m00n Posted September 14, 2002 Share Posted September 14, 2002 So, in the heritage lineup, you have Belle, Hershey II, Klipschorn, La Scala. Is it safe to assume that each speaker had a specific intent on music and or home theater? If so, which speaker is good for what. What types of music sound best on what? I hear good words about all off them, but if I decided to get a pair of the heritage, I would like to know what the strenghts and weakness of each are. Thanks m00n ------------------ m00nsCinema to be the m00n system FRONTS: RF-7 CENTER: RC-7 SURROUNDS: RS-7 SUB: RSW-12 RECEIVER: Harman Kardon AVR 520 DVD: Harman Kardon DVD-50(DD, DTS) VIDEO: InFocus ScreenPlay DLP Projector COMPUTER: ProMedia 4.1 c>Microsoft XBOX with Monster cable for that 5.1 Dolby Digitial surroundc> f> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBrennan Posted September 14, 2002 Share Posted September 14, 2002 The old Klipsch speakers, those designed by PWK and now known as Heritages, had a consistent design philosophey and sound, unlike the mish-mosh of stuff made by the modern company. It worked like this; as the speaker grew smaller and cheaper either range or output or lower distortion was sacrificed but not the overall "voice"; the tonal quality. So you start with the Klipschorn; very large but the least compromised of the bunch. The LaScala and Belle were attempts to have most of the virtues of the Khorn in a smaller speaker not needing corner placement. Low bass was sacrificed to do this but not output or distortion. So basically those speakers sound like a Khorn but with less bass extension. The Heresy was an attempt to get most of the midrange and treble virtues of the Khorn in a very small package. To do this output and bass extension had to be sacrificed and higher bass distortion tolerated. So basically a Heresy sounds tonally much like a KHorn but it won't get as loud or make as deep bass. Note that to hold bass distortion to low levels PWK sacrificed deep bass as can be achieved by 12" woofers. Many 12" woofer systems will go lower than a Heresey but will have more distortion in order to do it. Tradeoffs. www.chicagohornspeakerclub.org Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted September 14, 2002 Share Posted September 14, 2002 I have heard the Cornwalls, LaScalas and Khorns on the same equipment and the same music selections in my living room. The big old horns of Klipsch's Heritage series "does sound different from just about any other line of speakers, from Klipsch or from anyone else." But that difference is a matter of taste. One man's wine is another's vinegar. Big old horns have wonderful musical qualities. They are much better at reproducing important qualities such as dynamic range, air, tone, space, and clarity with lower distortion than the typical radiator cone speakers. The Khorn has two horns and a horn-loaded bass woofer, making the huge triangular beast incredibly sensitive to input. Its awesome efficiency puts the big old horns into an entirely different league than regular cone and dome boxes. Of the Heritage line, this is the grand-daddy. It has the smoothest mid-range, treble and bass coherence, the largest image and the gentlest nature. (I have not heard the Belles.) The larger Klipsch Heritage series speakers are beloved by many musicians. Acoustic instruments sound quite real on big old horns. The full range and dynamics of the piano, for example, is better and easier reproduced, for less money, than many other high-end systems. The far right-hand notes have ping, the far left-hand ones growl and rumble. Drums have thump and snap, horns have blat and blare, and vocals are crisp and clear. Cymbals clang and sizzle like few other systems. As the bow strokes the taught strings of the cello, the Khorn cabinet vibrates like a hummingbird in flight. No other speaker makes pianos, drums, horns and cymbals sound so real. Klipsch BBS poster Ray Garrison says that except for a "teensy dip at about 57Hz and the tiny blip at 170 HZ, the Klipsch Khorn appears to be +/- 2dB from 40Hz to 15kHZ (!!!!!!! ). "The La Scala," Ray says, "is MUCH rougher (+/- 5dB from 100Hz to 10kHz). The Belle has a fairly smooth curve, but it has a smoothly falling output from 150Hz to 6kHz, totaling a drop of almost 10dB from bass to treble." My own measurements show that except for two things, the Khorns are indeed admirably flat. Except for a dip at 300 to500-Hz, and a bounce from 80 to 160-Hz, they are within b2bdB from a very pleasing 31.5 to 12.5-kHz. In other words: all of the musically critical range! No so with the Cornwalls. With a bump from 125 to 63Hz, and again at 5-kHz (room reflections) the flattest range on the Cornwalls was from 500 to 4-kHz and within 4-dB. The Cornwalls also extend down to 31.5Hz and up to 10-kHz. The Khorn smoothness is evident and quite pleasing to me. It comes across as an even, balanced and easy to listen to - not just for a long time. But it seems as if it will never wear out your ears kind of sound. The closest comparison that I know of is the single driver sound of