boundary reinforcement and imaging.  I will say IMO, in my room, compared to other "hifI" speakers, klipsch speakers have no imaged as well as others.   I have also found them dependent on boundary for bass reinforcement, again other hifI speakers, not so much.  Despite what I mentioned, I prefer klipsch and have found them to be much more enegaing and satisfactory across all music genres I listen to than other brands I have had.   That said, if I had a larger room, my preference may not be klipsch in the main room.   Against or close to the back will yeilds just about zero depth on imaging, but Soundstage is good horizontally and forward.   I leave them against the back wall in my room, they take up less space, sound great and I don't miss imaging depth.   On other speakers, I got much better height and depth, but overall, I was less satisfied then with klipsch. Always a balance I suppose 

[jimjimbo]

Mine is the same as yours, although I don't use subs...never have, never will.

[Wolfbane]

10 minutes ago, jimjimbo said:

Mine is the same as yours, although I don't use subs...never have, never will.

 

No Hip Hop for you!!

 

Wb

[MEH Synergy]

6 minutes ago, Wolfbane said:

 

No Hip Hop for you!!

 

Wb

He's all hopped out, not hopped up 

[kink56]

Yes, I will admit I give up the best when it comes to imaging and soundstage just by the fact I have Klipsch Heritage speakers. But I want to get the best imaging I can from them.    There is something about some Klipsch models that I like even over other speakers that image better, even though imaging is important to me.  It is a compromise for sure.  

[MEH Synergy]

22 minutes ago, jimjimbo said:

Mine is the same as yours, although I don't use subs...never have, never will.

I prefer not having subs when possible, I understand your logic there.   With my current speakers, they NEED them. 

[MEH Synergy]

1 minute ago, kink56 said:

Yes, I will admit I give up the best when it comes to imaging and soundstage just by the fact I have Klipsch Heritage speakers. But I want to get the best imaging I can from them.    There is something about some Klipsch models that I like even over other speakers that image better, even though imaging is important to me.  It is a compromise for sure.  

This is why I personally feel a lot of "hifI" enthusiasts either love or hate klipsch. If you can live past that point, they do everything else quite well.   Lots of speakers completely fall apart as the volume increases as well, certainly not klipsch.  

[MEH Synergy]

To your point and question however, In my room, even pulled out up to 3 feet from the back wall, the depth and height of Soundstage barely improved at for me.   I'm sure my room has a lot to do with it, but that is why I stick with corners in my case currently 

[kink56]

HIFI exacerbates OCD, doesn't it? 

[MEH Synergy]

4 minutes ago, kink56 said:

HIFI exacerbates OCD, doesn't it? 

Been there, done that, in a sense, YES.   I don't feel that way with klipsch stuff, which in and of itsslf allows one to focus on the music and have more enjoyment than concern.   

[kink56]

Maybe some of you remember my review of Belles I had.  ( I hated their bass bin resonance ).   In that review I also mentioned I heard some K-Horns that had that same problem. Now I know many may not notice or care about this problem. But for those who do: Has the new La Scala II addressed this problem?   I currently have Heresy III in my bedrooms system and Crites modded Forte I in my main system.  I like both.  But I am trying to decide between La Scala II or Cornwalls as an "upgrade" from my Forte I.  

 

If the new La Scalas still have that bass bin upper bass resonance/exaggeration, then they are 100% out of my consideration, and would go to Cornwalls.  But I am so drawn to La Scala II for some reason that has no explanation in logic.   Bass extension is not a problem for me, so the shortcomings of the La Scala II bass extension is not an issue. 

[MEH Synergy]

Haven't heard the LA scala IIs, but I owned the Cornwall IIIs.   If I didn't have my current speakers, I would have no problem going back to them and leaving them alone as my primary speakers withoit subs.   I throughly enjoyed them. Think heresy IIIs with balls.   And I also strongly preferred the heresy IIIs.   Forte IIIs, no, due to a glaring peaky midrange that made me cringe far too often even after breakin (otherwise I liked those quite a bit too). 

[kink56]

I agree about the Forte III. I had them for awhile and MUCH prefer my Forte I.  Referring to my OP, I had Cornwalls back in 1979, BEFORE I ever understood imaging and soundstage. So, I never set them up for such. I put them in the corner for bass.   So my recollection of them is not useful for my current criteria.   For some reason the Heresy III has better BALANCED bass (though not any more extended) than the Heresy II I had.  The Heresy II bass response was "shelved" down its entire range of the woofer.  And for some reason the Heresy III are not as glaring as the Forte III.   

 

I would love to hear from someone who recognizes the bass bin resonance the La Scalas have and have heard the La Scala IIs to determine if they have addressed this problem effectively.     But, I am not going to gamble, so barring this information, I will probably end up with Cornwalls.  In fact I may seek out later Cornwall II with the banana plugs instead of going with the new Cornwall III. I understand the Cornwall II have a better midrange than the Cornwall III.  

[kink56]

So what speakers do you have that replaced the Cornwall III? 

[Fido]

I place my Crites modified Forte 1s to get the best imaging in my living room setup. I don't understand why so many on this Forum don't like Subwoofers. Being able to fill in those bottom octaves with a sub, more for the feel than anything else,  just adds so much to the listening experience with a good Sub. Even playing acoustic music the subwoofer just adds so much depth, for me. So you can have the best of both worlds

[kink56]

I agree.  It may be because many subs are not fast enough to match with Klipsch speakers.  I really need the 20hz to 40hz that no Klipsch Heritage speaker can cover. (many cannot cover much below 60hz).   But even without a subwoofer,  the Forte I, I have is not too shabby, at least to 40 hz or so. But the subs I have move a lot of air and have a visceral impact I hate to give up. 

 

Most subs are designed for Home Theatre these days and being "musical" is not their priority.  Home Theatre is the bane to audiophiles. 

[MEH Synergy]

28 minutes ago, kink56 said:

So what speakers do you have that replaced the Cornwall III? 

KI 396 IIs with subs (a "better" Cornwall 😏) 

[kink56]

Oh the professional line, worth considering! 

[MEH Synergy]

19 minutes ago, Fido said:

I place my Crites modified Forte 1s to get the best imaging in my living room setup. I don't understand why so many on this Forum don't like Subwoofers. Being able to fill in those bottom octaves with a sub, more for the feel than anything else,  just adds so much to the listening experience with a good Sub. Even playing acoustic music the subwoofer just adds so much depth, for me. So you can have the best of both worlds

Probably because subs are often difficult to PROPERLY integrate with mains.   Difficult to sound as a single sound source and to blend volume.  Subs can "smear" the sound of the mains as well without proper integration (which is what I hate most about them if not done right). Some people care a lot more than others about these things.   I am slightly picky here, but certainly not anal.