doctorcilantro Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 Hi folks, I am still doing my homework but I thought I'd post here for some much needed help... I am looking for a tubed receiver with a quiet phono stage...most likely a vintage one. Currently I am using a Sansui 6060 w/ Sansui SP-2000 speakers and I'd like to jump into the tube world ever since my experience with some Lowrey organs. I plan on getting some efficient speakers (the Sp-2000 are near 100db), maybe Klipsch, and I look forward to hearing your suggestions on what I should be looking for. thank you all for your time, Jon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piranha Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 ---------------- On 1/8/2004 9:34:15 AM doctorcilantro wrote: Hi folks, I am still doing my homework but I thought I'd post here for some much needed help... I am looking for a tubed receiver with a quiet phono stage...most likely a vintage one. Currently I am using a Sansui 6060 w/ Sansui SP-2000 speakers and I'd like to jump into the tube world ever since my experience with some Lowrey organs. I plan on getting some efficient speakers (the Sp-2000 are near 100db), maybe Klipsch, and I look forward to hearing your suggestions on what I should be looking for. thank you all for your time, Jon---------------- Hi, Welcome to the Forum! Well it depends. How much do you want to spend? What's your budget for a receiver and for speakers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorcilantro Posted January 8, 2004 Author Share Posted January 8, 2004 The budget isn't very big, unless I sell my drum kit -yikes- Speakers 600$ tops & an amp maybe 300-600$ Jon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3dzapper Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 Doctor, May I prescribe for you a vintage Scott 240? With a quality rebuild the amplifier is as fine as many new ones for much more money. Rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 doctorcilantro. Are you asking for a FM receiver ? If so there are many from the 60's that work great. Fisher 400, 500 and 800 or Scott 340, 340B and 380's are real nice. Your budget may be slightly low unless you find a great deal on one that isn't going to require to much work. This is especially true of the Fishers they command a big price and the techs that specialize in them are not cheap. I personally think the Scotts are at least as good if not better. Be careful with the ready to roll descriptions on eBay unless your lucky they are rarely working up to there potential or even really safe to run. Vintage Tube Audio is a terrible thing to waste. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxg Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 Sansui SP2000 speakers?? Why I have something very similar in my bedroom - the SP2500's and very nice they are too. With your limited budget you could just go tubes for now and migrate the speakers later. I tried the SP2500's with a pair of KT88 PP 45 WPC monoblocks a while back and they worked very well - but it is a totally different sound from Klipsch - much more laid back presentation, highs more rolled off etc. What Klipsch speakers have you heard? What dont you like about your existing speakers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddy Dee Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 Doctor: Welcome. I think you could locate some nice Heresy's within your budget. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorcilantro Posted January 8, 2004 Author Share Posted January 8, 2004 Thanks for the responses guys (any gals around here?) .... I guess I just have the upgrade bug in regard to the speakers-=-=-=translation = my fiance hates how they look LOL! I like the speakers a lot and my thought was stick with them for a while because speaker selection is going to be a long process I think...I haven't heard any Klipsch speakers, but maybe I can get Greg to let me prostrate in front of the legendary Khorns and weep --since I am in Maine. The only Klipsch product I have heard is their computer multi-media system, and while I usually laugh at these systems, the one my brother has totally blew me away, for what it cost and what I thought it was going to be....I was very impressed. I am looking for a very nice tubed FM receiver with a quiet phono stage yet I can't spend a grand or anything so I have been eyeing and reading about the vintage ones in that price range. I found a Harmon Kardon for 250$ but don't have the model number or any specs yet. Thanks again...this forum makes me feel warm & fuzzy... Jon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorcilantro Posted January 8, 2004 Author Share Posted January 8, 2004 My other thought is that I could pick up something like a 222d Scott integrated amplifier and run FM from my Sansui to it. While I'd like to have it 'all in one', I'm sure there are some nice units out there to be had without a tuner right? Jon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorcilantro Posted January 8, 2004 Author Share Posted January 8, 2004 from Usenet: I own both Fisher and Scott equipment and like them both. The best sounding of the lot is the Scott 299C. My Fisher 500C and 800C are great receivers, though, and the tuners are a bit more sensitive then Scotts with the exception of the 310 series of Scott. As for the 222series verses the 299 series, the old 222 is not as nice as the 299, but the 222C is much clearer and crisper sounding then an older 299 or 299B, but again, the 299C sounds better then them all. With respect to amplifier sections with a CD player, Fisher has nice tight bass, but lacks the extreme highs of it's Scott counterparts. With a turntable, the 299 series of Scotts has a very fine phono section. Much better then the Fishers. Quite frankly, both Fisher and Scott are excellent, but Fisher seems to be built a little more rugged. Little things like heat shields and the like make the Fisher a much longer lived unit. Scott, on the other hand, has a lot more component deterioration due to inadequate heat ventilation and channeling. A 299C it a heat nightmare. I have yet to see one that hasn't had at least one bad power supply capacitor. The 299's power resistors under the chassis cause a multitude of headaches. But, with minor mods, the Scotts can be made better. Circuit wise, though, Scotts are just plain great. One thing about Fisher, though, they use pretty much all 12AX7's in the audio sections. This is great since they are readily available. Not so with the 7199 phase splitter tubes in my 222C Scott.