liquified Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 So back in 2019 I picked up this older Klipsch system for $200 which I felt was a steal 2 - RF3 II Sides 1 - RC3 II center 2 - RS3 II Rears 1 - KSW-12 Sub Currently running with Denon AVR-4520CL but I also have a brand new Denon AVR-S970H just sitting in a box but thinking of hooking it up to run Dolby Atmos and have the HEOS/bluetooth and wireless capabilities. Now I know the 4520 is a higher end receiver but it's also about 10 years old if I am not mistaken and cant run true 3D sound for Atmos. TV is an LG 77" C2 OLED currently its all set up in a a medium size room with 9 ft ceilings. My questions are... How much has the RF3 towers and centers changed in terms of the new speakers? Is it really worth spending the money and upgrading or am I not going to see that much difference here? The system sounds good but I feel the Atmos will boost the 3d sound. No gaming going on, mostly TV and music. Thanks for your time. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The History Kid Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 Of all the speakers you have, in order of weakness they are as follows: RC-3 II, KSW-12, RS-3 II, then the RF-3 II's. How much have the speakers changed? A lot. Is it a worthwhile upgrade though? That's entirely up to the end user. I personally prefer my RF-3's to the RP-8000's and I know many others who prefer the sound to the newer models as well. The AVR-S970H isn't just a lower end receiver, it's also in a lower class from the 4520, anemic power supply - you'd really want your old AVR back most likely for that swap. I recommend swapping to an X series Denon first, then upgrade your center channel, then your subwoofer. I'd look for an RC-62 used, personally. All that being said - your speakers are fine. Center channel is the area of most desire. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OO1 Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 26 minutes ago, liquified said: So back in 2019 I picked up this older Klipsch system for $200 which I felt was a steal 2 - RF3 II Sides 1 - RC3 II center 2 - RS3 II Rears 1 - KSW-12 Sub overall , you're ok , you may benefit from a better center , but that's about it , 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billybob Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 Welcome back...you are clear and ready to go @liquified Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liquified Posted January 4 Author Share Posted January 4 Is that receiver really going to change a ton between the S series and the X series? Right now with the 4520 the system is so loud in the room you cant go above a quarter of the way up. 1 hour ago, The History Kid said: Of all the speakers you have, in order of weakness they are as follows: The AVR-S970H isn't just a lower end receiver, it's also in a lower class from the 4520, anemic power supply - you'd really want your old AVR back most likely for that swap. I recommend swapping to an X series Denon first, then upgrade your center channel, then your subwoofer. I'd look for an RC-62 used, personally. All that being said - your speakers are fine. Center channel is the area of most desire. 1 hour ago, OO1 said: overall , you're ok , you may benefit from a better center , but that's about it , Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The History Kid Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 26 minutes ago, liquified said: Is that receiver really going to change a ton between the S series and the X series? Right now with the 4520 the system is so loud in the room you cant go above a quarter of the way up. Yes. A ton. Again, the issue has to do with the quality of the parts. The S series has a very anemic power supply that is prone to distort easily. It is not adept at delivering clean power. You want something that can deliver what you need cleanly and with enough overhead to prevent clipping and distortion. The X series is where you will get that result. The S series is not. The only reason I'd even upgrade is if you really think you need the 3D sound profiles, the current AVR you have is more than enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OO1 Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 10 minutes ago, liquified said: Is that receiver really going to change a ton between the S series and the X series? Right now with the 4520 the system is so loud in the room you cant go above a quarter of the way up. I checked the specs of the Denon AVR-4520CL , the Power Output (8 ohm, 20 Hz - 20 kHz, 0.05% 2ch Drive) 150 W , you're saying the amp is loud enough with all your speakers at 25% , the receiver has plenty of power as-is , you're all set Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liquified Posted January 4 Author Share Posted January 4 6 minutes ago, OO1 said: I checked the specs of the Denon AVR-4520CL , the Power Output (8 ohm, 20 Hz - 20 kHz, 0.05% 2ch Drive) 150 W , you're saying the amp is loud enough with all your speakers at 25% , the receiver has plenty of power as-is , you're all set The issue was wanting to add Atmos as well as bluetooth and 4250 isn't compatible with either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OO1 Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 37 minutes ago, liquified said: The issue was wanting to add Atmos as well as bluetooth and 4250 isn't compatible with either. your current speakers may not be Dolby Atmos compatible . -you would have to replace the receiver and purchase this Atmos system from klipsch or check out the klipsch Atmos speakers page and build your own klipsch Atmos system . https://www.klipsch.com/products/reference-cinema-system-5-1-4-with-dolby-atmos https://www.klipsch.com/search?prod_KLIPSCH_PRODUCTS[query]=atmo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The History Kid Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 ^ Alternatively, just the addon Atmos speakers RP-500SA II Surround Sound Dolby Atmos Speakers | Klipsch 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liquified Posted January 4 Author Share Posted January 4 13 minutes ago, The History Kid said: ^ Alternatively, just the addon Atmos speakers RP-500SA II Surround Sound Dolby Atmos Speakers | Klipsch Thats what I want to do but doesnt the receiver have to be Atmos compatible? The 4520 isn't an Atmos compatible receiver. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The History Kid Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 2 minutes ago, liquified said: Thats what I want to do but doesnt the receiver have to be Atmos compatible? The 4520 isn't an Atmos compatible receiver. Correct. Thus why I recommended you look at the X series AVRs from Denon (if you're sold on the Denon brand). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWOReilly Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 Cost to “upgrade” vs improvement will vary. You got your current setup for a steal. Can you upgrade for another one? Personally I’d keep them and look into a better receiver with features you want. Then start looking for a good deal on Atmos speakers and other upgrades. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billybob Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 3 hours ago, CWOReilly said: Cost to “upgrade” vs improvement will vary. You got your current setup for a steal. Can you upgrade for another one? Personally I’d keep them and look into a better receiver with features you want. Then start looking for a good deal on Atmos speakers and other upgrades. Yes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1MoreFord Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 (edited) Just an FYI. Currently new RC-62 ii centers are available from Klipsch for $180. There were some on fleabay from authorized dealers for ~$200 or less new. Incredible value IMO. https://www.klipsch.com/products/rc-62-ii-center-speaker Edited January 5 by 1MoreFord 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liquified Posted January 5 Author Share Posted January 5 11 hours ago, 1MoreFord said: Just an FYI. Currently new RC-62 ii centers are available from Klipsch for $180. There were some on fleabay from authorized dealers for ~$200 or less new. Incredible value IMO. https://www.klipsch.com/products/rc-62-ii-center-speaker isn't that still 6-7 years old? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The History Kid Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 42 minutes ago, liquified said: isn't that still 6-7 years old? It's ca 2015ish. It's still a better center than the RC-3 and is often revered as one of Klipsch's best. I'd recommend that if you were looking to upgrade any speakers - otherwise the rest of what you have is pretty solid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The History Kid Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 OP - I think you are having some hard times seeing the forest through the trees here on a few things - and that's okay. Let me try to put this into perspective for you. I've owned every speaker save the KSW-12 (I own the KSW-15) in your configuration and have run both S and X series Denon AVRs. Many older Klipsch speakers are just as good (and in a fair number of cases better) than their modern counterparts. Most of the folks on this forum all are running multiple-generations-old systems for any number of reasons: They prefer the sound. They're built better. The cost of upgrading does not present a sonic improvement for the value. They just like what they have. We all have gotten bit by the upgrade bug at one point, but you need to understand that the speakers you have are perfectly fine. Their modern counterpart is the RP-8000F. Would buying the RP-8000F be a noticeable upgrade over the RF-3? Only you could really decide if it'd be noticeable and worth the value. I personally think many of the new lines of Klipsch speakers fall well short of how they used to sound and what made them great. Onto buying NOS - like I said, there are many speakers that Klipsch just didn't build replacements for. The RF-63's and 83's are a good example of this. Likewise, there are many speakers that had a good iteration, and a not-so-great replacement. The RC-62 is one of these incarnations. In your setup, your sonically weak link is your RC-3. That doesn't make the RC-3 a bad speaker, it means that if you really wanted to upgrade, that's where your sonic