new wood tweeter horn

[BEC]

Also, Tonsil does not want to deal with Polish customs. They want to produce an order then set it on their dock in Wrzesnia, Poland and let their customer handle it from there. So, I have to hire a thrid party to handle the shipment all the way from their dock to me. Eminence is so big that they think they can dictate terms to all their suppliers but Tonsil did not go along.

I can appreciate that. Dealing with customs in many other countries is a pita.

Your drivers still have the original threading? I know USSpeaker still has the adapters for those listed. I may get some while they are available in case I was to try these on some other horns. I've got two pair of the original APT-50 drivers.

Bruce

Bruce,

Normally Al at US Speakers just dropships stuff (at least that is the way things I order from him comes) so he may not really have the APT-3s. As far as I know, Eminence doesn't have any more. I think they got them from Tonsil along with the tweeters.

Yes, mine have the orignal threads.

I may have a few of the APT-3 adapters. I would have to go dig for them in the warehouse.

Bob Crites

[ZombieWoof]

hiring & dealing with a customs broker is not only a P I A

BUT Expensive as well

[BEC]

hiring & dealing with a customs broker is not only a P I A

BUT Expensive as well

Yeah, UPS handles this for me and they are very good at it. They are expensive, but I have not found anyone that does it cheaper. The actual shipping from Poland to me for a 1000 pound pallet is about $500.00. Paper work along the way (customs, taxes, bribes, or whatever they have to do) is about $1000.00.

[ZombieWoof]

hiring & dealing with a customs broker is not only a P I A

BUT Expensive as well

Yeah, UPS handles this for me and they are very good at it. They are expensive, but I have not found anyone that does it cheaper. The actual shipping from Poland to me for a 1000 pound pallet is about $500.00. Paper work along the way (customs, taxes, bribes, or whatever they have to do) is about $1000.00.

Yeah I was dealing in importing plants & UPS would not do customs on plants at all @ the time .

I have a love/hate thing with UPS took six months to get them to pay on a insurance claim on a smashed new computer I was sending to my parents .

kept claiming that it was packed wrong even thou it was triple boxed with their own boxes .

Bob, you being a commercial customer they treat you different than us common folk . . . . L O L

they kept thinking I would take No for a answer but that it was clearly their fault .

made me jump thru multiple hoops but I got my 1K outta them in the end .

[BEC]

hiring & dealing with a customs broker is not only a P I A

BUT Expensive as well

Yeah, UPS handles this for me and they are very good at it. They are expensive, but I have not found anyone that does it cheaper. The actual shipping from Poland to me for a 1000 pound pallet is about $500.00. Paper work along the way (customs, taxes, bribes, or whatever they have to do) is about $1000.00.

Yeah I was dealing in importing plants & UPS would not do customs on plants at all @ the time .

I have a love/hate thing with UPS took six months to get them to pay on a insurance claim on a smashed new computer I was sending to my parents .

kept claiming that it was packed wrong even thou it was triple boxed with their own boxes .

Bob, you being a commercial customer they treat you different than us common folk . . . . L O L

they kept thinking I would take No for a answer but that it was clearly their fault .

made me jump thru multiple hoops but I got my 1K outta them in the end .

What I wrote was not to be an endorsement of UPS in general, just their handling of an overseas shipment. I dumped UPS for our daily shipper quite awhile back and went to FedEx. Lots fewer problems since we went to FedEx. But, on the Poland to here shipment, the FedEx bid was about $2000.00 higher than the UPS bid.

[ZombieWoof]

agreed ! FedEx ground is getting better all the time

[Marvel]

on the Poland to here shipment, the FedEx bid was about $2000.00 higher than the UPS bid.

FedEx hasn't been in the bribery business as long as UPS, so it always costs them more. [:#]

Bruce

[horny toad]

Hi Jesse,

 

I spoke with our HF engineer about this.  He says that the old curve was vendor supplied from when we used to purchase the driver.  Weve more or less proven their information was bogus.  They also gave the driver an 85W power rating, but it wouldnt handle more than 15W when we tested.  Even if their response curve was legit, we dont know how they measured it.  When we cloned our own tooling, we eliminated the use of an adaptor to use it with a screw-on horn (the thread pattern used to be female, we made it a male thread).  We matched the original signature response, improved the sensitivity and power rating, and published accurate information.  We also validated the design with blind listening tests among our staff and the new driver was chosen as the favorite.  We feel the new driver is superior.

 

 

Best Regards,

 

Anthony Lucas

Technical Support

Eminence Speaker, LLC

[mustang guy]

The APT-50 that I use is the original APT-50. When

Eminence did the new APT-50-2, I tested it and found it just not good

enough to use. Eminence agrees that it should only be used with in an

active crossover situation. It's response curve is pretty bad. Anyway, I

went to the orignal manufacturer of the APT-50 in Poland and now they

make it for me.

