samoth Posted June 21, 2004 Share Posted June 21, 2004 I use a B&K 1400 MOSFIT amp with my FORTE 2 speakers. I have read that mosfit amps produce a tube like sound with excellent solid state bass response. Would I be happier with a push pull type tube amp? If so , which tube amp would sound better than my B&K when playing back movies and SACD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piranha Posted June 21, 2004 Share Posted June 21, 2004 ---------------- On 6/21/2004 8:43:00 PM samoth wrote: I use a B&K 1400 MOSFIT amp with my FORTE 2 speakers. I have read that mosfit amps produce a tube like sound with excellent solid state bass response. Would I be happier with a push pull type tube amp? If so , which tube amp would sound better than my B&K when playing back movies and SACD. ---------------- Several Klipsch employees said that they used B&K amps for testing prior to the purchase of Aragon. That says something. I like both tubes and good SS. From the few I have heard personally, B&K makes some nice SS amps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBrennan Posted June 21, 2004 Share Posted June 21, 2004 samoth---Only you can answer that question. People like all kinds of things. One guy likes what another guy hates. There's no telling what you'll like until YOU listen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted June 21, 2004 Share Posted June 21, 2004 Amen to that! I sure did like the sound of Trey's Aragon with the Cornwalls in Indy. Sounded pretty good to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piranha Posted June 21, 2004 Share Posted June 21, 2004 I really liked Roger's Aragon on his Klipschorns. It sounded great. It looks awesome as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdm56 Posted June 22, 2004 Share Posted June 22, 2004 Before I went multi-channel, I used a MOS-FET integrated amp (Sony), and yes, in my experience they do have a warm, organic sound, that offers the some of the best of ss and tubes. I am not a tube guy at all, so I would never recommend tubes, but to each his own! If you like the sound better, and don't mind the considerable downside, then go for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddy Dee Posted June 22, 2004 Share Posted June 22, 2004 Yep, if you like the way it sounds it's good. I know some absolute Klipsch lovers who never take off the Tshirt who are perfectly happy with the sound of their SS amps. It is also true that all MOS FET amps don't sound the same. I found my Hafler 9303 to be unsatisfactory with LaScala's. To my ears, it worked great driving a quad of Bose 802's and a pair of 302 subs. On Scalas my ears were bleeding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted June 22, 2004 Share Posted June 22, 2004 "...which tube amp would sound better than my B&K when playing back movies and SACD." We talk a lot about amplifiers, but the showstopper is the preamp. If you're doing HT with a processor -- just stay with some good solid state. You lose most, if not all of the "tube sound" when when you run them through a solid state front end. I really don't know why that is -- it just is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samoth Posted June 22, 2004 Author Share Posted June 22, 2004 Excuse my spelling of MOS-FET in post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbsl Posted June 22, 2004 Share Posted June 22, 2004 As always opions vary such as the statement AK-4 made "You lose most, if not all of the "tube sound" when when you run them through a solid state front end. I really don't know why that is -- it just is." I bought the Cayin TA 30 to go with my La Scalas and did not like the sound mainly because of the preamp section of the TA 30. I own a Denon 4800 A/V reciever that I run the TA 30 thru and it sounds much smoother and musical sounding than when just using the TA 30. The Denon cost me almost $ 2000 so it's preamp section is very good. Before the Cayin I was using 2 Monarchy Audio SM 70 pros 80 watts each which sounded very good with my KLF 20s but with the La Scalas the combo did not sound very good but the Denon and Cayin combo sounds much better! Now if I bought a tube preamp it would take it to another level but from my experience you can use a solid state preamp as long as it's not a $300 one you buy from Walmart. I've spent way to much money over the last 9 months so I have to pay off some debt before I can get a tube preamp or get a couple of better tube amps. Also I have to admit it is nice to be able to use the remote control on the denon for volume control since I rarely leave the volume at the same level for very long. Xman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted June 22, 2004 Share Posted June 22, 2004 I'm not a 100% sure, but I don't think the front end of the Cayin is buffered. I think it's just like a passive linestage. When using the Denon, you actually have a "preamp" in the chain. So, going through the Denon, you think the Cayin still sounds "tubey"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbsl Posted June 22, 2004 Share Posted June 22, 2004 I also use the Cayin TA 30 for home theater and 2 channel. Since my Denon is my home theater preamp I have the La Scalas as my left and right speakers hooked up to the TA 30 and my center speaker is the C-7 hooked up to 1 SM 70 pro 80 watts mono amp and my KLF 20s which are my rear speakers now with a RSW 12 sub. I have my NAD C542 cd player hooked up to the Denon so I can switch from 2 channel stereo to home theater with a click of a button. I have to give credit to Denon on the 4800 I have the preamp section continues to impress me! Don't get me wrong I know there are much better sounding tube preamps available that in the future I will