improvement would be noticed the most. Your concern regarding 3D programming is valid; but the recommendation here is to make sure you're providing quality power with a well-built receiver that has a capable power section. The S series Denon does not do this. The X series does. For Atmos speakers, you can easily buy the addon speaker without getting all new speakers - that isn't necessary. Thus, the RP-500SA's I linked. You don't need to upgrade everything just to upgrade. Many speakers are perfectly capable of handling new applications despite their age - hell there are home theaters stocked with only La Scala's and Heresy. In your shoes, I'd upgrade in this order: Denon X series AVR New center channel Atmos Speakers Sidenote: I run RB-5's as heights for my Atmos configuration - they're not Atmos certified, nor designed with that in mind. They're dated 2000 - they do the job perfectly fine. Don't let age fool you like that - especially on a Klipsch speaker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liquified Posted January 5 Author Share Posted January 5 17 minutes ago, The History Kid said: OP - I think you are having some hard times seeing the forest through the trees here on a few things - and that's okay. Let me try to put this into perspective for you. I've owned every speaker save the KSW-12 (I own the KSW-15) in your configuration and have run both S and X series Denon AVRs. Many older Klipsch speakers are just as good (and in a fair number of cases better) than their modern counterparts. Most of the folks on this forum all are running multiple-generations-old systems for any number of reasons: They prefer the sound. They're built better. The cost of upgrading does not present a sonic improvement for the value. They just like what they have. We all have gotten bit by the upgrade bug at one point, but you need to understand that the speakers you have are perfectly fine. Their modern counterpart is the RP-8000F. Would buying the RP-8000F be a noticeable upgrade over the RF-3? Only you could really decide if it'd be noticeable and worth the value. I personally think many of the new lines of Klipsch speakers fall well short of how they used to sound and what made them great. Onto buying NOS - like I said, there are many speakers that Klipsch just didn't build replacements for. The RF-63's and 83's are a good example of this. Likewise, there are many speakers that had a good iteration, and a not-so-great replacement. The RC-62 is one of these incarnations. In your setup, your sonically weak link is your RC-3. That doesn't make the RC-3 a bad speaker, it means that if you really wanted to upgrade, that's where your sonic improvement would be noticed the most. Your concern regarding 3D programming is valid; but the recommendation here is to make sure you're providing quality power with a well-built receiver that has a capable power section. The S series Denon does not do this. The X series does. For Atmos speakers, you can easily buy the addon speaker without getting all new speakers - that isn't necessary. Thus, the RP-500SA's I linked. You don't need to upgrade everything just to upgrade. Many speakers are perfectly capable of handling new applications despite their age - hell there are home theaters stocked with only La Scala's and Heresy. In your shoes, I'd upgrade in this order: Denon X series AVR New center channel Atmos Speakers Sidenote: I run RB-5's as heights for my Atmos configuration - they're not Atmos certified, nor designed with that in mind. They're dated 2000 - they do the job perfectly fine. Don't let age fool you like that - especially on a Klipsch speaker. I appreciate you taking the time in all of this. Ive found a Denon AVR-X2700H locally that is new in the box for $300. This should be plenty for what I am trying to accomplish right? I've also found a pair of RP-500SA's locally but they are not the II's. Did the originals not meet the standard and hence the second generation of them? I'm still looking at center speakers and will at least put that next on my list if something locally comes up. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The History Kid Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 3 minutes ago, liquified said: I appreciate you taking the time in all of this. Ive found a Denon AVR-X2700H locally that is new in the box for $300. This should be plenty for what I am trying to accomplish right? I've also found a pair of RP-500SA's locally but they are not the II's. Did the originals not meet the standard and hence the second generation of them? I'm still looking at center speakers and will at least put that next on my list if something locally comes up. No problem at all. The X2700 will be plenty for your application. It has the 3D modes and plenty of power for what you need to accomplish. I don't know of any true difference between the SA and SA II's - I assume they're similar in difference between the 3's and 3 II's (which was Monster Wire, I imagine the difference is similar in ambiguity or may be cosmetic). Either way, the II's should not be any issue and should integrate perfectly fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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