ColaBear

Agree with you guys, not such thing as "break-in". I have seen some really wild claims on a few other sites. I believe it is really your ears becoming acccustomed to the new speakers. ------------------ KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 side surrounds KG 3.5 rear surrounds KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC100 DSS/HDTV Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain

I had a chance to listen to the RF7s as well. Used the exact same music that I auditioned my KLF30s with. The CD is "Jazz at the Pawnshop". Anyway, the detail, especally in the midrange is lacking in the RF7s. I listened to then for a good hour, using the same receiver I use, Denon AVR5800. The sound just isn't as live on the RF7s as on the KLF30s. ------------------ KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 side surrounds KG 3.5 rear surrounds KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC100 DSS/HDTV Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain

FE, I am in the direct radiating speaker camp. Since the channel is a full range channel, why not use speakers as capable as your mains. I originally had my speakers set up several feet behind my listening area. I then moved them to the sides per Dolby Lab site and a recommendation from a fellow Legend owner. Big difference in sound and effects. I must add that I do have a rather large room. The side surrounds are about 12 feet from the center of my listening area. I tried the WDST, but didn't care for it....sounded kind of thin. But there are many on theis site that favor the KSP-S6 as the best way to do surrounds, both side and rear. Hope this helped! ------------------ KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 side surrounds KG 3.5 rear surrounds KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC100 DSS/HDTV Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain

I am surprised that so many people place the side surrounds BEHIND their seating area. Both at the dolby site and any Dolby theatre you go to, they have the side surrounds on the sides of the theatre. I am a huge supporter/fan of direct radiating speakers over WDST or dipole. The sound engineers have the sound coming directly at you from the sides. They don't bounce it around. But that is just my humble opinion and two cents worth. Experimentation and your ears should be the ultimate judge. Good luck and enjoy! ------------------ KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 side surrounds KG 3.5 rear surrounds KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC100 DSS/HDTV Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain

Olaf, If you are still looking to Yamaha, I can offer you a very good deal on a DSP-A1. I purchased it brand new back in November 1998 along with the the TX-950 Tuner. I used it all of a few months, as I purchased a Denon AVR-5700. Call me crazy, but I replaced the 5700 with a 5800. I still have both units sitting around. I would be willing to part with the DSP-A1 if you or any of the others on this BB are interested. Email me. ------------------ KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 side surrounds KG 3.5 rear surrounds KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC100 DSS/HDTV Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain

Hey Guys, I guess the front effects thing is a personal taste issue as is DSP. I tried a Yamaha DSP-A1 for a few months (still have it sitting in a box my closet). Granted, I was using KSB 1.1s, but I didn't really care for the way it augmented the sound stage. ------------------ KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 side surrounds KG 3.5 rear surrounds KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC100 DSS/HDTV Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain

Why are all of the speakers infront of the main listening area? If your picture is accurate to placement, then I don't see the benfit of even having surrounds. ------------------ KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 side surrounds KG 3.5 rear surrounds KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC100 DSS/HDTV Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain

Hey Brett, I have been a DirecTv subscriber for five years in the Detroit Metro area. Nothing but great things to say about their service/support. The locals come in great, but the best way to watch them is from their HD feeds (M*A*S*H never looked so good). Make sure you get RF Receivers so you can avoid having a receiver in each room. Locally I have heard that Walmart sells receivers very cheap. As far as PVR, I use a DirecTv/Tivo box on my everyday system and am perfectly happy with it. If you have any other questions, email me at mark@colabear.com. ------------------ KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 side surrounds KG 3.5 rear surrounds KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC100 DSS/HDTV Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain

Mr. Blorry, I was in the same situation as you were just before Christmas this year. I was using a pair of KG 3.5 for surrounds with my 30s/C7 mains. Then tried a pair of those scarce S6s, they were ok, but still lacked some IMHO. Read a few posts from here about going with another set of 30s as surrounds. WOW!!!!! I won't be changing THAT anytime soon. I may even get crazy and buy another pair of 30s for rear surrounds (that is where the KG3.5s ended up). If I go that route, I will move my KSW200 to the rear with the new 30s and get a KSW15 for the main sub. Bottom line is .... go with a matched speaker for your surrounds, I personally feel it makes a big difference. ------------------ KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 side surrounds KG 3.5 rear surrounds KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC100 DSS/HDTV Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain This message has been edited by ColaBear on 06-22-2001 at 10:47 AM

boa, I just re-read my post. Darned if I couldn't find the word "expert" anywhere in it. Just an opinion based on what my own eyes and ears have experienced . I use a cable modem for internet access currently. Can't get a better interenet experience than that. Many of the PPV movies on DBS are dolby digital, while others are both letter boxed and dolby digital. Interactive TV .... hmmm ... I'll stick with my PC for internet stuff. Great trading remarks and experiences with you though!

