J M O N Posted August 31, 2003 Share Posted August 31, 2003 Haven't heard much mention about Don Garber's Fi amplifiers on here. I have heard them to be well regarded, but don't know much more than that. Does anyone have any experience with these? There was a Fi X 2A3 on Audiogon that I inquired about. It sold within a day, however. Must be desirable to sell that quickly. Anyone know anything? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted August 31, 2003 Share Posted August 31, 2003 Fi by ole Don Garber are considered EXCELLENT SET amps by many. They are much harder to find due to Don's more secluded nature, not to mention his on and off production. He has no website but you can get his contact info from the MagneQuest site in the OEM section (call him at 718-625-7353 ~ email: dgfi@earthlink.net ) His most famous 2A3 amp is the little X amp that is a esoteric a build as they come, this more construction wise. It's hard to get a more direct signal path. These X amps go for less than $900 on audiogon. They come with a MagneQuest transformer upgrade as well, worth the money from all reports. These amps always get good comments. Below is a picture of his one of a kind X amp over his 2A3 Monoblocks. BTW, the pic below is nothing official ie not his logo but those are his amps from pic on my HD. kh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Disc Posted August 31, 2003 Share Posted August 31, 2003 There is one on Audiogon right now going for $800. Very interesting layout indeed. http://cgi.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cl.pl?ampstube&1067451496 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Disc Posted August 31, 2003 Share Posted August 31, 2003 According to one former fi owner, he preferred the Wright Sound Company 2A3s. Below are his words verbatim. "I've had the fi "X" and ASL Tulip. The Wrights sound more balanced and extended at both ends with that reach out and touch effect you can only get from SET amps." - tb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted August 31, 2003 Share Posted August 31, 2003 I love the Wright Sound 3.5 Mono but will have to admit, wasnt that guy using this quote in an AD to sell his amps? You're diggin' deep, Tim! heh... How's the ole Cary comin' along? I bet it's a neat amp but as stated in that thread, I bet you side with the Wright Monoblocks, at least with this comparison. kh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Disc Posted August 31, 2003 Share Posted August 31, 2003 I wasn't diggin on purpose. I just happen to notice that in his ad. I have no first hand knowledge of the Fi's so as always, take the info with a grain of salt. The Cary is running. Single-Presentation listening now. I don't know if my ears are plugged or what, but I don't really notice any big difference at all. The Cary sounds very much like the AES/Wrights. It's close so I'm going to have to go switch back and try some A/B/A analytical listening. - tb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted August 31, 2003 Share Posted August 31, 2003 This brings up a VERY good point as well. The differences between gear can sometimes be VERY subtle in nature, but very important nonetheless. Sometimes, it takes living with the piece for a few weeks to months to ascertain these differences enough to articulate it in print or make some solid comments. One thing, the more experience you get hearing the variety of gear with all sorts of combinations and sources (including software), the more experienced you get at honing these differences down to the quantifiable. This takes time, exposure, and experience. At this stage, one might ask "what's the point, if the piece of gear is so close in sound?" Well, these differences can actually be the difference in happiness with the gear in the long term. Also, the less time you have in this game with either gear or options with subtle differences, the more these differences seem minute. As to this specific comparison, the more you listen, I bet you will be able to hone some of the differences down enough to write them out. Actually, in one setup, you have whats more like a passive pre feeding into 6922 tubes, something altogether different than your 6SN7 feeding the single-ended Wrights. I think you will hear some differences perhaps with more time. When you see these reviews in print, remember that most of the time, the person has had the gear under consideration for MONTHS. Still, you have quite a few differences between those two setups. Just noting the main difference you found in the minitube vs the octals in the pre comparison is something to consider. Another interesting note, I almost bought a pre-production Cary 2A3 PP back in 98 but opted for SET instead. kh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Disc Posted August 31, 2003 Share Posted August 31, 2003 The differences will reveal themselves. I supect the vocals with the AES/Wrights are a bit more relaxed and natural. The big strength with the AES/Wrights is I can stick another amp on the AES if I want a different amplification. The Cary does not have a pre-out so it's limiting. I'm kicking myself now for never running the AES through the Eico, and for that matter selling it... I'm very tempted to get a pair EICO HF monoblocks to do just that. I'll keep the Wrights and get some Eico iron to fit the bill when I need the extra juice. That is less than 5% of the time. Erik - Are you listening and are you for hire? - tb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted August 31, 2003 Share Posted August 31, 2003 Well, on running the EICO HF-81 with preamps, I did this with several preamps, two being the Cary SLP-70 and the Creek passive just to see. In both cases, I found I actually preferred the EICO HF-81 as a whole package over the preamps into the power amp. One of the reasons also is the way it's wired, which is not conducive to this as you actually run the pre through the tape OUTPUTS! Sounds strange but it works, although I found the sound lacking the ultimate body and coherency of the EICO run as a full unit with it's own triode preamp section. The EICO HF-14 are neat little amps and are basically the power section of the HF-81. The interior is so beautifully simple that it's amazing. Ditto for the HF-86 stereo. For the EL-34 monoblock side, the HF-35 is the BEST deal of that lineup. It uses the Chicago Standard output iron and is supposed to sound VERY sweet. I have never heard anything but good about them. Mark Deneen actually had some on the bench and they test insanely good. Then again, I am not big on measurements as being the whole answer(the square wave reproduction on the EICOs is VERY nice). The HF-35 dont go for cheap (but still cheap relatively speaking) anymore but they sure can slay a lot of other big name options. Then again, I think the little HF-14 amps are very compelling and have grown to actually love this tube more than the EL-34 (sometimes, the big, billowy sound of the EL-34 is great). Still, you cant have too many neat amps! And those EICOs have GREAT iron. kh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted August 31, 2003 Share Posted August 31, 2003 "I don't know if my ears are plugged or what, but I don't really notice any big difference at all. The Cary sounds very much like the AES/Wrights. It's close so I'm going to have to go switch back and try some A/B/A analytical listening." Well