bodcaw boy Posted September 13, 2006 Share Posted September 13, 2006 Yes, we really need a large Tractrix horn! As originally posted, there are very few options. I would love to have that K402 and find our how this driver does 200hz for myself... I'm betting it would with no problem at all (in home audi application that is) and sounding very good doing it. I talked at length with the US importor (a pro audio guy) and expected him to laugh when I mention 200hz. His reply was should be no problem at those levels with a steep crossover. hey betterisbigger i am still trying to find out if we offer the horn without the driver. i have been in and out of town so much lately and so has the cinema guy that we have had trouble communicating. hopefully soon i will have an answer. berryboy roy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bodcaw boy Posted September 13, 2006 Share Posted September 13, 2006 That's exactly why Roy prefers to use such a insanely huge horn for the Jubilee top-end...by maintaining coverage control down into the lower registers you don't have as many corner reinforcement issues. Gotta keep the "sound bubble" moving forward away from the walls. doc, insanely huge?? why i will have you know that in my world that is a medium sized horn!! berryboy roy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BiggerIsBetter Posted September 13, 2006 Author Share Posted September 13, 2006 Thanks Roy, regardless of the answer I greatly appreciate the consideration. I have said it before, Klipsch is a great company and I am happy to be a customer whenever I can. I seem to have the opposite problem in my house. My wife is the primary instigator and keeps telling me to go ahead and stop messing around and just get the Jubilees... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 insanely huge?? why i will have you know that in my world that is a medium sized horn!! Now you've pricked my curiosity...have you actually designed bigger "tweeters"?!? [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 My wife is the primary instigator and keeps telling me to go ahead and stop messing around and just get the Jubilees... You should listen to your wife. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coytee Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 My wife is the primary instigator and keeps telling me to go ahead and stop messing around and just get the Jubilees... You should listen to your wife. Slam dunk YEAH!!! Aren't they ALWAYS right??? [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 Aren't they ALWAYS right??? Only when they push you into making outlandish audio purchases. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coytee Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 Aren't they ALWAYS right??? Only when they push you into making outlandish audio purchases. Or Bengals tickets... [{][}] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BiggerIsBetter Posted September 14, 2006 Author Share Posted September 14, 2006 At the end of the days, I still need to pay the bills. I already have too much time invested in this project and I would like to at least hear how it comes out. A great scenario would be to get the K402 horns, which would both satifsy my immediate needs AND provide the option to migrate into Jubilees Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 I understand, believe me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddy Dee Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 Aren't they ALWAYS right??? Only when they push you into making outlandish audio purchases. Now that is a fine example of a REAL woman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-MAN Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 That's exactly why Roy prefers to use such a insanely huge horn for the Jubilee top-end...by maintaining coverage control down into the lower registers you don't have as many corner reinforcement issues. Gotta keep the "sound bubble" moving forward away from the walls. Yes, but the point is that the Jubilee crosses over MUCH higher than what is being discussed (200 Hz) and look at it! Is nobody listening to me? DM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BiggerIsBetter Posted September 14, 2006 Author Share Posted September 14, 2006 I'm listening. The K402 is physically (in each dimension) as large as my room will stand. If that size horn will not effectively do 250hz, then such a low crossover to a mid driver is a no go realistically. Still, I gotta believe that we are discussing tradeoffs here. I am hoping that the benefits of getting the base bin out of reproducing voices will offset any shortcoming identified previously. I don't claim to know the absolute answer to that question, but I sure would like to be in a position to hear the tradeoffs for myself... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-MAN Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 Well, I don't think the Jubilee bass-midrange crossover point has a great deal to do with the size of the monster horn on top, at least I don't see it. A super-wide conical high frequency horn, broadcasting into a larger 90 deg. conical horn (e.g., the corner), it would seem to be more of a diffraction-reducing effort, IMO. Yes, I agree that it is associated with producing a continuous wavefront, but that it doesn't seem to have anything to do with where it crosses over with the bass horn. DM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfogg Posted September 14, 2006 Share Posted September 14, 2006 "The K402 is physically (in each dimension) as large as my room will stand." I'd love to hear that horn as well. In my case though I am fairly sure three of those horns across up front literally wouldn't fit in my room. "If that size horn will not effectively do 250hz, then such a low crossover to a mid driver is a no go realistically." I don't know about the K402 but I think Roy said it loads down to around 200hz. If you are planning on crossing near where the horn loading runs out I'd cross it steeply for extra safety. I'd cross it steeply anyway for other reasons but that is me. I did some quick measurements of an Altec MR94 which is deeper but somewhat narrower and maybe slightly less tall then the K402 and it got down to around 250 or 200hz as well. That was with an Altec 288 type driver. Something like an Altec 290 might be able to go lower still. I posted the measurements here a few months back but can't find that thread right now. Keep in mind though that pushing the crossover that low you would be getting below where the horn maintains its pattern control. Ideally you should place your crossover where the two horns dispersion patterns are roughly the same. That isn't always practical though. Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-MAN Posted September 18, 2006 Share Posted September 18, 2006 I got it, finally. Olson stated in "Acoustic Engineering" that for wavelengths SHORTER than the diameter of the horn mouth tend to follow the dispersion characteristics of the horn flare, not the mouth. The larger wavelengths follow the mouth dispersion characteristics. So the Jubilee horn is designed for wide coverage even at high frequencies, which would normally close into a "beam" determined by the flare angle of the horn sides (not the mouth). So that explains the wide conical expansion flare. Ok, makes sense now, I couldn't see why Klipsch would want such a monstrous (i.e., ZERO-WAF) horn on the Jubilee. DM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colterphoto1 Posted September 19, 2006 Share Posted September 19, 2006 there is an acceptable, MUCH smaller horn for the 2-way Jubilee, no? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted September 19, 2006 Share Posted September 19, 2006 Any number of driver/horn combinations can be used -- choices are by no means limited to what Klipsch has available. I may do this in a couple of years, and if I do I'm definitely going in a different direction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BiggerIsBetter Posted September 19, 2006 Author Share Posted September 19, 2006 "there is an acceptable, MUCH smaller horn for the 2-way Jubilee, no?" Good question, I have seen references to "smaller" horns, but don't see any in the commercial catalog. Anyone know the other options, their size, cutoff, and availability/cost? If I don't find another options, it looks like that 200hz bentwood exponential from ebay ($500) may be the only realistic wat to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seti Posted September 19, 2006 Share Posted September 19, 2006 Can't remember what the drivers etc are but they are in one of the many Jubilee threads from last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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