Subwoofer short-list, which ONE???

[Mikekid]

Paul, I have owned the original version VTF-3 now for a few years. it IS indeed a very musical sub...for that matter, a great all around sub!

Just my oppinion after having listened to it for so long.........

I enjoy ALL of my subs and they are definitely keepers.

Side note:

Although TheEar may come across a bit cocky [] at times, he really is very knowledgeable and has helped me over the years with several questions I have posted. Just need to kick him in the butt once in a while to keep him in line...[]

Take care all

Mike

[Paul]

Paul, I have owned the original version VTF-3 now for a few years. it IS indeed a very musical sub...for that matter, a great all around sub!

Just my oppinion after having listened to it for so long.........

I enjoy ALL of my subs and they are definitely keepers.

Side note:

Although TheEar may come across a bit cocky [] at times, he really is very knowledgeable and has helped me over the years with several questions I have posted. Just need to kick him in the butt once in a while to keep him in line...[]

Take care all

Mike

The vtf-2 and 3 or very nice subs for music for sure,i had them for a few days test,A friend loves his vtf2 and its a keeper for him ,I also like the rsw10 i think it makes a great rear sub to fill in with a more powerful front sub.have you had any problems with your rsw10.

[Mikekid]

Paul, I added the RSW to give me that punch in the chest with music. By placing it under the end table next to my seat on the couch it does FANTASTIC at this. Worked out perfect there as it is a rear firing design too....

It really added that concert feel!

I have had it for a few months now with not a single problem, and it is doing its job most everyday.

It is now where you see that basket under the table. ( I need to take an updated picture)

Take care~

Mike

[SteelerFan]

I say RSW-15 , because I don't want get publicly spanked by Amy or Trey. Now that I've met my obligations to Klipsch on the Klipsch forum...if I had that kind of green to spend on those sub choices only, I'd go for the Revel. []

[Paul]

Paul, I added the RSW to give me that punch in the chest with music. By placing it under the end table next to my seat on the couch it does FANTASTIC at this. Worked out perfect there as it is a rear firing design too....

It really added that concert feel!

I have had it for a few months now with not a single problem, and it is doing its job most everyday.

It is now where you see that basket under the table. ( I need to take an updated picture)

Take care~

Mike

that is a perfect spot, rsw 10 is a very fine sub,I picked one up from a local guy for $700.00 becuase he had it for 2 months in a large room as a single sub ,it was to little for him so he upgraded,it was spotless and he purchased it new with the receipt of sale,So i dont think i did to bad for a rear sub for beside my couch at the rear,Sounds great as you say it gives you a pound in the chest on movies.

[Paul]

Paul, I have owned the original version VTF-3 now for a few years. it IS indeed a very musical sub...for that matter, a great all around sub!

Just my oppinion after having listened to it for so long.........

I enjoy ALL of my subs and they are definitely keepers.

Side note:

Although TheEar may come across a bit cocky [] at times, he really is very knowledgeable and has helped me over the years with several questions I have posted. Just need to kick him in the butt once in a while to keep him in line...[]

Take care all

Mike

I dont know why, but Ear tried to bite hard on me a few times, I dont know why ?,He may be a very nice person and could very well help me out with many things as other people do here and i could in return, But he may be back to patch things up.

[Spkrdctr]

Why not try the THX Super sub from Kliipsch with matching amp? Ear, have you heard one yet? I'd like to hear how it works versus the price, compared to other high end subs.

[Bob_Collins]

And the winner is..........

Paradigm Servo15 v.2!!!!!!!!!!!!

I got this sub about a month ago, and have very little time to try to work with it or calibrate it, but the little I have done, I am pretty happy with my choice. I was able to get a price I was happy with (especially since the price increase of $300 occurred earlier this year).

I also bought a Velodyne SMS-1 to use with the above sub, and am pretty happy with that unit with the little time I have used it.

The combination of these 2 should provide me with the quality and quantity of bass I was looking for in my room.

Thanks to all for their thoughts, comments, and input on my choice.

I'll be posting additionally on the SMS-1 with some comments, wish-list types of features I'd like it to have, and questions on proper use (especially with the phase settings), so be looking for those.

Thanks again, all!!!! []

[Colin]

good job Ear

let us know how the new sub works out...

[TheEAR]

I am very mild in my answers,belive that. I despise nothing more than people with poor taste who push a primitive air pump. []

Anyone looking for a refined sub that will follow them thru system upgrades should look at Paradigm's Servo 15 V2 or Velodyne DD series 15 or 18" woofer equipped subs.These do an outstanding job on ANYTHING.

If money is less of a issue,then get two of these servo subs(same model)and you will have both tremendous output and a level of subsonic control no non servo sub has.Servo control is real and is a major plus.

Why it is not implemented more,lack of know how and/or additional expense(obviously).

[DrWho]

Aren't these 3 options getting into the range of the Klipsch THX Ultra2 subs? I think they would spank the other offerings.

[TheEAR]

Aren't these 3 options getting into the range of the Klipsch THX Ultra2 subs? I think they would spank the other offerings.