WOW! For a minute there I thought I had wondered into a beginners forum on Digital Media. Now I don't want to get off on a rant here, but ... Digital Cable DOES NOT.... I repeat DOES NOT give you better picture/sound quality than DBS nor do I think it is a close comparison. It kind of made me think of a conversation I overheard at Blockbuster while looking for some DVDs to rent. A patron actually said "There isn't any difference in picture quality when you compare DVD with VHS". I did a side by side in my house very recently, DBS won hands down. Several of my friends went with Digital Cable, then switched to either Dish or DirecTv. I have had DirecTv for at least four years now. The picture is much better than digital cable is now or may ever hope to be. With a high resolution TV you WILL notice the difference. That's just my opinion. Are there any other DBS users here who have done the same comparison? ------------------ KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 surrounds KG -3.5 rear effects KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC100 DSS/HDTV Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain

I use APC UPSes (SmartUPS 500) on all my home theatre and computer gear. Our power company tends to interrupt power at 30 second intervals on occasion. They have worked very well, including during some very heavy storms whne power also tends to flicker. ------------------ KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 surrounds KG -3.5 rear effects KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC100 DSS/HDTV Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain

Avman, I can whole heartedly agree with you. I have a 100" screen with a Vidikron LCD Projector. I am a DirecTv subscriber, movies are awesome. DVD looks even better, the Ben Hur chariot is something to behold. Also, my DirecTv receiver is HD capable. The Super Bowl, Masters and the Final Four are a great way to watch sports! Plus CBS broadcasts much of it's Prime Time lineup in HD, plus if you're a College Football fan, CBS is broadcasting the games in HD! If you have any questions, feel free to fire away. You can see the rest of my system in my signature. ------------------ KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 surrounds KG -3.5 rear effects KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC100 DSS/HDTV Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain This message has been edited by ColaBear on 06-12-2001 at 03:01 PM

I am planning on adding two more KLF30s and a sub. the 30s will replace my rear surrounds (currently KG 3.5s). Other than that I am pretty much set. I am subscribing to the six identical mains speaker theory for 6.1/7.1. I felt I just couldn't let HornEd be the only guy with a KLF30 six-pak. ------------------ KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 surrounds KG -3.5 rear effects KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC1000 Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain

HornEd, I just got back from my local Klipsch dealer. We talked about a second sub as well. If/when I take the plunge, looks like the KSW200 gets moved behind the couch and it will run the rear KLF30s. Then I will get a KSW-15 and put it up front. ------------------ KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 surrounds KG -3.5 rear effects KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC1000 Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain

HornEd, Thanks for the fast response. Unforunately that one corner has an equipment rack in it (forgot to put it in the drawing). To address the front effects comment. I tried a DSP-A1 (which I still have) but didn't care for the use of those speakers. I used SB1s, mounted outside of the KLF30s. I may just do your suggestion of the a third set of KLF30s even with the back wall. Do you think they should be toed-in a touch also? Also thinking of another sub, but not sure where to go with it. The main speakers location is only about 6 inches off the edge of the screen, so I am set there (was tough to make that placement to scale). Also, my center, a KLF-C7 is mounted directly below the screen. It is about 16" off the floor and tilted up towards the listening area. I guess I have it aimed correctly as the dialog appears to come from the middle of the screen. Ironically, I did purchase an SPL meter from Radio Shack. The part that just about floored me was that I only needed to tweak the left surround's volume up +1. All the others were "dead on". Scary, I know. Any other suggestions/comments are alsways appreciated. ------------------ KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 surrounds KG -3.5 rear effects KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC1000 Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain

HornEd, I too use KLF30s as side surrounds and couldn't be happier. My side 30s are about 12 feet from my listening "sweet spot". This possibly changes how they handle the ambient aspects of DVD movies. I tried a pair of KSP-S6s and really couldn't find any adavantage in ambient aspects. My theatre has a rather odd configuration, but offers incredible sound. I would like to replace my KG 3.5s with another pair of KLF30s but am not sure how I would position them. I am attaching a .JPG of my theatre. Any help you can offer would be appreciated. Either answer back here or email me direct, mark@colabear.com. Thanks! ------------------ KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 surrounds KG -3.5 rear effects KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC1000 Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain

HornEd Are you actually using EIGHT speakers (not counting subs) to do 7.1? I was looking at your signature and was curious. I too am using KLF30s as surrounds and really love their performance over a WDST speaker. Also, my surrounds are set wider apart then my front mains are. Again, couldn't be happier! I'd love to go with a pair of KLF30s for my rear effects but they would only be a few feet behind the listening area. I am using a Denon AVR5800 to power the system. ------------------ KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 surrounds KG -3.5 rear effects KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC1000 Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain

HornEd I am also using KLF-30s for both mains and surrounds. It really is a wonderful experience to say the least. I'd like to address two of your comments/concerns. Before I bought my 5800, I used a Yamaha DSP-A1 (which is still sitting in a box in my closet). I had a pair of SB-1s as front effects. I personally didn't think the front effects channels made any difference in the sound stage. The 5800 replaced a 5700 (which I still also have) and I couldn't be happier. The much maligned remote has worked flawlessly since I have owned it as has the 5800. I read may reviews complaining of damaged/dead out of the box 5800s and freezing remotes. Seems most of those people bought them from some less than reputable dealers on the internet. Everyone that I have talked to that has had good/great results bought their 5800s from authorized dealers. Seems there is a correlation there, you be the judge. In closing, go to a dealer and listen to the 5800 with the KLF-30s hooked to it. Let your ears be the judge. Had I based my decision for speakers and a receiver on reviews (like many on the Audioreview and Home Theatre Forum sites seem to do) I would have a Pioneer receiver and Def Tech speakers. I let my ears be the judge. By the way, I have never owned anything but Klipsch speakers. It started with a pair of Heresys, purchased in 1978 while in college. ------------------ KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 surrounds KG -3.5 rear effects KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC1000 Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain

I use a pair of KLF-30s as surrounds and a pair of KG-3.5s for rear effects. I tried a pair of KSP-S6s for surrounds but felt the KLF-30s did every bit as good a job, if not better. If you have a dealer that is willing to set up both give it a shot. The best thing I can say is, be your own judge. It's what sounds best to you. Good luck! ------------------ KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 surrounds KG -3.5 rear effects KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC1000 Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain

Hey TTK I actually replaced a single KPS-S6 with the pair of KG 3.5s .... and yes, already sold the KSP-S6s to a lucky board member here. Anyway, the KG 3.5s sound very good, still tinkering with the volume levels. They do add a nice seamless rear stage. If you have anymore questions, drop me a note. ------------------ KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 surrounds KG -3.5 rear effects KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC1000 Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain

I have KLF30s as both my mains and my surrounds. Awesome sound stage for both Home Theatre and Music. If you have the money, go for the full range all the way around. You won't be sorry! Look at my signature, you can see how my system is setup. Good luck in whatever you decide. And remember ... it's what sounds best to you in your setup. ------------------ ************************* KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 surrounds KG -3.5 rear effects KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC1000 Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain

First, let me say that I already have KLF30s as both mains and surrounds. I am contemplating the idea of using a pair of KLF30s for rear effects. My local dealer still has eight pair left, so availability isn't an issue. What I am wondering, is this really overkill? Is it a waste of money to put full range speakers in as rear effects in a 6.1/7.1 system? ------------------ ************************* KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 surrounds KSP-S6 rear center KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC1000 Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain

According to the Dolby Site, surrounds should actually be direct radiating speakers aimed at the listening area. Other speakers designs are OK, but Dolby prefers direct radiating. Here is the URL straight from the Dolby Site talking about surrounds: http://www.dolby.com/ht/sound/sound3.html I currently use klf30s for mains and surrounds. I am toying with the idea of buying another pair of KLF30s to do rear effects. Currently I am using a KSP-S6 for this now. ------------------ ************************* KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 surrounds KSP-S6 rear center KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC1000 Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain

I'd like to play devil's advocate here and see what people have to say. Based on what I read in the thread so far, people want to buy these great speakers for as little as possible, which is only human. Skip forward to the release of the new line this summer/fall and using a pair of KLF20s for this example. Just for argument, those who paid say $1,100 for a pair may be able to sell them for say $800 or $900. In the same vain, those that of us who paid $1,300 to $1,500 sound be able to sell our speakers for say $1,100 to $1,300. After all it would be unfair for those that paid much less to sell theirs for the same price than those that patronized a local dealer, correct? I'd like to hear others opinions and I will understand if BobG deletes me. ------------------ ************************* KLF-30 mains KLF-C7 center KLF-30 surrounds KSP-S6 rear center KSW200 subwoofer Denon AVR5800 Pioneer Elite DV-09 Pioneer Elite PD-F19 RCA DTC1000 Sony Playstation 2 Denon MD1000 Vidikron Epoch D-600 Vutec 100" 4:3 1.5 gain