Here is a link to the response curve of the new APT-50-2: This is the one they are using on the wooden horn.

http://www.eminence.com/pdf/APT50.pdf

Here is the curve for the original APT-50 that I use:

http://www.critesspeakers.com/apt50.pdf

Somebody at Eminence has got to be wrong. Was it the guy you dealt with or this new guy who says the response curves and power ratings were bogus. I tend to think that since you tested the newer 2 version, that the original has a better response, but it is possibly overrated for power handling.

[BEC]

The APT-50 that I use is the original APT-50. When
Eminence did the new APT-50-2, I tested it and found it just not good
enough to use. Eminence agrees that it should only be used with in an
active crossover situation. It's response curve is pretty bad. Anyway, I
went to the orignal manufacturer of the APT-50 in Poland and now they
make it for me.

Here is a link to the response curve of the new APT-50-2: This is the one they are using on the wooden horn.

http://www.eminence.com/pdf/APT50.pdf

Here is the curve for the original APT-50 that I use:

http://www.critesspeakers.com/apt50.pdf

Somebody at Eminence has got to be wrong. Was it the guy you dealt with or this new guy who says the response curves and power ratings were bogus. I tend to think that since you tested the newer 2 version, that the original has a better response, but it is possibly overrated for power handling.

You know, I really need to test the APT-50-2 again to be sure of how it performs. The ones Eminence sent me were some of the first batch they had and it is possible that later ones got somewhat better. Looks like though that if they did get better, Eminence would put a new curve up showing that they got better. Anyway, I have a couple of them now that have just been made. Will take another look at response out of them when I get a chance.

As far as power handling on the orignal APT-50, don't know about what it actually is. All I know is that very few people manage to blow the diaphragms on them.

Bob Crites

[mustang guy]

The APT-50 that I use is the original APT-50. When

Eminence did the new APT-50-2, I tested it and found it just not good

enough to use. Eminence agrees that it should only be used with in an

active crossover situation. It's response curve is pretty bad. Anyway, I

went to the orignal manufacturer of the APT-50 in Poland and now they

make it for me.

Here is a link to the response curve of the new APT-50-2: This is the one they are using on the wooden horn.

http://www.eminence.com/pdf/APT50.pdf

Here is the curve for the original APT-50 that I use:

http://www.critesspeakers.com/apt50.pdf

Somebody at Eminence has got to be wrong. Was it the guy you dealt with or this new guy who says the response curves and power ratings were bogus. I tend to think that since you tested the newer 2 version, that the original has a better response, but it is possibly overrated for power handling.

You know, I really need to test the APT-50-2 again to be sure of how it performs. The ones Eminence sent me were some of the first batch they had and it is possible that later ones got somewhat better. Looks like though that if they did get better, Eminence would put a new curve up showing that they got better. Anyway, I have a couple of them now that have just been made. Will take another look at response out of them when I get a chance.

As far as power handling on the orignal APT-50, don't know about what it actually is. All I know is that very few people manage to blow the diaphragms on them.

Bob Crites

I think you are the most trusted person in this forum. I certainly trust you! It will be interesting to know about the newer tweets for sure. I hope it doesn't cut into your profit margin too much. You provide a needed service to all of us Klipsch collectors. For what it's worth, I would love to hear your review of the wood horns in this thread. It would be nice if the craftsman could make you a threaded set for testing. []

[djk]

A JBLcompression driver with a 4" coil won't handle 85W continuous, anyone complaining about a 1" coil not handling 85W is mentally challenged.

[horny toad]

I truly did not mean to insult anyone on here or discredit Bobs Crites knowledge in anyway, I'm actually blown away by all the knowledge he has... The reason I posted it was because I thought you all would be interested in reading Eminence's reply to the apt-50 2 frequency curve.. In my opinion apt-50 is really an instrument driver for bass cabs ect, there are many other 1" drivers that I would use for hi fidelity playback, the only reason I selected the apt is because it has a small diameter and one of the only drivers I could get to fit in my klipsch without cutting a hole in the top of the cabinet to fit the magnet.

Frequency curve, power handling, and sensitivity put aside the apt-50 2 is a well voiced driver, and in my opinion sounds way more controlled then the k-77. But as we all know a opinion is just one persons point of view!

[horny toad]

mustang guy, the horn is made with a 1 3/8"-18 adapter. And yes it can be made to fit most 1" drivers for testing.

[horny toad]

another question i hear is what woods can it be made of.. We can cut it out of just about any wood, we can make it out of composites such as fiberglass with a gel coat finish, or exposed tweed carbon fiber ect

[BEC]

The APT-50 that I use is the original APT-50. When
Eminence did the new APT-50-2, I tested it and found it just not good
enough to use. Eminence agrees that it should only be used with in an
active crossover situation. It's response curve is pretty bad. Anyway, I
went to the orignal manufacturer of the APT-50 in Poland and now they
make it for me.

Here is a link to the response curve of the new APT-50-2: This is the one they are using on the wooden horn.

http://www.eminence.com/pdf/APT50.pdf

Here is the curve for the original APT-50 that I use:

http://www.critesspeakers.com/apt50.pdf

Somebody at Eminence has got to be wrong. Was it the guy you dealt with or this new guy who says the response curves and power ratings were bogus. I tend to think that since you tested the newer 2 version, that the original has a better response, but it is possibly overrated for power handling.

