Upgrading entire home theater - RF-7s - > RF-83, etc

[Malice]

I purchased and installed a Home Theatre in a house that I just sold which included all the equipment in the sale:<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

Sharp XV-Z9000U

92" Da-Lite Cinema Contour Screen

Denon AVR-3200

Denon DVD-2900

2 Klipsch RF-7

2 Klipsch RSS-7

1 Klipsch RC-3

1 Velodyne CT-100

In my new house the theater room is 16' x 24'. I would like to purchase about the same caliber of equipment as the last (or a little better) and I am considering:

Sharp XV-Z12000MKII

106" Da-Lite Cinema Contour Screen

Denon AVR-3806

Denon DVD-1930

2 Klipsch RF-83

4 Klipsch RS-62

1 Klipsch RC-62

1 Klipsch RW-12

One thing I noticed about the old theater setup was, the RC-3 center channel was not beefy enough to play with the 7 series fronts and surrounds. I am slightly concerned that this will happen with the new setup I am pondering despite what all the salespeople tell me. They assure me that all the Klipsch speakers are matched and the RF83s, RS-62s, RC-62, and the RW-12 should all sound great together and there isn't really a group of speakers I should buy together to sound match them the best. I see on Klipsch's site that they have a recommended system which includes the RF-83s, the RS-62s, RC-64, and RT-12d. Can I get away with the setup I was thinking about above or should I get the RC-64s and RT-12d? How much difference is it going to make? Sadly, there is no place near me to demo the RF-83, RS-62, RT-12d or I would just figure this out myself...

Thanks for any help you can provide,

-John

[wuzzzer]

Considering the total dollar amount you're already planning on spending on the system, you should probably go with the RC-64.

[Jay481985]

the rc64 has the same horn as the 83....

[Catharsis147]

RC-64, no question. You could possibly regret the RC-62 purchase in the future and end up buying an RC-64 to match the RF-83's, so why buy two center channels when you can just buy one? Also, if the RC-62 and -64 difference is similar to the RC-35 and RC-7 difference, than I wouldn't even think of the RC-62. The RC-35 was not even in the same league as the RC-7 and you noticed it immediately when driving other speakers like the RF-7's or RB-75's. Since the center channel is really important for movies, stick with the RC-64 if only so you do not end up feeling upgradeitis in the future.

[PhilMays]

Yea, The rc-3 was a little "tinny" for me with my 7's. The best upgrade I did for HT was going to an RC-7, so, I think the gang is right on target with the RC-64 reccomendation.

Phil

[RM1111]

Get the RC 64 to match the fronts for sure, also get the rt-12d to match also if you have the extra cash. You might consider the rt-10d if money is an issue. and I agree to the center channel is the most important part for the home theater system.

[psg]

In my new house the theater room is 16' x 24'.

Dare I say it? That's a nice size room for... Klipschorns on the long wall.

[6]

[TheEAR]

You should NEVER EVER try to scavenge on the center channel.It is THE most important speaker in a HT setup. WIth RF7's you buy an RC7 and nothing else.

With RF83's you get the best R series center Klipsch makes,getting anything smaller is not money saved ,you compromise the overall quality.

Same as with my Dynes I did not get a Contour Center ...I went for the Center S CX.May cost more but is 100% worth the additional expense.

[damonrpayne]

Buy the better center John. I'll come over if you need help.

[damonrpayne]

By the way, I have the denon dvd-1930 if you'd like to see/hear it before you buy that one. I'm very pleased with it for the price.

[Malice]

Thanks to everyone who responded so quickly with comments about getting the RC-64s instead. I sincerely appreciate the heads up on that before I made the same mistake that I made with the last system. I went ahead and got everything listed above except I did get the RC-64 instead of the RC-62.

As far as the sub goes, if I feel like I do not have enough punch with the RW-12d, couldn't I just split the signal add another RW-12d? How much really goes on from 19-24Hz?

Thanks for the offer Damon. I will probably take you up on that. It sounds like everything should be coming in about 3 weeks.

