High wall, sub ceiling ATMOS speaker reccs to "match" Khorns, Belle, LaScalas , Heresy's in a 7.x.4 set up

[nola]

High wall, sub ceiling ATMOS speaker reccs to "match" Khorns, Belle, LaScalas , Heresy's in a 7.x.4 set up

 

Hello Folks.

Just received my new Pioneer VSX LX505 AVR. It can be used for a 7.1.4 set up. My room is 14 x 27 x 12.5. Hardwood floors and moldings where the walls meet the ceiling. I do not want to do in ceiling speakers. Prefer hanging 4 ATMOS speakers from the moldings. SVS seems to have some angled ATMOS speakers that should work for the purpose. I only saw up firing ATMOS speakers from tower speakers on the Klipsch website, like the RP-500SA. Mix of Heritage speakers from the mid 70s. Khorns and Belle up front, Heresy Is by the couch (middle of room) and LaScalas in the rear. I have multiple subs, both single and dual 18s available as well. Forgive me if this has been asked before, but what ATMOS speakers do folks suggest - per high wall location?

Thanks in advance

From NOLA with love

[MMurg]

I recently purchased six KI-102-SMA-II speakers from the Klipsch Professional "permanent installation" line (https://www.klipsch.com/pro/permanent-installation).  I will be hanging these from the ceiling with the optional SB-102 U-brackets as Atmos speakers for my current Jubilee, Belle, La Scala 5.0 setup.  I figured something from the Pro line should be able to "keep up" with and match sonically with my ground level speakers.  You might want to also consider the smaller wall-hanging cinema surrounds for this too (https://www.klipsch.com/pro/cinema/cinema-surround-speakers).

 

 

[nola]

MMurg:

 

Thank you. The Professional / Cinema lines are likely perfect Klipsch ATMOS speakers for many folks here in our situation: trying to match large Heritage speakers in larger than average home rooms. Did not know about these until seeing your links and others I found to follow! I would encourage others to post their suggestions as well. Did see many web postings that more or less stated matching ATMOS speakers to mains is not important, perhaps due to limited use. Listened to official demo video of Dolby ATMOS (about 2 minutes long). Definitely heard lots of sound via my sound check little speakers (just to make sure my new AVR worked ok). Also listened to 1917 BluRay with my ears next to these speakers to demo the ATMOS speaker channels. Very disappointed about how little sound actually came through these old crappy tiny speakers via the BluRay disc. Friends and some web posts had warned me about setting my hopes for ATMOS too high, pun intended.

 

I could not find prices on some of these Klipsch speakers, eg the 8 inch woofer 801's. Most seemed to be at least $800.00 each bought new. However, I am not confident about my moldings holding more than 5-10 lbs per speaker and trying to avoid anything beyond a picture hanging technique like you see at museums. Only as a last resort would I try to drill through the walls hoping to find the "unfindable" studs: 1890s house with some mix of plastered and sheet-rocked walls. Plan B is to paint and screw 2x4 10 foot or so stud-board to furniture up front and to a rear bookcase, plus clamping it to fireplace shelf in the rear. Then mount the ATMOS speakers. The KPT-801's were about the smallest and were 18 lbs each, per the Cinema brochure. The consumer grade Klipsch 500s are intended for use on top of a newer floor-standing speaker and for firing up to the ceiling to bounce the ATMOS back to folks. The SVS ATMOS speakers seemed more of less designed for high wall or ceiling mounting https://www.svsound.com/products/prime-elevation. Other web suggestions included Focal Sibs https://www.avsforum.com/threads/svs-prime-elevation-for-atmos.2975330/, but no mention of which model. I would need to use creative mounting to angle any of these to my couch area. I understand the Dolby ATMOS dispersion "requirements" in order to cover a reasonable listening area per the Dolby ATMOS spec sheets obtained via the Dolby website. But, to be honest, due to the weight limits, I am starting to think that regular small and light weight speakers might be best for my circumstances, even if the dispersion is somewhat suboptimal. Being more mainstream, pricing would be lower as well. I recently bought a pair of ELAC Connex speakers for the kitchen or bathroom. They sounded great at DC AudioFest in November. I compared them to my smaller and much lighter bargain bin Klipsch ProMedia 2.0s that are also bluetooth. In my bedroom the ELACs were only slightly better sounding overall (though much better looking and more complex design plus additional input / output choices). So maybe speakers with 5-6" drivers might be the best compromise. 

 

The 801's were listed as having a sensitivity of 96 dB. I think most smaller speakers will have sensitivities in the upper 80s (dB), 87 for SVS ATMOS. So another potentially major issue is that few smaller speakers will be close to the efficiency of the Khorns, LSs, Belle, or Heresy's. So getting enough dB out of small speakers (without blowing the voice coils) to match the big boys could be a real amplification issue. Pioneer has MCACC and DIRAC (not the bass correction one) built in for room correction, but there must be limits to corrections.

 

Very glad for additional comments or suggestions. Might help others in the future as well.

 

From NOLA with love.

