Audio Flynn Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 Guy, Your comments do not relate to Danny in San Diego's issue as originally stated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Landau Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 ---------------- On 8/9/2004 10:03:29 PM Audio Flynn wrote: Guy, Your comments do not relate to Danny in San Diego's issue as originally stated. ---------------- They're related to Craig's relating to Mark's post. BTW, Flynn. just to remind you that you're not the moderator here and you don't have to read them or comment, if you don't like'em. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 ---------------- On 8/9/2004 10:05:38 PM Guy Landau wrote: ---------------- On 8/9/2004 10:03:29 PM Audio Flynn wrote: Guy, Your comments do not relate to Danny in San Diego's issue as originally stated. ---------------- They're related to Craig's relating to Mark's post. BTW, Flynn. just to remind you that you're not the moderator here and you don't have to read them or comment, if you don't like'em. ---------------- No I'm not taking things out of context your writing them out of context and also I'm not attacking other peoples gear as you are ! I have heard many SET amps now and one thing they do NOT have is authorative bass ! They do have wimpy relax bass that last forever and ever and ever you may perceive that as good bass but I do not ! You know the kind I'm talking about you can never tell when the bass note starts and stops well unless were talking a 3 piece mild jazz band then it might have nice bass. Incase your language barriar is getting in the way saying things like "especially better than these cheap vintage integrateds" is insulting a good number of people on this forum !! Think before you post please. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piranha Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 ---------------- On 8/9/2004 9:58:46 PM TBrennan wrote: Danny----Consider a DIY gain-clone, should cost about, oh, 50 to 100 bucks. One of the fellas who participates here is using the g-c that Kurt Chang made me with his Cornwalls and is floored by the thing; last time we talked he liked it much better than the tube stuff he's used which includes a rebuilt Scott and some expensive SETs, and conventional SS stuff. Several hornys of my aquaintence have thrown-over tubes and conventional SS for gain-clones, using them on Altecs, JBLs, "real" Klipsches, Supravoxes and Edgars among other things. Kurt Chang, a VERY astute DIY speakerbuilder and horny, owns a couple of tube amps including a Audio Note 300B SET and hasn't used any of them since he started building gain-clones. Doesn't use his Monarchy class A SS amps anymore either, just gain-clones and a Tri-Path. He built a 6-channel g-c to run his tri-amped JBL Pro theatre horn system; hubba-hubba. ---------------- I'd sure be willing to try a gain-clone myself at 50 to 100 bucks just to see what all the fervor is about. Can you please steer me to the right place? Thanks And I agree with Seadog. The Scott 299D sounds excellent driving Cornwalls. Plenty of bass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Landau Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 Craig, I've replaced cheap with budget and hope that no one was offended. These were designed to meet a certain price point, weren't they? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Landau Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 OK, Time for some recommendations: http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?intatube&1096906231 http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?intatube&1095626135 http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?ddampstube&1093006035&demo&3&4& Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBrennan Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 Piranha---There are lots of gain-clone websites. Kurt says forget the expensive "options" touted by some g-c cultmasters and just build the things simple. They're VERY easy to build. I know a young fella here that might build you one. Want me to ask him? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBrennan Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 Guy---Speak your mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 ---------------- On 8/9/2004 10:35:45 PM Guy Landau wrote: Craig, I've replaced cheap with budget and hope that no one was offended. These were designed to meet a certain price point, weren't they? ---------------- Yup they were built to a price point and I'd take them over a flea powered SET amp anyday of the week. Just for the record most of these integrated amps were not considered cheap or budget by any means in there day. I'm not talking heathkit and EICO here. The average Joe in 1960 couldn't touch them with a ten foot pole do you know what $200 plus was in 1960 ?? If one of these with all there features and phono section and a true ACTIVE preamp were made today they would tip the scale at well over 2K and the Iron on the vintage stuff will hang with the best made today. YOU STILL HAVEN'T HEARD ONE OF THESE THAT IS WORKING PROPERLY !! Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 ---------------- On 8/9/2004 10:48:47 PM TBrennan wrote: Guy---Speak your mind.---------------- If its like yours it keeps changing with your agenda ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Landau Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 "The average Joe in 1960 couldn't touch them with a ten foot pole do you know what $200 plus was in 1960 ?? If one of these with all there features and phono section and a true ACTIVE preamp ." Another fact - most vintage preamp suck big time. They are more of a limiting factor than a good thing. "the Iron on the vintage stuff will hang with the best made today" Still, the iron was not as good as the ones used in separate power amps. "YOU STILL HAVEN'T HEARD ONE OF THESE THAT IS WORKING PROPERLY !!" Heared and owned more than one. Didn't think that they were worth keeping since none of them was close to my Marantz 2's, Modified Leak TL10.1's, Radford STA15 or Scott 265A's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBrennan Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 Craig---My agenda? