15Hz Sub

[FireWave]

Hello, I've been talking to people about subwoofers, I have a dual 8" side firing woofer (Pro media ultra 5.1) and a Sub-12. People say Im missing the "good stuff" below 20 Hz. My sub 12 goes down to around 24 Hz which is great but id like to feel the explosions. I mainly do post production work and soundtracks. I have a budget of around $750 although I could go a tad bit higher if necessary, any suggestions on brands?

[Ironsave]

Jason had this sub for sale. (Not sure if it still is, or gone).

This would put you close:

http://community.klipsch.com/forums/t/132333.aspx?PageIndex=1

Good Luck

[CECAA850]

any suggestions on brands?

SVS Elemental Designs HSU or DIY.

[Jay481985]

diy tapped horn around 300 dollars more or less

[CECAA850]

diy tapped horn around 300 dollars more or less

TATER!!

[TheEAR]

Jay,

Where is the TC Sounds LMS sub you had ? []

A tapped horn is not a design a first or second time DIYer should undertake. Mastering the tapped horn design is way out of a novice realm, of there are plans to follow and TIME is on your side then a big GO.

[Olorin]

Tapped horns get really really big when you start getting into infrasonic bands. Remember that it's a quarter wavelength resonant pipe, so its path length needs to be right around 1/4 wavelength. 20 Hz takes about 16' of path, and getting to 16 Hz takes about a 23' pipe.

Couple that with the fact that there are very, very few drivers that are really suited to tapped horns, and you have a situation where, for the same driver in the same enclosure volume, there is most often little to no advantage over a big box with a big port, and the big box with the big port is a much simpler build.

So enough with the negativity. The affirmative response is to look at some of the DIY designs at AVS or Home Theater Shack or diyaudio.com. Several designs built around the Exodus Audio drivers will meet your spec.

[Jay481985]

Jay,

Where is the TC Sounds LMS sub you had ?

A tapped horn is not a design a first or second time DIYer should undertake. Mastering the tapped horn design is way out of a novice realm, of there are plans to follow and TIME is on your side then a big GO.

In the cabinet I built, I shook cinderblock walls when I was in college.

[Jay481985]

Tapped horns get really really big when you start getting into infrasonic bands. Remember that it's a quarter wavelength resonant pipe, so its path length needs to be right around 1/4 wavelength. 20 Hz takes about 16' of path, and getting to 16 Hz takes about a 23' pipe.

Couple that with the fact that there are very, very few drivers that are really suited to tapped horns, and you have a situation where, for the same driver in the same enclosure volume, there is most often little to no advantage over a big box with a big port, and the big box with the big port is a much simpler build.

So enough with the negativity. The affirmative response is to look at some of the DIY designs at AVS or Home Theater Shack or diyaudio.com. Several designs built around the Exodus Audio drivers will meet your spec.

what negativity?

[Olorin]

Spending two paragraphs talking about big tapped horns' downsides.

[dtel]

There is a big downside to my tapped horn sub, the downside is about 11" wide and almost 4' long ! [6]

It does not make the 15Hz flat but you have to remember this is really good for a DIY under $300.

Specifications

Operating Frequency Range ............................. 19 Hz – 125 Hz - 3 dB

................................................................................... 17 Hz -10dB

Sensitivity @ 1M .................................................................. 94 dBSPL

........ (Referenced to 2.83V @1M ½ space, measured as 28.3V @ 10M)

Maximum Output .................................................. ... 126 dBSPL Peak

Input Power Ratings .................... 400 W continuous, 800 W program

Nominal Impedance .................................................................. 8 ohms

Minimum Impedance ............................................................................

Recommended Processing ................ 15 Hz HP @ 24 dB/Butterworth

Drivers ........................................................... LF 2 x 8” Long excursion

[Jay481985]

Thanks dtel for providing the specs

The question now is weighing specs versus real world value. To get true 15 hertz needs massive space, expensive drivers and amps and reasonable woodworking skills. Will you really notice a subwoofer rated f3 down to 19 hertz to one rate down to 15 hertz? Probably not. I have a TC Sounds LMS 5400 in a 24 inch cube with 3 passive radiators with a supposed f3 of 21 hertz or so. But then again we forget that that is anechoic. When we factor room gain then we will be well below 15 hertz. (I think in my small dorm room Dr Who said something like 11 hertz). So will the tapped horn with a f3 of 19 hertz in a room go down to 15 hertz, most likely. But honestly will you be able to notice, most likely no. Why? When you have a clean subwoofer its really hard to tell anything below 30 hertz as I did a low spectrum test and I stopped hearing noises below 32 and started feeling them more.

Again specs versus real world values. For under 300 dollars you really cannot beat the performance of a tapped horn but then again it is big, tradeoffs.....

[Olorin]

For a permanent installation, an infinite baffle is really the obvious solution here. I'm surprised none of us thought of it earlier. If it's got to be a speaker in a box, though, a Mach5 IXL-18.2.2 ($200) in a 14.5 ft^3 enclosure with a 44 3/8" long 18" x 3" slot port (~$100 worth of MDF) powered by one channel of a Behringer EP4000 ($350 new, less used) models very nicely in WinISD. I get 113 db from 15-20 Hz, rising smoothly to 118 db @ 60 Hz, falling back to 114 @100 Hz (1 meter anechoic.) Naturally in-room response is going to be dominated by the room.

The images are large, so right-click/view them to see their full extent. If I downsize them, text is difficult to read.

If you wanted a subsonic filter at 12 Hz, a Reckhorn B2 costs $100, and that puts it right on budget.

[CECAA850]

For a permanent installation, an infinite baffle is really the obvious solution here. I'm surprised none of us thought of it earlier.

I've been drinking the IB koolaid for some time now but hate to sound like a broken record. Mine will do 110 dB @10Hz 14' from the mouth of the IB. It's tremendous with HT AND music.

[FireWave]

I don't plan on making a tapered horn design, Although intriguing, I have zero experience building an enclosure. What Im specifically looking for is a brand name sub that I can pick up at a store or order online. Having read the posts it appears that buying another sub 12 wont get me close to 15hz.

[CECAA850]

THIS should get you where you need to go.

[jtubbs6117]

http://community.klipsch.com/forums/t/137062.aspx

Check my subs at the above link. Paradigm website shows a 18hz Low Freq Ext. I have a matching pair if you are looking to do a dual sub config.

[FireWave]

Hmmm, Ill give it some thought. Ive heard that SVS PB-13 Ultra can go quite low, around 10Hz I think. But its more expensive.

[jtubbs6117]

I understand I am sorry about the shipping cost but I want to make sure they arrive as they left no matter who the buyer is. You're right about ultra I am selling my extra gear to buy one. I have my heart set on the gloss black 1799 i think. My only other choice was the paradigm Sub 15 a beautiful monster but also 2799.99 and only made when ordered. Please let me know if there is anything I can do to help.

[TxEvo8]

I have the SVS PB13 Ultra, it is quite impressive to say the least..