Travis In Austin

As far as the timing, you are wrong. NASA would have had men on Mars in the mid-80s, at the very latest, if they had gotten the funding they asked for year after year. If you want the source for that I would be happy to post that when I get back home.

I will try to give you some reason. First, my information about who does what at SpaceX has mostly come from reading Elon Musk: Tesla, SpaceX, and the Quest for a Fantastic Future by by Ashlee Vance, an Esquire article from about five years ago (I will see if I can find it) and, my faithful weekly cover-to-cover read of Aviation Week and Space Technology (subscriber since 1976). First, there is no question that Musk is a renaissance man in the quattrocento sense of the word. He can look at a major undertaking, like a new car company, or getting into the business of being a private contractor for space launches, with private rockets, and determine whether there are opportunities for profitability. Those are major achievements in and of themselves. Put another way, Mueller would never have had the opportunity to do what he is doing if it were not for someone like Elon Musk. My point is that he is not a rocket scientist, nor does he claim to be. He found his steely-eyed missile man, Mueller. You know the story of how this thing got started. In about 2000 Elon had an idea of sending a mouse or a plant to Mars. That's it. He gets the aerospace consultant Jim Cantrell who worked on mars mission-related projects his entire career before going into consulting. Cantrell puts Musk in touch with Arianspace to purchase engines, and they want too much. They think they can get a great deal on Russian rockets and he makes a couple of trips to Russia to buy their engines (ICBMs actually),. Russia screws him around and on the flight back he says they can build their own engines. Musk finds Mueller who he credits for giving him the background information on how to reduce launch costs by a factor of 5, and eventually 10. He then decides to get into the space launch business, Mueller is credited by Musk and SpaceX as a "Co-founder" of the company. As for who is doing what and how, the book and magazine article are pretty clear that Elon has in his mind how to do it all faster and cheaper, and is thinking about two or three projects ahead while people like Mueller are executing on the first project. Some other things to consider. All of the SpaceX patents are related to propulsion. They are all in Mueller's name. Elon Musk has patents, none are related to aerospace, most are related to Tesla such as the car emblem and the charging connector. When you look at the official SpaceX Youtube channel, the discussion on propulsion (video below) the presentation is by Mueller, who starts video by saying he is the "Co-founder and VP of Propulsion for SpaceX" and proceeds to take you on a pretty cool tour of the McGregor, TX test facility. There is too much bullshit, not so much from you, from others to go through it all regarding the history of NASA's manned Mars mission planning, how they are funded, how they execute projects, etc. to try and answer it all. I will post some resources for people to read if they really want to understand it, but Dave, you and I know there is a lot of crap in this thread about NASA that doesn't bear any relationship to reality as the way things really were between 1960 and 2000 in connection with NASA's efforts to try and get funding for a manned mission to Mars. Enjoy this video, if you like this I will post the transcript of Mueller speaking to an astronomy club on propulsion, working for Elon, etc. from this year that is quite fascinating.

Ain't it the truth. "Fly me to the moon . . , Jupiter and Mars." Frank SInatra demands it.

Let me what I can do to help you sort through it. What leading rocket scientist laid out a feasibility study for going to Mars and when. What was total cost of development going to moon in today's dollars? What percent of total budget did NASA receive during Apollo. When did NASA make a proposal to go to Mars? Who killed it and when? What is NASA current budget? As a percentage of total Federal budget? How much did the F22 and F35 cost to develop, and how long? What makes rockets fly? To paraphrase, It funding. The Rocket Equation has remained the same since the early 1900s, It isn't going to change unless you develop thrust from a source that doesn't burn up mass as you fly. (Which NASA developed and proposed for.second and 3rd stage rockets in original Mars.propisal). I guess I'm the one who is confused. Who was it that directed NASA or approved NASA sending people to Mars and NASA failed to hit bench marks or milestones? I assume that is what you are basing your time line on?