probably dable into but I think for now I will upgrade my tube amp before I buy a tube preamp. So yes you can use a tube amp for home theater how it would sound with your solid state preamp I don't know. Xman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbsl Posted June 22, 2004 Share Posted June 22, 2004 I would like to get a real tube preamp to be able to compare the differnce between the Denon and the tube preamp but until then I will say yes to me it still has a very musical sound to it that the SM 70s did not have with the La Scalas. Now the SM 70s with the KLF 20s sounded much better. I think with Klipsch Heritage speakers you really have to match the preamp, amp, cd player or they will not sound as good as they are able. When I hook up the TA 30 to my SB3s using my old NAD cd player they sound incredible but hook the LS up to the same set up and the LS don't sound very good. Another thing I've learned going from SB3s to KLF 20s to La Scalas is that the quality of the recording on CDs makes a big difference on how the music sounds. With the SB3s a CD can sound very good but put the same CD thru the LS and it does not sound very good. Xman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shock-Late Posted June 22, 2004 Share Posted June 22, 2004 i'd say no matter the technology, it's the result that matters. I've owned quite a few amps; only one (cheap) PP tube amp I didn't like at all. Sounded "muddy". i'v been sold on low power SS amps "made in UK", Musical fidelity and the likes. I've owned pure class A amps too. And now i'm using a big Japanese high end SS amp from beginning eighties. Two years ago i would have trusted people who'd have said to me "old japanese SS amps are crap"; however now i only trust my ears. Only to say that no matter what's inside the amp; you'll know if you like it the moment you'll listen to it. there's no "miracle" recipe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted June 22, 2004 Share Posted June 22, 2004 The Cayin has no active preamp stage. Its a power amp with a passive volume control and source selector. The Cayin like almost all off shore so called integrated amps benefit greatly from a quality preamp driving them IMHO. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edwinr Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 While I am a huge tube fan, I have to admit few tube amps will do bass like solid state can. The exception to the rule would include the Audio Research range. In relation to mosfet amplifiers, I think they do have a tube like sound, smooth and easy on the ear - lacking the blare that some solid states can exhibit with horns. Sugden had a very nice mosfet amp out a few years ago called the A25. That has been discontinued but they still sell the class A A21 - very nice. Generally speaking I find the lower powered UK ss amps to be the most appealing of their type. The best and cheapest on the market is the Creek integrated range - they have a passive pre amp section matched to a high sensitivity power amp section. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 Dont agree, dont agree: You DO NOT lose most of the "tube sound" when you run tube amplifiers through a solid-state front end. The Denon cost me almost $ 2000 so it's preamp section is very good. The retail price of a name brand piece has little to do with the quality of the sound: witness the wonderful capabilities of refurbished vintage integrated tube amplifiers for a few hundred bucks! Yes, big ole horns require very different front-end equipment- Maybe it is time for bi-amplifiers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edwinr Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 I agree with you Colin that you don't lose most of the tube sound through ss pre-amps. Some hi-fi dealers get it the wrong way round. One local dealer was selling Rotel power amps with a low cost UK Audio Innovations tube pre-amp. He was promoting this as the ideal combination - tube sound backed up by ss power. He said the ss power was only amplifying the wonderful tube tonality! It's got to be the other way round if you must have ss/tube pre/power combinations. It's the tube power amp that will have much more influence over the ultimate sound reproduced by our speakers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 I've tried it both ways several times. The preamp has always carried most of the signature one way or the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Mandaville Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 "I've tried it both ways several times. The preamp has always carried most of the signature one way or the other." I think the idea that a solid state preamp will nullify tube amplification further downstream would be something that might benefit from being stated as one's personal opinion. I couldn't disagree with that notion more. I suspect, then, that one should also not connect a CD player directly to a tube amp (should that be of interest to someone) in the fear that the amp will sound like the output device on the CD player!? Things ARE NOT so simplistic as that! a system can be tuned to one's personal preference by the equipment choices one makes, and this includes using either a vacuum tube or solid state linestage into either a tube or SS amplifier. I agree that the sound may be different, but I don't agree that the use of a tube amplifier with an SS preamp suddenly no longer contributes to the overall 'voice' of a system because of the use of a transistor rather than a tube. If that were true, than why even bother with tube amplifiers in the first place???? edit: LOL! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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