Cornwall replacement squawker. Opinions.

[Deang]

Ran across this at Layne Audio.

Steve knows his stuff, but was wondering what you all thought about this:

Midrange driver : We have located a very high quality replacement for the old EV / Atlas / University drivers found in the classic Klipsch horn loaded mids, only $69 each, this driver is built more heavily and can take the low crossover point <~450Hz> of the larger Klipsch speakers without distorting. The original drivers should really never be run below 700Hz, as a result the lower midrange lacks detail and can be quite distorted, especially at higher volume levels. Our new driver has usable response down to 400Hz , and is rated at 120w RMS crossed over as low as 500Hz. These also use the older type phenolic diaphragms to maintain the "classic" sound lacking in most modern drivers, which almost universally have harsher sounding metal diaphragms.

[Chris Robinson]

I think some input from Tom B and Al K would be helpful here.

[mobile homeless]

One sentence: WHY are you doing this?

[Deang]

I'm NOT doing this.

I ran across the blip while searching for a possible, suitable replacement mid-woofer for the DQ's.

I was simply wonder what, if anything, you all thought about the comment regarding the original driver not being designed to run down below 700Hz.

See my PIO post. After spending considerable time stumbling through the Asylum archives -- I'm completely confused.

[TBrennan]

Dean---This guy at Layne wants to sell stuff and I think his claims are self-serving. Personally I think that ole PWK was perfectly able of finding the best mid driver that fit his sonic needs and pricing needs. Note too that the Klipsch mid driver ran to 6500 hz in most cases, very high for a phenolic 2" diaphragm driver. This evidently took modification of the phase plug on the Atlas driver and then later a one-of-a-kind driver from EV, a driver sold only to Klipsch. That an inexpensive replacement driver would work as well is, well, doubtful to me. I could be wrong here but I've my doubts.

I seem to remember this guy claiming that his replacement woofer for the Heresey is not only more efficient but goes deeper too, this in contravention of the laws of physics which state that for a given size box as efficiency goes up so does f3.

[Deang]

Thanks Tom.

I do believe the deal with the Heresy replacement woofer is more along the lines of it being able produce a longer throw without breakup.

[TBrennan]

Dean---Yeah, for the Heresy he's claiming deeper bass with no change needed in crossover but not more efficiency. But deeper bass means less efficiency, there's no way around it. In this case the longer voicecoil allowing a longer stroke will add moving mass that will lower the efficiency. In any case I think the use of this woofer without a crossover change would change the tonal balance of the speaker. Nothing comes for free.

[Deang]

O.K., get it now.

I sent you some mail.

I want to do something 'interesting' this spring.

[JohnA]

I think the quote shows he doesn't know his stuff. The Atlas driver is still available and is, in fact, used in the 2002 Klipsch Heritage line. Atlas rates the driver down to 80 Hz with the proper horn and it's only 5 dB down at 300 Hz. It was crossed over as low as 400 and as high as 700, but not at 450.

His business is run out of a bedroom. My brother called to get a replacement driver for an AR and since he works in Nashville, wanted to pick it up. He couldn't, yhe guy has no storefront and wouldn't let him come to his house.

[fini]

H & P started out of their garage. It's a famous landmark, now. Doggies apparently love it, too:

http://www.dogfriendly.com/server/travel/uscities/guides/w/FOLDERca/wonlinecayyyyyyyhe.shtml

fini

[HDBRbuilder]

Another note on Layne's replacement Heresy woofer claims:

The Heresy is a more or less sealed cabinet. This design allows a small woofer to utilize the "vacuum" formed behind it to limit its tendency in forward excursion, and vice versa...thereby allowing a short-excursion woofer to work well in it! The claims of Layne's replacement woofer having longer excursion, thereby being better, just doesn't hold water for the Heresy due to the speaker's design to begin with. One does not need to be an audio engineer, since anybody with any common sense can see that!! "Snake Oil", I say!!

I have read on here of many who have been suckered in by these woofer claims from there, then they get told that if they just use the modified heresy cabinet design that is ported, it works better...then they are told to buy the new mid driver, etc...etc...etc! When they could have spent all that money on a pair of Cornwalls to begin with!!

[NOSValves]

Well I was suckered into buying a pair and find that they may not go lower and I was never told they would !! I was told that they could be played at higher SLP and still not lose control and they do !!!!!!!!! This is what I was after and this is what I got !! I have no idea about the mid driver all I know is that I was treated honestly by Layne Audio and got what I was told I would recieve. They are a upgrade for the Heresy although not major !!

Craig

[Clipped and Shorn]

Dog friendly monuments? Sniff sniff. Does this have to do with woofers or Nipper's facination with his master's horns?

I think there is enough here for a whole new thread which may prove to be the longest in the forum's history.

-c7s

[HDBRbuilder]

Well, Craig, I am happy you are satisfied with your purchase! Enjoy!

I have hand-selected industrial woofers in my Heresys to begin with, so higher SPL is a non-issue to me, and mine were tested by Mr. Bradford to ensure they had the same bottom-end performance as the standard Heresy woofer was rated at, too! So, I don't need anything from Layne Audio! LOL! Granted, very few, if any, have had this opportunity, though...and I deem myself lucky!!

One of the things I would worry about when purchasing "off-the-shelf replacement (or upgrade) items" from outside suppliers is whether the items are properly matched or tested before shipping...as they are upon arrival at the factory. As for the claims about the longer excursion being anything that would give any better performance, the design of the speaker cabinet answers that in itself, since it already limits the excursion of any woofer properly installed in it! The ad says nothing about higher SPL, just touts the longer excursion thing...and if the woofer DOES get to extend its excursion in those cabinets, then I doubt its cone is gonna last 25 years as mine have! Something has to flex under those circumstances to allow for that excursion!

Of course, I am not an SPL junkie, and seldom crank up the volume really high in my listening(not anymore, anyway!! LOL!...but there WAS a time....LOL!) My heresys have also never been subjected to amplification rated over 100 WPC either...but they could easily handle it, according to Mr. Bradford, anyway!...LOL! He said something about 300 WPC when we discussed it! And the woofers in mine have not had an easy life for all of the last 25 years, but they are still in perfect working order, yet another thing I would worry about in spending money on replacement ones!

I still believe that money on Heresy upgrades from these kinds of people is better utilized being saved toward a purchase of a pair of Cornwalls...so that the desired higher SPL and lower bass is achieved in a better, more dependable time-proven manner But, to each his own opinion!