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Mobley Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 Jon, >>"this forum makes me feel warm & fuzzy"<< Don't worry, this will pass soon.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorcilantro Posted January 8, 2004 Author Share Posted January 8, 2004 What ch'all think about FISHER 500B FM stereo multiplex receiver. 37 wpc. Uses 7591 output tubes. Works fine but needs restringing of the tuning dial. Cosmetics 'very good.' Some tubes included, $150. HEATHKIT AA100 integrated amplifier. Uses 7591 output tubes. Est. 35 wpc. Massive, quality transformers. Near mint but has hum and some distortion. $95. H.H. SCOTT 222C integrated amp. Excellent condition but has a blown power supply. Worth $495 repaired. $195. Jon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorcilantro Posted January 8, 2004 Author Share Posted January 8, 2004 From Audio Asylum: "Scott is just cheapo mass-market tube dreck with lousy iron (and bizarre impedances, the OPT's that Von Recklinghausen specified for the 299 were between 1/3 & 1/4 the proper primary impedance!). Von Recklinghausen did bizarre horse-latitudes in all his stuff, like he was really, really bored or something... The sound of Scott is further off the source than just about ANY vintage hi-fi amp! You've got to go to a SET amp circuit out of an issue of MJ magazine (OK, OK, Sound Practices even...) to find something that would sound any more bizarre and surreal... " By the way, Joe also seems to hate almost every EL84 amp, so some of his comments may take this dislike into consideration. As for Scott, the only 7591 model I owned was a LK-72, which was intitially a kit and probably not as nice as the other 7591 Scott integrateds. I have also owned a 222B which uses EL84's. I personally liked these amps (not love), but sold them both. I really do not like the 6U8/6GH8/7199 approach to phase splitting/ driving. I do not like in the Scotts, the Sansuis, or the Dynacos. I think the Dynaco circuits sound best by a small margin, but all the vintage circuits I have heard using this approach seem to have similiar sonic deficiencies. But be aware that all were stock (although within spec). I do like several features on the Scotts, such as the adjustable bias, ac balance, and dc balance pots. These are noticibly absent on allot of stuff including the Pilot integrateds. Moreover, I certainly like the looks of Scott equipment. However, I would think that if I needed an integrated I would look for a Fisher X-1000 (EL84) (some like the 100 series). Fisher, in my opinion, built some of the better EL84 integrateds. A Pilot 240 or 245 (both EL84) might be a good choice if you like the looks of them. As for 7591 integrateds, Scott's may be your best option, though Harmon Kardon made them and I am sure there are others. People really like 7591's, but I have never heard an "all out" 7591 amp, so it would be hard to comment. Another option would be a 6V6 integrated. I have not seen any, but I know they are out there. In fact I think Pilot made one. 6V6's are a MUCH BETTER sounding tube than EL84's. If you could find a 6SN7/6V6 circuit with a good power supply you would be in hifi heaven. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg928gts Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 Jon, I'm not exactly sure what you intend to do in front of my Khorns, but whatever it is, you clean it up! Greg p.s. I have a Scott 299A that you can listen to when you come up. Also, why couldn't you use the preamp section of the Sansui for a while and get a tube amp? Heresy's can be had for $400 or so in pretty good shape, and a basic PP tube amp can be had for $400 or so. I submit that no matter what you get first, you'll be upgrading sometime soon anyway. You have no idea what you're getting into right now! HeHeHe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 Oh my God take all things Joe Rosin with a grain of Salt !! If a product isn't absolutely perfect in every way its a POS to him. He never puts anything in its context. Are Scott, EICO , Fishers or any of the affordable vintage gear the absolute end all of audio heck no ! But there one hell of a value and sound darn good. 100s of people on this forum can not be wrong ! Opinions are like A-holes everyone has them and some more twisted then others. When reading things on the interenet always remember this is not a dictionary or the Bible these things are 90% personal opinion and not fact. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben. Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 HH Scott 399. This might fit the bill. Looks like you may be able to get the price down a bit. Craig or Ryan may give you some ammo technically to use to convince the seller that it would need some updating. (Which it probably does.) http://cgi.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cl.pl?ampstube&1075997247 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben. Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben. Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 but all the vintage circuits I have heard using this approach seem to have similiar sonic deficiencies. But be aware that all were stock (although within spec). This says it all. In there stock form and I don't care who was the manufactuer none of them sound anything like they can with a nice freshening 40 year old parts are just that ....Wore out 40 year old parts. I bet not one amp you have heard was truly operating within spec. if it was then it would be a maricle as far as I'm concerned I have rebuilt 100's of vintage pieces now and can count on one hand the amps that were close to running in spec when I recieved them. I listen and test every amp before I rebuild them. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben. Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 Craig, simmer down. I think the whole thing was cut from an AA post. I don't think our friend here has heard any of the amps mentioned, and was not stating the opinions contained in his post. Could have been a bit more clear, doc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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