Oh please,not spanking again! Studies have shown that those who were spanked as kids too often talk alot about SPANKING today. [] And apply the word SPANK to any sauce,even subwoofers!

The THX Ultra2 super dupper deluxe does not spank a larger DD series Velodyne in anything besides max output.

When it comes to linearity,distortion or subsonics quality the DD series has nothing to fear(as spanking is used,I will tak about subwoofers fearing! LOL) from any sub made at any price.

If output is by far the main factor,sure go THX Ultra2 super duper deluxe. They do pack a punch and can shake it good and clean.

[DrWho]

Well the Ultras will do 4dB more than the DD at 15Hz...they simply

displace a whole heck of a lot more air. And I would argue that it will

be more linear because there is more motor per surface area.

I would love to hear them side by side someday though. I'm sure the DD has way less group delay.

[TheEAR]

Even with a solid 6dB advantage the choice is not a clear cut. If max SPL was my or for that fact taht of many people's buying factors we would mostly go for sound reinforcement speakers.

I rather have my Contour 3.3 than my RF7's,when listening to music.Yet the RF7's can play a good deal louder,and where the difference can be heard...you will not even want to listen as hearing damage is swift.

[sunburnwilly]

Well the Ultras will do 4dB more than the DD at 15Hz...they simply displace a whole heck of a lot more air. And I would argue that it will be more linear because there is more motor per surface area.

I would love to hear them side by side someday though. I'm sure the DD has way less group delay.

I would think the DD would move more air if it was ported as well .

[Paul]

The two subs you are referring to DD and the ultra would be close call,Actly i think they would both spank each other a few times[] But I think the DD series would be top dog for clean sound.[]

[DrWho]

Well the Ultras will do

4dB more than the DD at 15Hz...they simply displace a whole heck of a

lot more air. And I would argue that it will be more linear because

there is more motor per surface area.

I would love to hear them side by side someday though. I'm sure the DD has way less group delay.

I would think the DD would move more air if it was ported as well .

Well an 18" driver has about the same surface area as dual 12" drivers

(slightly less with the dual 12's). The DD driver can only do 1.75"

peak to peak and I believe the Ultras can do 3" P-P? The tuning point

of the Ultra system is well above 15Hz (I think its 24Hz) which means

the Ultras are essentially in a sealed cabinet just like the DD at all

frequencies lower than 24Hz - which means if anything the port in the

Ultras is reducing its output at 15Hz.

Also, without modding the DD driver you would have to go to a cabinet

at least twice as big and the only advantage of porting would be a

lower tuning point - no increase in SPL. If they reworked the driver

they could go with a higher tuning poing and slightly smaller cabinet,

but now we're nowhere close to apples to apples - and you're still

displacing less air.

Nevertheless, both systems are THX Ultra 2 certified which is a freaken

insane spec to achieve (It means the output levels specified are very

low distortion).

[sunburnwilly]

DrWho

This is concerning something Roger touched on . If your processor is not Ultra 2 certified , how much does this limit an Ultra 2 sub's output ?

Thanks

[DrWho]

Well it takes X volts to achieve max power output from an amplifier and typically consumer gear requires less voltage to achieve this...and correspdondingly consumer gear generally outputs a weaker signal too. I'm not sure what the actual numbers are, but I know the input voltage for the Ultra 2 spec is considerably higher than what your typical consumer gear will output.

The end result being that you'll really have to crank the gains for the subwoofer volume and on the subwoofer amp...or use an inline mixer/transformer of some sort to boost the voltage.

At least this is what I remember from what Trey told me...I think I got it correct.

[TheSoundBroker]

Okay....did somebody mention no size limitations?

Good. This arguement is easy. Danley Labs DTS-20. Good as all the other mentioned subs are...they are not even in the same league. I ran out of range on our SPL meter (120db) at 16hz with this beast from hell...and it still had a lot more to give. That was not even optimized in the new demo space (which is still awaiting acoustic treatment). It also has technical specs that put others to shame. Distortion 20hz is in the VERY low single digits at these output levels and vanishing at the levels most people will be able to tolerate. Group delay is near zero. As long as you can live with a 7 foot tall box, there isn't anything production I've used in 26 years that even approaches this monster. Took six of us to get it near the building in the crate and four of us to get it into the room. Now THAT is a sub! Fortunately, since is is only 20" on a side...it is actually pretty easy to place. This is the first sub that K-Horns will have a hard time keeping up with.

The big SVS or Velo...you'd need 3-4 of them to try to match the output and this will still have far better specs...plus it costs less.

The Ultra 2 subs, I've set up my fair share and I have to say that they are excellent, truly excellent. Fast, detailed, deep, powerful and flexible. I'd put them up against the others mentioned. One of the most musical sub setups out there and easy to place because of the offboard amp and the size...but if you are truly looking for the Mother of all subs, the DTS-20 is the way to go. And if you are truly insane, they make bigger. MUCH bigger. 130db at 10 hz bigger if you have the space and the budget (think Military).