Beginner Tube Set Up

[franczyk]

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On 5/19/2005 11:01:46 AM garymd wrote:

IMO, don't bother with the low-end Jolidas. They don't come close to the sound of a NOSValves restored Scott 299 or 222 series.

I'm sure someone around here has a rebuilt Scott for sale. The 299b was my first tube amp and I'll never get rid of it. It just sounds too good.

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I haven't compared the Jolidas to the Scotts, but the Jolida 707 sounds terrific (probably depending on the speakers you wind up using it with.) Its probably one of their higher end models, but only costs around $1300 new. It sounds absolutely fantastic in stock form.

I've heard the Jolida 102, and while it sounds pretty good, its no where near the 707 or my Dynaco Stereo 70. With the 102, I don't think anyone would walk in to your audio room and say "damn, that stereo sound amazing". Well, they might, but it wouldnt be guaranteed like it would with a good piece of vintage equipment.

However, since you are looking to just start into tubes, I think a Scott, Eico, or Dynaco would be a really cool starting point. Better idea than the Jolida. This is why:

1) They are known to sound great. No question there. There is no way to know for sure with almost all new equipment. (is it real, or is it marketing? Only way to know for sure is to listen, and even then you might not be sure)

2) They are cheap and can be resold for what you paid.

3) You can tinker with them, if so inclined.

4) Even though you dont get a warranty, if a vintage piece breaks down, the cost to repair will almost never be as high as the depreciation on a new peice of equipment

[Istari]

I have a Scott 222(A) that NOS Valves built about a year ago. I can't believe my ears! It is simply amazing what the amp can do! I have a Rat Shack LED watt meter on it and I rarely go beyone a couple of watts into my Khorns. The 222 really got me interested in the restoration process, so much so that I've purchased a Scott 99A and a 99C and rebuilt them. It's really an easy job, but one must be careful if you put your hand inside one of the amps. Anyway I rebuilt both the 99A & C using premium parts and they both sound great! I'm using the 99C as a center channel amp in the PWK 3 channel stereo array. I pull the center channel signal from the 222 derived center channel rca output on the back of the unit. You have to try this!

[Parrot]

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On 5/19/2005 1:41:18 PM rplace wrote:

I have also found a couple for auction. Some working some not. Some with case some with out. If I want it to look "nice" do I need to find a complete one or can you get the knobs and cases if you are willing to look/wait?

I got a message out to Craig...but he is rather busy. How complete does one need to be? Since Craig replaces the caps and rebuilds the power supply I would think it would not have to work, but more or less be intact.

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Definitely get one in at least fairly decent shape. If you get a damaged amp, it may turn out to be *really* damaged and cost a lot more in parts and labor than it would have if you bought a good one to start with. Same thing cosmetically. Unless you don't care how it looks, you're going to have a lot of time and money involved in trying to make it appear decent.

[mark1101]

After having owned several Scott integrateds, and having each rebuilt by NOSValves, and also having a new Peach and VRDs, I don't know if you could find better performance bargains than rebuilding those old Scotts.

I won't sell my 299 and LK-72. Like Gary said, they just sound too good, and seem to keep sounding even better the more I use them.

The PEach and VRDs are without a doubt on a whole different level, but still those Scotts are awesome units.

One thing I don't see too many folks mention that I really appreciate, is the channal balancing controls and reverse stereo feature on those Scotts. You can isolate a single channel, play it through both speakers, go back and forth to test each channel independently. The reverse stereo feature is very useful to me since my speaker placements are not "uniform". This allows one to change emphasis from one side to the other to balance the system better.

I have suggested creating a tube powered controls module like this to Mark for his Juicy collection. I would buy it in an instant.

Old HH Scott surely knew exactly what he was doing.

[Audio Flynn]

Always get the seller to commit in writing the transformers will all work. THat is the expensive replacement item in a vintage amp.

I will never sell my LK-48 (7189 tube for output; 12 ax7 preramp and phono tube).

LK-72 (7591 output tube? I think) is the only one I do not see mentioned is the higher watt Scott kit amp.

Kit amps can be very well built or sometimes constructed outside of design paramenters.

I am not aware of a new integrated with an active preamp stage; none have a tube phono section.

TO me the tube phono section is the big benifit.

THe transformer problems I have heard have been more with Eico than Scott or Fisher. My power trnasformer needed replacement in the LK-48; but when complete it tightened up the low end anyway.

HHscott has a site that is a very nice read.

If I get to INDY this year I am bringing my LK-48 so we can hook it up to INDYKLIPSCHFAN's K Horns. The poor things have been just fed a steady diet of SS in his HT rig; he really should do some serious jail time for that infraction.

[imperfectcircle25]

"I've heard the Jolida 102, and while it sounds pretty good, its no where near the 707 or my Dynaco Stereo 70. With the 102, I don't think anyone would walk in to your audio room and say "damn, that stereo sound amazing". Well, they might, but it wouldnt be guaranteed like it would with a good piece of vintage equipment."

I think all the Jolidas are built to a similar quality its just the power output that goes up when you spend more money. Ive heard the 102 and the 302b and both were great I actually prefered the sound of the 102 if your speakers dont need the extra power it just had a sweeter sound. Something about EL84's, they just sound right.

102b=15watts=$549

302=50watt=$1100

707=60watts=$1300

As for the Vintage stuff sounding better, it might, i only have experience with a vintage Fisher 500c and its a great sounding amp. But the Jolida sounds very good, and its brand new with a waranty for only $549. I think your best off with something like this for your entry into tube audio and I think If you search all the differant audio forums you will get similar advice. Im not at all knocking vintage stuff I know it can sound great, but for a newbie I think a Jolida or ASL type of amp is the way to go. You an goto your nearest Jolida dealer and hear it before you buy which is something you usually cant do when buying a vintage amp off ebay or audiogon. My advice to you is goto your nearest dealer that sells entry level tube stuff like Jolida or Antique Sound labs and have a listen. Also check out some other forums like the one at Audiogon.com and Audioasylum.com to get some more opinions. I think the Klipsch forum has alot of vintage fans so your gonna get a bit of a biased opinion:) Happy Listening