Kelly, in the other thread you bet that the Cary wouldn't displace the Wrights, and I bet that Tim would fall in love with the Cary and might have trouble deciding which setup he liked better. I have to admit to being somewhat taken off balance that the differences weren't more readily and immediatley apparant. Hell, these setups are very different. Ha! Maybe Tim's ears ARE plugged! "At this stage, one might ask "what's the point, if the piece of gear is so close in sound?" Well, these differences can actually be the difference in happiness with the gear in the long term. Also, the less time you have in this game with either gear or options with subtle differences, the more these differences seem minute." Oh man, you left yourself wide open. I'll go with your position here on this one without nit-picking because for the most part I agree. However, If you have two setups that sound very, very close -- and one system delivers higher undistorted output, shouldn't that be factored into the equation? Wasn't this Tim's question, "Is 15 watts enough?" The implication of course being that sometimes 3.5 watts isn't. So now we have this revelation, and a pleasant surprise for Tim -- He can get very close, not give up all that much (as far as being anything too obvious) -- and get the additional power he is looking for. "...in one setup, you have what's more like a passive pre feeding into 6922 tubes..." It sounds like more than that to me. "The input preamp drive stage is a 6922 dual triode on the CAD-2A3-SI. This circuit is identical to the Cary Audio single-ended amplifiers. The 6922 drive stage is a single-ended, class A, anode current source, gain stage. The input signal from the selector switch and volume control is direct coupled to the grid of one section of the 6922 input tube. The anode of this section is direct coupled to the cathode/grid of the second stage. This second stage takes the place of the conventional dropping/coupling resistor network found in conventional gain stages. This is called the anode current section and offers infinite resistance and the proper current/voltage to operate the gain stage. The amplified signal is then direct coupled to the 6BL7 which drives the 2A3's in the balanced configuration as described earlier." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted August 31, 2003 Share Posted August 31, 2003 I think the entire problem with comparing Tim's 2 combinations is the lack of a preamp with the Cary. What really surprises me is that without the preamp he is not hearing a major difference at all ! I think just for giggles you should run the preamp with the Cary and see what it sounds like. I will be curious to see what you hear. It makes me wonder what the PP 2A3 would sound like with a killer preamp in front of it. I know I did this with Mopar Dave Chinese Adcom EL34 integrated and the preamp really woke up the sound field and detail. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J M O N Posted August 31, 2003 Author Share Posted August 31, 2003 Thanks for the input. Sounds like that X amp would have been a good deal. I may very well have given it a shot had it not sold so quickly. I'll now have better information the next time one comes available. TBABB: the one you mentioned is the one that sold within a day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neo33 Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 "Fi by ole Don Garber are considered EXCELLENT SET amps by many." No bids on this mint pair of Fi 2A3 monoblocks so far. It seems people think otherwise, or perhaps the price is just too high. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 Well, in my view, this is not the kind of thing you sell on ebay. For one thing, you RARELY see those TANGO outputs. That is the first I have seen them on the Fi Monoblocks. Some people REALLY like Tango iron - it is not CHEAP.... With a starting bid of $2000, no one with any sense will bid a single thing till the last possible second anyway. The clever way to do ebay is to start bidding LOW and use the reserve. Don Garber's stuff is liked but it is much more under the radar. I have some reviews of it if interested. His phone number and email are on the MagneQuest site. He doesnt want online representation. kh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neo33 Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 The Tango NY-15-3.5S must be some type of tranny at $550 each! Hard to believe. No wonder the price is so high. That Fi pair better be damn good! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Mandaville Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 Neo: There are actually quite a few people who really LOVE this unique little amplifier. I know someone who is an owner, and has heard it compared to Moondogs, Laurels, Wrights, etc. It seems to be give a more relaxed sort of presentation that the other designs mentioned, which is not necessarily weakness. I think the MagneQuest upgrade would be something I would go for without hesitation, though. tb: What do you have in mind? a little power supply upgrade, or something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkrop Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 There is a FI-X that has been on audiogon for little while available: http://cgi.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cl.pl?ampstube&1075150852&class&3&4& Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 Erik, I believe Neo is referring to the Fi 2A3 Monoblocks and not the Fi X. These Monoblocks are quite a different option than the "X" stereo amp. In addition, the units he is referring to on ebay have TANGO Permalloy Potted outputs coming in at over $1100 for the pair. Many hail the Tango xformer line. This is an OLD thread that was brought up again. Tim's comments were made in AUGUST when he was looking at getting some EICO monoblocks to refurbish. See date. I havent seen Tim on here much since his big move. As for that Fi "X" that bkrop points to on Audiogon, notice how you never see the transformers in the pics. I know that Don sometimes puts the DS-025 on this as an upgrade. From what I can tell, this "X" does not have this upgrade. I dont think it even mentions the iron, mainly cause the quality iron might have even been removed. Compare the audiogon X to the X in my graphic at top of this thread and you will see a MAJOR difference in the outputs (on another note, this little X on audiogon is an INTEGRATED with passive volume etc. a neat little option) kh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Mandaville Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 sheesh... This is a totally different ball game! Thanks for the correction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Mandaville Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 My mom used to buy me plastic car and airplane models so that I would improve my fine detail reading ability -- and to practice following instructions. I remember one time she gave me an old Model T Ford and fighter jet model at the same time, reminding me to follow step-by-step instructions exactly until they were done. What did I do? I threw away the instructions and combined both models into one. I made a jet-powed Model T ford with wings! I really think I might have been an ADHD kid! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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