Which amp would you get?

[tech73x]

I am in the market for an amp and I have narrowed it to 2 brands. I like the Outlaw 7700 and the Sunfire TGA 7200, the only big factor right now is the shear weight of the Outlaw, Man, that thing is a chunk of lead . I have read the reviews on both and read posts here, avs forums and audioholics. Could some owners chime in on what they think. Thanks

[Guest " "]

Glass shelves?

[jamesV]

I would say the Outlaw, only because I had the 7100 and currently have the 750. I did hear a different between the two and can only imagine what 200 watts going thru my setup would sound like. So I guess my opinion is really one sided.

I have heard about the Sunfire products and have never heard a bad thing about them.

James

[tech73x]

Yeah, I have tempered glass shelves. The middle one where it would sit is rated at 100 pounds, but I dont know if I want to test that . To be honest that is what stood out with the Sunfire is the low weight and there downconverter technology. Hmmmm, I was looking at the B&K also but it also weighs in at about 80 pounds. I just love decisions

[mas]

3 or 4 Crown XTi 1000s @ $389 +$29 shipping (Total $1167 or $1556 + shipping versus $2149 + shipping) http://www.ugotadeal.com/product_info.php?products_id=2611?ref=froogle .

http://www.crownaudio.com/amp_htm/xti.htm

275W /ch 8ohms; 500W/ch 4ohms, 700W 2ohms

And no problem with weight @ 18.5 pounds each.

Independent power supplies and duty cycle robustness for days.

Of course, if you like, you could get XTi 2000's@ 475W/ch 8ohms, 800W/ch 4ohms. 100W 2ohms instead ...and still have cash to spare.

And while some are talking about loads, NONE of them handle the loads this does with EASE!

And a shared power supply for the multi-channel amps? Yup, a recipe for success...NOT!

And its American made.

The Crowns kick every alternative mentioned in every category without any effort.

And I doubt the proportional fans will ever activate driving Klipsch - and even if they did, the proportional control would be a very slow rev..

And for what its worth, none of the alternatives would ever be subjected to the loads routinely encountered in a Pro environment. Crown eats them for breakfast.

XTi Series Minimum Guaranteed Power, 1 kHz XTi 1000 XTi 2000 XTi 4000 Per channel, both channels driven Stereo, 2 ohms (per ch.) Stereo, 4 ohms (per ch.) Stereo, 8 ohms (per ch.) Bridge-Mono, 4 ohms Bridge-Mono, 8 ohms 700W** 500W* 275W* 1400W** 1000W* 1000W** 800W* 475W* 2000W** 1600W* 1600W** 1200W* 650W* 3200W** 2400W* *With 0.5% THD. **With 1% THD. The XTi Series of Crown amplifiers are professional tools designed and built for portable PA applications. The series includes three models which are identical except for output power: XTi 1000, 2000 and 4000. All are rugged and lightweight, and offer unmatched value in their class. Integrated proprietary DSP with LCD front panel display Accurate, uncolored sound with very low distortion for the best in music and voice reproduction Advanced protection circuitry guards against: shorted outputs, open circuits, DC, mismatched loads, general overheating, high-frequency overloads and internal faults Extremely versatile, handling a wide range of speaker impedances and outputs Switch-mode universal power supply Speaker presets for crossover frequencies, EQ, limiting, and delay All products fill 2U rack spaces and weigh under 17 pounds; weight sets a new standard in lightweight amps (20% less) Speakon® and binding post outputs, XLR inputs and loop-thrus Comprehensive LED status per channel Three-Year, No-Fault, Fully Transferable Warranty completely protects your investment and guarantees its specifications For product availability and pricing please contact your local dealer.

Specifications {Note: These specs are worst case limits that the units are guaranteed to exceed }

Sensitivity (volts RMS) for full rated power at 4 ohms	1.4V
Frequency Response (at 1 watt into 4 ohms, 20Hz - 20 kHz)	+0/–1 dB
Signal to Noise Ratio (below rated 1 kHz power at 8 ohms), A-weighted	100 dB
Damping Factor (8 ohm): 20 Hz to 400 Hz	> 500
Input Stage	Input is electronically balanced and employs precision 1% resistors.
AC Line Current	XTi 1000: 6.5A, XTi 2000: 6.9A, XTi 4000: 8.0A. At idle: Draws no more than 90 watts.
Crosstalk (below rated power) 20 Hz to 1 kHz	> 70 dB
Input Impedance (nominal)	20 kilohms balanced, 10 kilohms unbalanced
Load impedance (note: safe with all types of loads) Stereo Bridge mono	2-8 ohms 4-16 ohms
Voltage Gain (at 1 kHz, 8 ohm rated output)	XTi 1000: 30.5 dB. XTi 2000: 32.9 dB. XTi 4000: 34.2 dB
Maximum Input Signal	+22 dBu typical
Operating Temperature	0° C to 40° C at 95% relative humidity (non-condensing)
AC Line Voltage and Frequency Configurations Available (± 10%)	100V, 120V, 220-240V 50/60 Hz
Ventilation	Flow-through ventilation from front to back
Cooling	Heat sinks and proportional-speed fan
Dimensions: Width, Height, Depth (behind mounting surface)	EIA Standard 19 in. W (EIA RS-310- x 3.5 in. (8.9 cm) H x12.25 in. (31.1cm) D
Net Weight, Shipping Weight	18.5 lb (8.4 kg), 21.5 lb (9.8 kg)

[Arky]

I prefer pro amps also, in my case QSC.

