kook Posted February 19, 2003 Share Posted February 19, 2003 Have had my Forte II's as my main speakers for about 10 years. Nice, but bass is very dependant on speaker placement, among other things. Also, at higher volumes, the midrange seems to get kind of harsh. What are my Forte II's equivalent to, today? I love strong mid-bass punch for CD listening. What mains would you recommend as replacements? I'm running a Denon AVR2802, which has 5 channel audio for CD. Was thinking of moving my Forte II's to the rear (as surrounds) and getting some new mains - good or bad idea? thanks, Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flason Posted February 19, 2003 Share Posted February 19, 2003 You should list the rest of your gear here and what you're playing when it sounds harsh. For the stuff listed, the Denon would be the weak link IMO. Those Forte's are very good speakers. Nothing you buy short of Chorus or Cornwall II's would be a very good timbre match. What the local shops do around here is give you 60 days to check out the equipment. I would check out some higher end receivers or better yet, separates. A friend of mine bought a B&K Ref30 from Sound Advice for $1700 and returned it on the 59th day. The salesguy offered him the Ref50 at the same price to keep. But if you really want a new set of mains: I have a pair of KLF30's black satin excellent condition that I will let go for $900 to board members. If Mike Lindsey is still around, he saw them a year ago and can vogue for me. They will be on e-bay soon, well as soon as I get a digital camera. I have original boxes and paperwork. They would give those Forte's a run for the money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerohm Posted February 20, 2003 Share Posted February 20, 2003 I agree, the problem aren't the Forte II's. Audition a Rotel or Parrasound amp paired up with a RSP-1066, AVM-20, or B&K Ref50, and you will falling love with your speakers all over again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WMcD Posted February 20, 2003 Share Posted February 20, 2003 Does this mean you might sell the Forte II? If they are walnut, I'd be interested. Gil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt1stcav Posted February 21, 2003 Share Posted February 21, 2003 ---------------- On 2/19/2003 9:45:44 PM kook wrote: Have had my Forte II's as my main speakers for about 10 years. Nice, but bass is very dependant on speaker placement, among other things. Also, at higher volumes, the midrange seems to get kind of harsh. ---------------- Your Forte IIs are excellent loudspeakers, so there's no need to get rid of them. Most likely your problem lies with your Denon receiver...the Forte IIs and your Denon are just not compatable with eachother (a comman problem with SS amplification and horns). You could replace the Forte IIs with newer Klipsch, but who's to say the new models won't sound just as harsh at higher levels. You could replace your Denon, but any other compatable SS AV receiver will probably sound the same when cranked up, plus who has that kind of money? Or you could buy an external amplifier connected to your receiver's preamp output to power your Forte IIs; that may soften the midrange sting to tolerable levels... My brother did this with his HT...His harman/kardon AVR 55 AV receiver was connected to our dad's Cornwall Is, and they were not a match made in Heaven (the CWs were also harsh at higher levels). He won an auction on eBay for a McIntosh MC250 amp, and hooked the CWs to the Mac, which was connected to the AVR 55's preamp output. The Mac was a great combination with the Cornwalls, and the harshness associated with the horns was greatly reduced! Thus, he was able to keep his receiver and the Klipsch. This is a hit or miss proposition. I don't know what other Klipsch models are equivalent to the Forte IIs, but if you're unhappy with the Klipsch sound, you can always go with another manufacturer (Paradigm, Definitive Technology, Boston Acoustics, B&W, Polk Audio, etc.) I doubt whether I helped much... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kook Posted February 21, 2003 Author Share Posted February 21, 2003 jt1 - yes, it was very helpful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt1stcav Posted February 22, 2003 Share Posted February 22, 2003 kook, did you e-mail me? All I got was a blank message. Ask me your question through this Forum, please...Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kook Posted February 22, 2003 Author Share Posted February 22, 2003 yes I did, but no biggie. Was wondering what type of coin was required for the amps you guys are talking about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audible Nectar Posted February 22, 2003 Share Posted February 22, 2003 A McIntosh MC250 (50 watts by two - plenty of power, btw) will cost about $350 to $500 used, depending on condition. I have one of these on the way, and will report the results soon. If the reviews are correct, it should be a very good match. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kook Posted February 22, 2003 Author Share Posted February 22, 2003 Only 50 WPC? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audible Nectar Posted February 22, 2003 Share Posted February 22, 2003 With Klipsch, all you need is 50wpc. The trick with Klipsch is to get a quality "first watt", since the efficiency of Klipsch will allow your speakers to play at high 90's SPL with only one watt of power (and if you use an SPL meter from radio shack, you will find out that 97 db sustained SPL is loud). The trouble with many of these high powered solid state units is that they sound great and spec great at full output power, but your Klipsch will never see that full power - your amps will be putting out just a paltry watt or two, even a fairly high volumes. When it comes to solid state, quality "first watt" units are relatively few and far between - there's a lot of junk out there! This is why many here on the forum use low powered tube amplification, but for home theater use, multiple channels of tube amps can be a maintenance hassle, so solid state certainly has advantages in that realm. You must choose among solid state