Thanks,
-John

[damonrpayne]

You could also look into a pair of the THX subs, but I suspect the 12d should do well in that room, its 7 or 8 foot ceilings if I remember?

[Jay481985]

one thing with the rw12d by adding another it will make it louder but it won't make it go much more deeper. The rt12d was designed to go deeper than the rw12d.

[JetJockey]

Hi all, i am a newb here, just purchased my first Klipsch Speaker a few weeks ago (RC-62). All i have to say is holy crap! I am sold on klipsch and am now going to retire my Mirage OM260 to rear channel duties where I think it will do a much better job. I am now planning on getting the RF-83 to rock my HT and will see how the RC62 works with them, if required i will upgrade to RC64...drooling...LOL. I have a Yammy RXV 2500 and wondering if i will need a good 3 channel amp to do duty with those badboys? Thinking of an Anthem MCA30, would like at least 180 RMS per channel, any suggestions? And no i don't mean bryston sst6b, yikes, money!

[DrWho]

I would without a doubt go with the RT-12d over the RW-12d.

For starters, the RT has way more displacement. Keep in mind that with

the +-3dB specifications that the speaker is 6dB down at the lower

number. These subs are rolling off at around 24dB/octave so the RW will

be around 12dB down at 20Hz versus 16Hz for the RT. The subs of course

are anticipating extra gains down low as a result of the pressure

loading of the room.

I ran the numbers and your room is going to start adding 12dB/octave

starting at 24Hz. The RT should be 3dB down at 15Hz and the RW at 22Hz.

You're talking nearly an octave deeper. Is this low extension

necessary? Well it is definetly a very heated conversation, but I will

mention that you will probably be surprised by the amount of sub 20Hz

information found on normal music CD's - let alone movies. It can never

hurt to have deeper extension.

Extension isn't everything though - the RT will go significantly louder

than the RW. 120dB peak versus 116dB. It may not look like much, but

that's a big deal. Instead of looking at raw SPL (I doubt you'll ever

be drawing 120dB), I like to describe it as the RT will have 4dB less

distortion for the same SPL. The descrease in distortion is further

achieved by the implementation of Passive Radiators - which don't have

the same compression and chuffing issues as ports.

And there is yet one more thing going for the RT over the RW - the

Adaptive Room Correction (ARC). I'll go ahead and attach the modal

distribution of your room at the bottom of the thread, but since your

dimensions are multiples of each other (8x16x24) you are going to have

some very nasty modal issues - especially at 70Hz. A mode is just a

fancy term for standing wave, so depending on where you sit in the room

you will hear nothing or a lot of output at a particular frequency. The

jagged response can make a room sound both boomy and lacking in bass at

the same time (depending on the music). All that to say, the room

itself dictates the performance of low notes more than the sub itself.

Klipsch has taken this into account and implemented some fancy digital

signal processing to help alleviate some of these acoustical issues

without requiring extensive acoustical treatment. I totally believe

acoustical treatment is absolutely required, but many people can't

accept the aesthetics, which makes these band-aid approaches very

worthwhile. As you can imagine, the RW lineup does not have the ARC.

So all that to say...if you can afford it, then I would very highly

recommend the RT-12d over the RW-12d. Even two RW-12d's will not match

a single RT-12d. But that is also why the RT lists for more than double

the RW. It really is that much better.

Happy hunting and welcome to the forum!

[Jay481985]

wait, passive radiators are 24db per octave but the port is 18 db per octave no?

[Malice]

I went ahead and ordered the RT-12d after considering everyone's comments. It just makes sense and it completes Klipsch's "recommended set" so I have to assume that means something.

The dimensions of the room are a little goofy. This diagram is no where near to scale.

I am going to mount the screen on the 16' 7" (199 inch) wall.
The ceiling is 7'1" (85 inches).
From the sceen to the back wall is 24'10" (this will change as I need to build a wall ~18 inches off of the 16'7" wall, effectively making the depth 23'4" (~280 inches)).
The 2'5" x 8'11" space on the right bottom of the picture is where I am building shelves for the components and DVDs.
I am mounting the rear speakers on the 7'4" wall.

Any comments or suggestions are appreciated.

-John