[billybob]

You might consider the Klipsch RSX-5 or smaller RSX-4 or 3. They have versatile adjustable/mountable base and are IIRC, 93 db efficient.

Come in silver and black. 

 

[wuzzzer]

The RP-500SA are wall mountable.

[MMurg]

As @wuzzzer mentioned, the RP-500SA can also be used as a wall-mounted surround.  The speaker has a switch on it that changes the crossover between up-firing Atmos speaker mode and wall-hanging surround speaker mode.

 

If weight is an issue, other speakers to consider are the Klipsch outdoor speaker models.  I used four AW-650 (https://www.klipsch.com/products/aw-650-outdoor-speaker) for a time as Atmos speakers in my basement Palladium series basement theater system.  They worked fairly well and were light enough to hang from the drop ceiling grid using the included mounting brackets with just scissor clips and clamping knobs.  The only reason I stopped using them is that they weren't a perfect sonic match and I'm very sensitive to sonic mismatches.  I eventually went to Palladium P-17B bookshelf speaker on high shelf units for Atmos.  The overhead localization was a little less precise, but the sonic match was perfect since they are the same series as the ground level speakers.  I have the AW-650 in my garage now.  They are fantastic for outdoor or garage use.  Below is picture from when I was testing the P-17B as Atmos speakers but hadn't yet taken down the AW-650.

 

If you want to go the outdoor speaker route, be aware that the line including the AW-650 and all the AW models is being replaced by the new RSM series (https://www.klipsch.com/residential-surface-mount-speaker-landing-page).

 

[nola]

Hello Fellow Klipsch-ers:

 

Agree, no hope for sonic match to Khorns, etc. But with ATMOS, unlike centers or surrounds, would it likely matter that much? And to be honest, really not in a position to hang Heresy's from the ceiling. I live in an 1890s French Quarter of New Orleans house. Although a Bauhaus and FL Wright kind of guy, I want to be as respectful as possible of the house by not messing with the walls or ceiling. It deserves to be preserved. As I tell friends, it is my retirement home until I go to the retirement home !!

 

I bought the ELAC Connex DCB41, 0.75" plus 4.5” driver, unknown sensitivity,  5.5 x 10 x 8”  7.6 and 6.3 lbs - small speakers a month ago (for kitchen or bathroom use). I do not need the 50W amp portion for ATMOS use. Took a look at their size and especially their weight per what I am guessing the moldings can hold. Simply stated, I think the moldings will be ok holding up the lighter passive speaker. Given that I have never done this before, and might have to change speaker location if I mess up, perhaps 1 screw hole per speaker into the easily repairable molding and hanging the speaker via a picture wire or similar. Sort of like how they hang pictures at a museum or art gallery from these wall / ceiling junction moldings. Could adjust wire for downslope angle and fashion something out of cloth for the room / couch toe in angle, and to avoid touching the upper wall. The 650s might be too heavy at 9 lbs each. RP-500SA II are 9.6 lbs each and about twice the price. What do folks think?

 

The Klipsch AW 525s seem the most reasonable compromise right now: 80-20k, 94dB, 1" and 5.25" drivers, 6.5 lbs, 11.8 x 8 x 9 “ white.  Found some at various websites and Ebay. Affordable too. Web reviewers find the treble to be too powerful / unbalanced thus thinning out the mids and bass. At the price, no reason to buy Polks - Def Techs were more expensive. For ATMOS, not sure it matters. I am also assuming the ATMOS mostly does 50/80/100 -10k and not any deep bass as part of its spatial effects. I also have 2 old unused (hopefully still functioning) pro audio headphone plug type for both in and out ?Raine equalizers, so might apply them here to tone down the treble if needed. I can also use the 80 Hz universal crossover point for subs on my new Pioneer LX505 AVR (only allows 50 or 80 Hz etc for all speakers - not per speaker). If I don't like them I can always use them in the courtyard, LOL. So for $200 or so used, I can test these out for 2 of the 4 ATMOS speakers. 

 

Your comments are appreciated

 

From NOLA with love

 

 

[billybob]

Here:

 

 

 

 

 

 

RSX5_635042122214340000(1).pdf

[wuzzzer]

@nola I use AW-650s as overhead Atmos with my 5 speaker Heresy setup and they work really well.  Super easy to install and aim and they sound fantastic.

[billybob]

Here:

 

RSX4_635042119409590000.pdf

[nola]

Thanks for the replies. Having a bad time finding the larger driver RSX5's. But cost should be less than the AW 525s. Some RSX 4's and 3's at Ebay. I will have to find my Dolby ATMOS engineering DLs to recheck the positioning and angles suggested for a 7.x.4 set up. Might be able to clamp 2x4" stud board to 2 bookcases on 1 side of room (somehow attaching speakers to these boards) and figure something out with high drapery rod on other side of room. Then have figure out how to mount LT rear ATMOS speaker by fireplace behind couch. Might clamp 2x4 to shelf by fireplace. But too much to do for now - been a busy Sunday in New Orleans. 

Thx again !!  From NOLA with love.