offerings VERY carefully. With Klipsch, all of the "bad" in your audio chain will come home to roost in the form of harshness (especially in the mids and highs) from your speakers. It is of the utmost importance that you select gear that is clean, since those oh-so-sensitive horns will make the garbage audible. When I first got my Outlaw amplifier, I had a lot of fun rocking out my system, showing it off to friends, etc - but the reality is that most of the time, I'm not listening to my system at high volume - which is when I discovered the low quality of Outlaw's "first watt". It's great for HT, but for music - just "so-so". If you want your cash to result in a meaningful upgrade, choose very carefully. And BTW - keep your Fortes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt1stcav Posted February 22, 2003 Share Posted February 22, 2003 Damn dndphishin, I couldn't have said it better myself! He's absolutely right on all counts, kook. I can attest that my Mac MC250 is about one of the best SS amps out there for Klipsch horn speakers...it's a very magical combination indeed. Other SS amps I've used with the CWs (several Carvers, an SAE, and a Technics integrated...all great amps) were no match sonically to the Cornwall/MC250 combo. Only a pair of 3.5 watt SET monoblocks could make the horns sound better, IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt1stcav Posted February 23, 2003 Share Posted February 23, 2003 Vintage solid-state; It doesn't get much better than the McIntosh MC250! My 30 year old amp is 100% original (never been modified), and it's still going strong! Al Klappenberger of ALK crossover fame uses an MC250 to power his modified Belle Klipsch; a McIntosh MC50 (a mono 50 watt version of the MC250) powers his center Belle. Al's endorsement of the this McIntosh amp is good enough for me! Isn't she pretty in my dimly-lit music room? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j-malotky Posted February 23, 2003 Share Posted February 23, 2003 KOOK Welcome to the Forum. The Forte is a very nice speaker. It has more of a Heritage sound than an RF series sound. I do not think you would be happy if you replaced them with a newer RF series. (Assuming you love the sound of your Forte). I believe the above posters hit the nail on the head about your harsh midrange problems you experiance. (DND nice post!!) If you are moving to a HT 5.1 / 7.1 system, there are many ways to make use of your Forte. If you keep them as mains, you could add Heresys or more Fortes for centers and surrounds and keep the Heritage sound. OR - You could move them to the rears and add larger Heritage as mains. Could go as big as Khorns depending on room size! For example, I have Fortes on my sides. Khorns in front and Heresys in the rears. Used Heritage can be had on ebay for reasonable prices (1/4-1/3 of new prices) Seriously, if you love the Heritage sound, build a Heritage HT. A heritage HT is hard to beat in sound quality. JM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBrennan Posted February 23, 2003 Share Posted February 23, 2003 The Forte IS comparatively harsh as are all the speakers with the Hepner mid horn-driver. The Denons I've heard sound very smooth and the fact that the harshness is with increasing volume pretty muchs shoots down the "1st quality watt" theory in this case. Nope, I'd say the problem is the speakers themselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fini Posted February 23, 2003 Share Posted February 23, 2003 jt1stcav, That's a cool light you've got there! I'm looking for a small light for TT/amp/CD viewing (can't see a durn thing in dim light). Do you like it? Do you remember where you got it? Have a brand/model for me? Thanks! fini Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mace Posted February 23, 2003 Share Posted February 23, 2003 ---------------- On 2/23/2003 11:38:54 AM TBrennan wrote: The Forte IS comparatively harsh as are all the speakers with the Hepner mid horn-driver. The Denons I've heard sound very smooth and the fact that the harshness is with increasing volume pretty muchs shoots down the "1st quality watt" theory in this case. Nope, I'd say the problem is the speakers themselves. ---------------- "increasing volume" is such a subjective term and Klipsch speakers are so sensitive that I wouldn't rule out the "first watt" theory. If up above 90 db is loud, then the first watt theory would still make sense. Mace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBrennan Posted February 23, 2003 Share Posted February 23, 2003 Mace--Yeah, but increasing distortion with volume with such high efficiency speakers is always IME the speaker distorting and not the amp. If the speaker is using less than 1 watt yet distortion is increasing with volume what else could it be? Certainly the amp hasn't gone from low to high distortion when supplying so little power. Those Herner dervived mid horns have a very small diaphragm and throat area, it's reasonable to assume that the driver is causing the distortion. And I used the old Hepners the Klipsch drivers are derived from, they did fall apart all at once at at signifigantly lower volumes than proper 2" diaphragm-1" throat types. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krispy Kirk Posted February 23, 2003 Share Posted February 23, 2003 TBrennan: "Hepner/Herner(sic)" - just what in heck are you talking about? Kook's Forte's are Mk.IIs with the Tractrix midhorn. Far, far smoother than the midhorn in the earlier Forte (Mk I) IMHO... Kook: If you DO decide to "upgrade" those Forte IIs to something "more modern" that Academy center channel will have to go as well. I assure you I can find a good home for it! Email me for further details... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBrennan Posted February 23, 2003 Share Posted February 23, 2003 Kirk---The driver is based on the old Hepner tooling that Klipsch bought when Hepner went under. The driver has a 1" diaphragm and about a 1/2' throat. Small diaphragms and throats make for high distortion. I'm not talking smoothness of frequency response here but distortion. That's what I'm talking about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.