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klipschfoot Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 "...flea powered SET" A flea can jump three feet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBrennan Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 Which is why I stand four feet from Craig. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted August 10, 2004 Share Posted August 10, 2004 Okay what ever we know the amps you listed are readily available and affordable to people on this forum! Geez one would be lucky to even find them for sale. Just because you heard them and owned them does not mean they were working properly ! I have yet to see a 40 year old amp that was working anything near its potential and many of them were supposedly rebuilt previously !! I know you think if they still pass a signal it must be how they sounded when they were built back in the day or its the best that they can sound. The good old of it isn't broke don't fix it theory ! Retain that vintage sound !! Its almost laughable that anyone could believe some 45 year old piece of gear that has most likely sat dormant for half of those years could possibly be working properly its a maricle they work at all and absolutely never sound like they did in the 60s this include your Marantz , Leak or Scott 265a. It just shows how little you really know about the operation of a piece of audio gear especially vintage audio gear. You may have a fine ear and have rolled a gazzilion tubes and pieces of gear but you really need to wake up on the other aspects of this hobby. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted August 10, 2004 Share Posted August 10, 2004 ---------------- On 8/9/2004 11:34:24 PM Klipschfoot wrote: "...flea powered SET" A flea can jump three feet. ---------------- And that is how close to you speakers using a flea powered amp to enjoy well defined bass ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klipschfoot Posted August 10, 2004 Share Posted August 10, 2004 Craig, is it just me or have you mellowed over the past months? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
79 Scottsdale Posted August 10, 2004 Share Posted August 10, 2004 ---------------- On 8/9/2004 10:25:10 PM NOSValves wrote: I have heard many SET amps now and one thing they do NOT have is authorative bass ! They do have wimpy relax bass that last forever and ever and ever you may perceive that as good bass but I do not ! You know the kind I'm talking about you can never tell when the bass note starts and stops well unless were talking a 3 piece mild jazz band then it might have nice bass. Incase your language barriar is getting in the way saying things like "especially better than these cheap vintage integrateds" is insulting a good number of people on this forum !! Think before you post please. Craig ---------------- What is your definition of "authorative" bass? Perhaps distortion and overtones created by vintage, budget model integrated amplifiers that are being pushed further and further into class B operation? To you, that is authorative bass, to someone else, inaccurate reproduction or distortion. Most vintage integrated amplifiers are a compromise, which is the whole idea. Offer the consumer an "all in one" package to save space, extra equipment, etc, When a single power supply, preamp, EQ, and output stage are smashed into one package, there is sure to be degraded sound. The power supply in vintage integrateds is the weakest link in the chain, they were designed to supply adequate current only, there is no derating factor. For instance, take a look at the H.H. Scott model 299-B. You've got a power trans with an HV winding capable of not more than 150 mA. The output stage alone draws 110 mA at idle, not to mention the phono preamp, preamp, EQ, inverter stages, and three NE-2 Neon lights. There is no headroom in a model like this. 12W output, 40 -17,000 cycles, 1% THD is as good as this model gets. Push it any further and it's a distortion generator, with a sharp drop in frequency response at the ends. At 12W output, the 299-B pulls all 150 milliamps from the power supply, not good for an amplifier rated at 25W IHF. A budget model. Fact: Class A biased amplifiers are the most faithful of reproducing the input signal, almost to the point where the output "tracks" the input signal perfectly. No other class of operation reproduces music waveforms more faithfully than Class A. I would trust the bass reproduction accuracy from a *quality* SET amp over AB1 push-pull anyday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted August 10, 2004 Share Posted August 10, 2004 Ryan, That should do it I expect you will be making a new name on here once again. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piranha Posted August 10, 2004 Share Posted August 10, 2004 ---------------- On 8/9/2004 10:45:40 PM TBrennan wrote: Piranha---There are lots of gain-clone websites. Kurt says forget the expensive "options" touted by some g-c cultmasters and just build the things simple. They're VERY easy to build. I know a young fella here that might build you one. Want me to ask him? ---------------- Tom, I'd sure like to know more about them first, but I sure would appreciate you inquiring about that for me. Is this one? If so, they are spendy. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.