[PYRO]

I am looking at new amps as well. Have you considered a B & K 200.7 S2? About the same cost as the sunfire.

[MrMcGoo]

The strength of the Sunfire is that it puts out good power while it runs quite cool without a fan. The low weight is a plus as well, given the power. It also hasa good signal to noise ratio. Its only weaknesses are price and the unknown quality of the new manufacturer in Chona.

Bill

[tech73x]

Yeah, I have been looking at the 200.7 also, It looks like a very solid amp. When did Sunfire stop making amps in the United States? I wished we had someone where I lived that had high end gear so I could listen and evaluate. I really appreciate all the help and opinions

[merkin]

I have the TGA 74400. It is stone quiet with my forte II's. I use regular interconects and didn't even bother to get the balanced connections. Haven't heard the others but I like my TGA.

[IndyKlipschFan]

I have the 200 x 7 Sunfire Amp.. 7200

Extremely happy, VERY dynamic, and have no problem at all recommending it.

The good thing with the Sunfire to Klipsch, too, is it will handle loads that might crush other amps and run all day at considerable SPL's with no damage to the amp as well. What specifically do you want to know?

Is it quiet? Yes

Runs warm but will never over heat? Yes

Does it have no problem with complex dynamics going from a silent hush to all out crescendos creating a realism like your there? Yes

Most every amp out there has something in it from China... Not so sure everything at this level it is 100% made, manufactured, and or tested in China.. Just be careful of rumors... People love to knock something they do not have.. Can't afford, or do not personally like for whatever reason too. The amp is solid for sure. at 200 or 400 WPC I can't imagine you need much more?

Like McIntosh... They seem to hold their value very well, and you do not see 100's of them for sale on the used market.. THAT should tell you something! Good Value and last forever..

Hope this helps.

[tech73x]

Thank you, that was very informative and helpful. You made some very good points about every amp having something from china. I would have to say that the sunfire is looking like the one I will get after all the comments and all of the discussions I have been reading. Thank you very much for taking time to help me with this decision,

[PYRO]

tech73x,

I have a Rotel RMB-1095 for Sale in the garage. Checkout "Rotel for Sale."

[tech73x]

Man, that would be a good deal Pyro. Im trying to run 7.1 though, does Rotel make a 2 channel 200 watt for the rear surrounds? If so that might work for me, I know that Rotel makes damn fine amplifiers.

[PYRO]

Rotel RB-1080 is a two channel. It would go nicely with the RMB-1095. I would use the RB-1080 for your mains.

[theplummer]

I had forgotten the very best thing about the Sunfire until recently. We are trying to sell our home, and the realtor insisted that I remove my Chorus, Forte II, Academy HT setup in the living room (She said something about CLUTTER). So, I moved them out and packed up the Sunfire, and decided to get out the old ADCOM GFA-6000 and ADCOM GTP-555, paired with Heresy II's, no center, and no surrounds. This is disappointing to say the least, but more importantly, the GFA-6000 gets SO HOT it makes the video portion of GTP fail regularly, as I have them in the same cabinet, I have to leave the glass door open to prevent the overheating problem. This occurrs even when the amp is at an idle.

The Sunfire NEVER gets Hot not even luke warm, even when packing the watts on all five channels.

Man, I can't wait till I can get back to normal.

[tech73x]

Hey Pyro, I am considering your Rotel and looking into a 1080 also. I am kicking around the idea of these 2 now with a seperate amp rack or the sunfire. Ill let you know soon as to which way I am going. Thanks

[tech73x]

One last question for the masses. Since I have the RF series and it shows 125watts max RMS, will it be safe to push 200 to them? I know Klipsch's can handle alot of power, just making sure. Thanks again

[mas]

If I understand you correctly, if your speakers are rated at 125W max RMS is is OK to drive them with 200W ?

What part of 125w MAX isn't clear? []

On the other hand, you can use an amp rated at 200W to drive speakers rated at 125W max by utilizing the gain control and not exceeding the rating of the speakers with the benefit of additiional headroom avoiding non-linear operation (clipping/distortion) of the amp that is harmful to the speakers just as is the exceeding of rated power..

[IndyKlipschFan]

What MAS said... hehehe

Always better to have the recommended power or MORE clean power than needed... Just don't max it all out and expect your speakers to handle it... (For long!)

So yes, you will be fine!