There seems to be a Myth, or misconception, that NASA isn't in the space business any more. They launch missions every year, 4 are schedule for next month, six already scheduled for next year including another trip to Mars. There is a lot of big time bullshit in this thread, from every side. It is like you guys have completely forgot how government funding, contracts and project management work. For starters NASA doesn't build anything, they either spec out, pay for design competition, or (most commonly with their modern model) they joint venture with private enterprise. They are doing this with both SpaceX and Orbital ATX on the contract to resupply of ISS. The Commercial Crew program (manned space flight to/from ISS) was awarded to Boeing and SpaceX. They are on track and manned tests are scheduled for next summer with the Boeing Starliner and SpaceX Dragon 2 capsules. The program was initiated by NASA, administered by NASA and development funding was provided by NASA. If SpaceX doesn't get certified in that program they will have serious problems. Forget Mars. NASA is moving forward with components of the mission to Mars. The Space Launch System (which will be more powerful than the Saturn V) is being built by Boeing with Orbital ATX. Aero Rocketdyne performed another rocket engine test just last week on the engine which is Helium/LOX. Elon Musk is a genius, but not a rocket genius. He is a business genius who saw opportunity in government and military contracts for space exploration by being more competitive and grabbing a real rocket genius, Tom Mueller. He has taken rocket engine technology to a new level and has exceeded thrust to weight ratios of 150/1. He is working on Methalox engines and if he can perfect those the BFR will be a reality to Mars. He will leapfrog the others because you can resupply the fuel (methane) from the atmosphere on Mars. For short hops my money is on Sierra Nevada Corporation and their Dream Chaser. They have been awarded a half dozen flights to resupply ISS in Phase 2 of that NASA program. Dream Chaser was developed with NASA money. SpaceX and Orbital and United Space Alliance exist because of NASA, not in spite of it. I think Elon was a genius in seeing the opportunity to fill the need for private spacecraft and launch vehicles. He has reduced the cost of a launch, so far, by over half. This revolutionized the business and funding models of American aerospace. Next year is a big year. Who will be certified for human flight, and when? Travis

They have missed a ton. I haven't even seen a Who Song or a Blue Cheer song yet, two of loudest bands of all time.

REO Speedwagon, RWC I used to play all the time in laye.70s and.loud. I over played It, can't even look at it anymore

Those look great.

Yes, but there's a rule, you can't ******* about the food. You don't like it don't eat it.

That another thing agree 100% with.

I agree 100% with all of that. I would add that a more complete analogy is that it is a family that has been invited to another family's house for a swim and barbeque and as you walk in the house it clearly says "No cussing, no spitting, don't pee in the pool, and absolutely no politics at the dinner table." Travis

You're right.

Here is the full broadcast of the hit. Vin at his best. Says nothing and let's crowd reaction speak for itself. Towards the end of the clip they show the stands and they look pretty full to me, and Sully says "they don't want to leave."

I saw both Willy's play, but at Candlestick (which isn't in The City).

Marine Land of the Pacific, anyone remember that?

Same in LA you are raised to hate the Giants and (then) the 49ers. We lived in Bay Area, and LA area growing up. Started going go games when we were living in LA so Dodger and former Rams fan. When we moved back to Bar Area it was easier to be an A's and Raider fan. The heyday of both of those teams.

You left out the part where I said they are different. The Klipsch employee participation on private Klipsch Owners page is almost daily, in part because you have new people asking new questions about Klipsch products. Where the forum excels is having categories (sub-forums) and subcategories. It is also searchable. FB OTOH is a "live" stream, the posts can vary widely by topic.

I was talking about Facebook reducing posts on Forum. There is a Klipsch Fan Facebook page, it has many members from here, it has brought new members here. It has Klipsch employees who have joined who post there but not here, here but not there. The Klipsh owners FB pahe has over 4,000 members. I think it is only a year.old. It is very much like the forum in the early days,.photos of new speakers, I just bought this or that. Very little "you have heard anything until you have heard [fill in the blank]." I'm in there about once a week. I have yet to see a political comment. The official Klipsch site has over 400,000 followers. Dave @Mallette mentioned at a very early stage of the Museum planning that you have to be on.FB to be relevant and he was astounded at the response he had gotten in short. order.with his development of the RMHC. It is a different way of communicating then the Forum, and there is overlap.

I would have thought Twitter and Facebook might effect that too, but we.have seen this with both the Museum and Klipsch Fan facebook pages, they compliment with the Forum. It is completely counterintuitive.

Welcome to the forum! Glad to have you. I don't think it is so much a place to swear as a place they can yell ldiscuss) at each other about politics which most certainly doesn't belong here.

Is 84 still there?

“There is no present or future-only the past, happening over and over again-now.” ― Eugene O'Neill, A Moon for the Misbegotten

No cola, no ice tea?

As Dr. JC was saying, it looks like it really varies from individual to individual as to what kind of stone you may be likely to produce, and thus what to do to prevent having a first one, or a second one, really requires the advice of a doctor on a case by case basis, but here are some general guidelines. Plenty of water, citric acid in diet, avoid cola. Looks like all of that unsweetened tea, even with fresh squeezed lemon, is bad. I wonder if all tea is bad? If over 50 need calcium, and plenty of Vitamin D for body to absorb it. https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/5-steps-for-preventing-kidney-stones-201310046721