DrPyro Posted April 21, 2002 Share Posted April 21, 2002 I have been pondering upgrading my amps to Tubes, due to the glowing reports of our forum members...however, an interesting oportunity has presented itself. I'm able to get any of the Crown amps at very reduced prices and i'm thinking that i might give them a shot before building my own tubes. So what Crown amps would work best for Music & HT use (2 or 3 channel, maybe 6 if i really splurge)? Does anyone have experience with them, good or bad (Ears????). They will be used to power Ref3's (future Belles or Ref7's). Thanks for the info..... Dave ------------------ Home Theater Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazman Posted April 21, 2002 Share Posted April 21, 2002 Dave, My comment is directed toward your future possibility of maybe owning a pair of Belles. IMHO, when possible, I recommend one system for HT, a seperate 2 channel system for music. I realize that this is not always possible or practical. SS amplification workes fine for my HT system of KLF20's, C7, RS3II surrrounds, KSW15 & KSW12. I also currently own a pair of 74 Belles and other Heritage models that are dedicated to two channel music only, and found tube amplification to be the most sonicly pleasing power source for 2 channel music when combined with these vintage horns. The harshness of "most" SS amps at the low power levels where these horns shine, is not satisfying to the ears. I went from 100 wpc SS amp with a Crown preamp, to now a tube powered 3.5 wpc SET amp. Needless to say, tube amplication vs SS is an ongoing debate here on the Forum, but if you're considering moving toward a music only 2 channel system, espepcially with vintage horns, I say, save your money to invest in tubes. Tubes will warm the sound from Heritage series horns in a way that SS does not. If a seperate music system is not possible or practical, maybe the SS purchase would be justified. Klipsch out. 2 Channel system 1974 Belle Klipsch Welborne Labs 2A3 Moondogs Cary SLP90L Preamplifier Asusa modified PP-1 Phono preamplifier Rega3 turntable; RB300 tonearm; Grado cart. Rega Planet CD player Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBrennan Posted April 21, 2002 Share Posted April 21, 2002 Dr. Pyro---Give the Crowns a listen, then you decide. Personally I'm getting kind of "tubed out" and tired of the warmth many tube amps add to music. At the Lima hornshow after a day of listening mainly to tubes hearing Mike Baker's big JBL horns driven by QSC SS amps was refreshing. They had a clarity, dynamics and clean sound that was sorely missing from many of the tube based rigs I heard. There is a school that holds that horns sound better with tubes, much of this comes from tubies who need to use horns with their flea-powered SET amps. Some comes from those who find horns, especially Klipsch horns, harsh in sound and they use tubes to asuage this perceived harshness. But I don't hold with all that. I've been using horns for 30 years with both SS and tube amps and I've had good results with both types. So listen to the Crowns yourself and decide what YOU like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazman Posted April 22, 2002 Share Posted April 22, 2002 tbrennan, I don't use horns because I have "flea powered SET amps". I moved from SS to tubes and definitely did not give up "clarity, dynamics and clean sound" with that move. Big difference. Many other tube users purchase "push pull" amp designs that are not "flea powered". DrPyro had also stated a consideration of upgrading to tubes and part of the reason for my response. I would hope I did not give the impression that he should not try the Crowns or anything else for that matter. He should definitely listen to the Crowns AND some tube designs, and of course, decide for himself. Like you, I was merely sharing my experience, and hope this states things in a less confusing manner for DrPyro. Klipsch out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnA Posted April 22, 2002 Share Posted April 22, 2002 I'm with Tom on this one. I'm not familiar with modern Crown amps, but their amps from 30 years ago were well respected. Be careful which ones you buy, though. Some of the modern designs are intended for very high power sound reinforcement and do not seem to be aimed at high quality home systems. With limited experience, I've found SS amps to be more satisfying with my La Scalas. BTW, Mr. Paul uses all SS gear to run his system and one of the amps is a Crown D-60. I'm not sure whether it's hooked to the K-horns or the Belle. John This message has been edited by John Albright on 04-22-2002 at 09:18 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDBRbuilder Posted April 22, 2002 Share Posted April 22, 2002 The old SS vs. Tube debate will never die out. That's for sure....but...in the end, it all boils down to what sounds good to the owner, as is the case for any type of audio equipment. I have used a Harman/Kardon 900+ (bought new in 1975) for over a quarter century and love how it sounds through my heritage models. I also love how a Dynaco Stereo 400 model of the same vintage works with them. Both of these are high quality items, but vintage ones. The point here is that they are vintage and HAVE held up well through that same quarter century as has the other equipment I purchased back then...which brings me to the point that QUALITY is a very important consideration in a purchase. Reputation of the manufacturer for its quality should be considered. Fact is, there are differences between different tube amps just as there are differences between SS ones in what the listener hears coming out of the speakers. Differences also may be found not only between different models from the same manufacturer, but also between each separate amp of that model...each one being a single entity. When making a purchase the best way to decide is to give the equipment a try in the listening environment of the potential user, since that is where the equipment will ultimately end up. If it sounds the way you want it to sound in that environment, then the spec sheet can be thrown out the window, and the purchaser will be a grinning happy camper. Those who rely solely on specs and the name of the manufacturer for purchases sometimes end up losing alot of money over the years through trying to find the "perfect" piece of equipment to give them "that sound" where they listen to it most. "Let your ears decide" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Garrison Posted April 22, 2002 Share Posted April 22, 2002 One thing to be careful about. Some of the Crown amps, at least the older ones I'm familiar with, were designed for pro sound applications and the ONLY input was a balanced input on a 1/4" phono plug. To use a "regular" preamp with AES/EBU or RCA connectors, you either need to make up a cable, or use an adaptor. The adaptors I used were a constant source of annoying hum, I guess because of poor sheilding or not really solid ground connections. I had a D-75, by the way. Owned it prior to CF4 or La Scalas, so don't know how it would have sounded into them. ------------------ Music is art Audio is engineering Ray's Music System Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khorn58 Posted April 22, 2002 Share Posted April 22, 2002 I have a very nice Crown psa2 from the 80.s that just sounds great nice tight bass with highs to die for. The amp was made for high end use in recording studios and high end pa use. Some of the best recoding studios used them to drive there very citical moniters many horn loaded. like the altec 604 or urei moniters both with horn loaded high end. It does have the balenced input but can be run unbalened in normal hifi use. I used it with khorns and heresys very nice on both. Right now I am using it to power khorns in a recording studio in the balenced mode. The psa2 sold new in the 80,s for around 2500. I see them om ebay for 400 to 800 not a bad price today. Cabels are no problem to find for the 1/4 to rca, juat about any music store will have them in stock. Guitar center (which is everywere now) sells monster cable brand. This message has been edited by khorn58 on 04-22-2002 at 12:42 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrPyro Posted April 22, 2002 Author Share Posted April 22, 2002 Yeah..I don't want to get in an argument over SS Vs Tube, frankly each has there strengths and weekness.... jazman- Oh, I definately plan on getting two systems together. Outlaw + Tubes + Belles = Music and Denon/outlaw + SS + Refs = HT But, i have to get the space to do that.... John- Yes, alot of there newer amps are squarely aimed at the Pro market....hence this question... I'm looking for models that would be good for home use that i can go listen too. Thanks Dave ------------------ Home Theater Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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