You know, I really need to test the APT-50-2 again to be sure of how it performs. The ones Eminence sent me were some of the first batch they had and it is possible that later ones got somewhat better. Looks like though that if they did get better, Eminence would put a new curve up showing that they got better. Anyway, I have a couple of them now that have just been made. Will take another look at response out of them when I get a chance.

As far as power handling on the orignal APT-50, don't know about what it actually is. All I know is that very few people manage to blow the diaphragms on them.

Bob Crites

I think you are the most trusted person in this forum. I certainly trust you! It will be interesting to know about the newer tweets for sure. I hope it doesn't cut into your profit margin too much. You provide a needed service to all of us Klipsch collectors. For what it's worth, I would love to hear your review of the wood horns in this thread. It would be nice if the craftsman could make you a threaded set for testing.

I said I needed to do the test again on the APT-50-2 since the test I did was on some early production units. Since I still have those also, I decided to test both early ones and later ones on the same horn. I chose the Selenium 11-25 horn since that one was handy. Results, at least on that horn, the recent production APT-50-2 looks a lot better than the earlier APT-50-2. Of course, the test results could be better or worse than this on a differnt horn. You really don't know how a combination of horn and driver performs until you test them.

On the trace below, the red is the early APT-50-2. The blue is the recent production APT-50-2. Looks like they gave up some SPL on the recent one to smooth out the curve some.

Bob Crites

[ZombieWoof]

another question i hear is what woods can it be made of.. We can cut it out of just about any wood, we can make it out of composites such as fiberglass with a gel coat finish, or exposed tweed carbon fiber ect

if you can do that then do a better transition from driver to horn than that mount you use seems to me the current mount has that tube that can't be good for the SQ

might it be better if the horn started right at the mouth of the driver ??

[tigerwoodKhorns]

I said I needed to do the test again on the APT-50-2 since the test I did was on some early production units. Since I still have those also, I decided to test both early ones and later ones on the same horn. I chose the Selenium 11-17 horn since that one was handy. Results, at least on that horn, the recent production APT-50-2 looks a lot better than the earlier APT-50-2. Of course, the test results could be better or worse than this on a differnt horn. You really don't know how a combination of horn and driver performs until you test them.

On the trace below, the red is the early APT-50-2. The blue is the recent production APT-50-2. Looks like they gave up some SPL on the recent one to smooth out the curve some.

Bob Crites

Bob, I cannot find a Selenium 11-17 horn. But I see that you do supply the APT-50 with an 11-25 horn or a 17-25 horn in these links.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Eminence-APT-50-Driver-with-Selenium-HM11-25-Horn-/370619677660?pt=US_Speaker_Parts_Components&hash=item564aa77bdc

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Eminence-APT-50-Driver-with-Selenium-HM17-25-Horn-/380444867186?pt=US_Speaker_Parts_Components&hash=item589447fa72

Is this the ATP50 that you tested? Which horn is it or do they both have the same response? We would all like to see the response of both pairings.

Thanks.

[BEC]

I said I needed to do the test again on the APT-50-2 since the test I did was on some early production units. Since I still have those also, I decided to test both early ones and later ones on the same horn. I chose the Selenium 11-17 horn since that one was handy. Results, at least on that horn, the recent production APT-50-2 looks a lot better than the earlier APT-50-2. Of course, the test results could be better or worse than this on a differnt horn. You really don't know how a combination of horn and driver performs until you test them.

On the trace below, the red is the early APT-50-2. The blue is the recent production APT-50-2. Looks like they gave up some SPL on the recent one to smooth out the curve some.

Bob Crites

Bob, I cannot find a Selenium 11-17 horn. But I see that you do supply the APT-50 with an 11-25 horn or a 17-25 horn in these links.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Eminence-APT-50-Driver-with-Selenium-HM11-25-Horn-/370619677660?pt=US_Speaker_Parts_Components&hash=item564aa77bdc

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Eminence-APT-50-Driver-with-Selenium-HM17-25-Horn-/380444867186?pt=US_Speaker_Parts_Components&hash=item589447fa72

Is this the ATP50 that you tested? Which horn is it or do they both have the same response? We would all like to see the response of both pairings.

Thanks.

Yes, that should have said the Selenium 11-25 horn. I went back and corrected that.

Anyway, neither of those I have on Ebay would be the combinations I would use myself. I tend to not keep any traces that I don't intend to use, so I don't have those to show you. They are just combinations some people like to buy. I woud suggest that the APT-50 on either the ll-25 or the 17-25 horns need an active crossover to smooth out the curve.

[Guest David H]

Using ALK's Eliptrac program, I built a similar pair of these for testing, For the current size and depth, I used conical flair, however I may try a hybrid Tractrix.

I did some preliminary testing using a PRV driver I had on hand, but the results were less than stellar, I will send to ALK for testing as soon as I get the DE-38 driver coming.

Dave