something like the Omega TS1s. (I have not heard other horn loaded single driver systems yet, but I am sure curious about what they can do. Tom Brennan said "the biggest problem with CWs, and the Heritages in general, is the narrow directivity, in certain situations this lends a "fierceness" to the sound on axis." I certainly fought with this on the Cornwalls, never really noticed it on the LaScala's visit to my abode and do not experience this directional fierceness on the Khorns. Comparing them recently to a pair of small radiator cone speakers, I thought my big old Cornwalls were clear, unmuffled, larger image, more sizzle to the tambourines, more mid-range bloom. The xylophone, for example, was almost 3D in texture and tone. With flea-powered 2A3 tubes, the combination is softer, delicate, chimes are more subdued and vocals are more "breathy." This message has been edited by Colin on 09-14-2002 at 04:27 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted September 14, 2002 Author Share Posted September 14, 2002 Hey thanks guys. So I just called a local dealer. I don't see any KHorns in my immediate future. At $2,900 each, I think I can wait. ------------------ m00nsCinema to be the m00n system FRONTS: RF-7 CENTER: RC-7 SURROUNDS: RS-7 SUB: RSW-12 RECEIVER: Harman Kardon AVR 520 DVD: Harman Kardon DVD-50(DD, DTS) VIDEO: InFocus ScreenPlay DLP Projector COMPUTER: ProMedia 4.1 c>Microsoft XBOX with Monster cable for that 5.1 Dolby Digitial surroundc> f> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mighty Favog Posted September 14, 2002 Share Posted September 14, 2002 I thought they were going for $7,500 a pair?? ------------------ Tom's Money Pit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Lindsey Posted September 14, 2002 Share Posted September 14, 2002 They can be had for $1000 - $1800/pair. You should also be able to find them within a 5 hour drive from your home. They're there, you just gotta do your homework... Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted September 14, 2002 Author Share Posted September 14, 2002 Mike, that sounds like a much better price ------------------ m00nsCinema to be the m00n system FRONTS: RF-7 CENTER: RC-7 SURROUNDS: RS-7 SUB: RSW-12 RECEIVER: Harman Kardon AVR 520 DVD: Harman Kardon DVD-50(DD, DTS) VIDEO: InFocus ScreenPlay DLP Projector COMPUTER: ProMedia 4.1 c>Microsoft XBOX with Monster cable for that 5.1 Dolby Digitial surroundc> f> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenratboy Posted September 15, 2002 Share Posted September 15, 2002 Well, I have not two corners to place "the" speakers, so I will have to settle for smaller... So, what is the ideal wall lengh for Klipschorns? Isn't it 13 feet? Overall room size? My room is 13' X 13'6, and I COULD place KH's so I would be facing the window, which over looks mountains... Hmmmmmmm... Ehh, I'll just get some Bose. ------------------ Receiver: Sony STR-DE675 CD player: Sony CDP-CX300 Turntable: Technics SL-J3 with Audio-Technica TR485U Speakers: JBL HLS-610 Subwoofer: JBL 4648A-8 Sub amp: Parts Express 180 watt Center/surrounds: Teac 3-way bookshelfs Yes, it sucks, but better to come. KLIPSCH soon! My computer is better than my stereo! For JBL related subjects and more fun, click: http://www.audioheritage.org Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasN00b Posted September 15, 2002 Share Posted September 15, 2002 quote: Originally posted by kenratboy: Ehh, I'll just get some Bose. not funny... ------------------ --------------------- I. Love. MUSIC! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Istari Posted September 16, 2002 Share Posted September 16, 2002 Per one of PWK's own technical papers the "ideal" room for the horns would be to place them along the long side of a room 27'X16'X10'. This allows the Khorn to produce a 32hz wave down the diagonal of the room. He recommended a "Center Channel" in the center of the wall to fill in. Can't remember the Tech Paper title but it was written in the 50's. ------------------ Jim McClung Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j-malotky Posted September 18, 2002 Share Posted September 18, 2002 rat 13 x 13 would be way too small for Khorns. 15' corner to corner would be the very minimum - IMHO. Khorns shine in big rooms. Lots of formulas you can use. Golden Mean works well. Personally, I found that 22' w/o a center images very well. But that is in a room that only has 3 single nulls under 100hz with absolutely no double or tripple nulls or peaks. Room harmonics is probably the most overlooked aspect of this hobby and unfortunatly can not be altered or optimized, unless you build a house. JM ------------------ HT / Listening Environment: Mains: '83 Khorns All Heritage Center: K77, K400 above screen, Dual K22 in Heresy cabinets under screen. Sides: Forte 1 Subs: Dual SVS Ultra + Screen: 65"x120" DaLite Grey Projector: Sharp PG-M20X Processor: Lexicon MC-1 2 Ch Preamp: McIntosh C-36 Many NAD mono amps (for now) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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