whell Posted April 13, 2003 Share Posted April 13, 2003 Not sure what is happening with this record, but I'd sure appreciate some advice. My equipment is: Grado Prestige Blue tracking at 2 grams, Dual 504 turntable. Here's what I'm observing: Cleaned the record before I played it the first time, then again when I heard some scratchiness at the start of the record. The record was still a little wet when I started play, but sounded better. Proceeding from the 2nd to the 3rd song on the record, the scratchiness seemed to return, but even worse. Now the cartridge seemed to be "vibrating", and started to skip a bit. You could actually see the headshell/cartridge/needle vibrate. Cleaned the record again, and again the record was a bit wet when I resumed play. After a few minutes, the "vibratring" and skipping returned. So... seems like the record plays fine when wet, but I'm not sure why, and I'm not sure how to get it to play normally when dry. I also thought something might be wrong with the stylus, so I tried another record. The other record played just fine. Its a Gene Harris record, recorded and released in 1973. This is the first time I've played it. THe other side of this disk plays fine. Thanks for any help or insight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
middlecreekguy Posted April 13, 2003 Share Posted April 13, 2003 Well my guess is this record has been damaged beyond repair.Or there has been a sticky spill on it that you can`t see or get off. If the other side plays fine, and other records play fine, those grooves are just toast. If you had another cartridge it would be interesting to try but I would keep my good one away from side 1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allan Songer Posted April 13, 2003 Share Posted April 13, 2003 Have you played LOTS and LOTS of LPs with the Grado/Dual combo? If not, then I'll bet you're experiencing the "Grado Dance!" I've seen this happen before when a Grado is mated to a tonearm that is totally unsuitable. If you can, try to add a BUNCH of weight to the arm's counterweight and see if the problem goes away. If this doesn't help, then you can always try doing a better job of isolating the table, but I doubt this would cause the drama you're describing. If you have another cartridge, by all means swap that one it and see what happens! If adding the weight to the counterweight of the arm doesn't help, I'll bet you have a really screwed up LP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fini Posted April 14, 2003 Share Posted April 14, 2003 Interesting. I've had a similar problem on one record. I'm using a Grado cartridge on the stock tonearm of my Pioneer PL-41. It gets to a certain part, then wiggles. My assumption was, with a high mass tonearm, wiggle would be the least of my problems. Yes, adding weight improved the performance, but how much higher than the recomended weight can you go before damage (to the cartridge, or the record) occurs? Does anyone have a more appropriate cartridge for this tonearm? fini Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whell Posted April 14, 2003 Author Share Posted April 14, 2003 Allan: I've played LOTS of records on this TT with the Grado and have had no problems until now. Interesting however that I did try to play the record on another turntable (an older Sanyo with an "S" shaped arm, but also with a Grado) and the record played just fine. I did try adding weight to the counterweight and rebalancing the arm. That seemed to make the "Grado Dance" issue a little worse. Given my findings, I'm considering another TT. My older Sanyo might fill the void for a while as I search for a new machine. The Grado was "dancing" on a Dual 504 that I found at a garage sale for $3, so no real loss there. In other words, I like the sound reproduction from the Grado more than I'm attached to the Dual. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted April 14, 2003 Share Posted April 14, 2003 Regardless of past performance, that is classic Grado dance. Happens in very quiet spots and between cuts. I minimized it using the method Allan described, but it still happens though rarely. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fini Posted April 14, 2003 Share Posted April 14, 2003 ---------------- On 4/13/2003 10:09:38 PM Allan Songer wrote: If you can, try to add a BUNCH of weight to the arm's counterweight and see if the problem goes away. ---------------- Am I correct in assuming this means increasing the tracking force? If not, then could you please explain? fini Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fini Posted April 14, 2003 Share Posted April 14, 2003 ---------------- On 4/13/2003 10:09:38 PM Allan Songer wrote: If you can, try to add a BUNCH of weight to the arm's counterweight and see if the problem goes away. ---------------- Am I correct in assuming this means increasing the tracking force? If not, then could you please explain? fini Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allan Songer Posted April 14, 2003 Share Posted April 14, 2003 No--tracking force remains the same. You add the weight to the counterbalance and then re-balance the arm. I dunno what arm is on the Dual, but this is usually pretty straightforward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allan Songer Posted April 14, 2003 Share Posted April 14, 2003 Maybe I was unclear--you have to add weight to BOTH ends of the arm!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whell Posted April 14, 2003 Author Share Posted April 14, 2003 You're right, I missed that. I've added a ton of weight to the counterbalance, but it looks like you're also suggesting extra weight to the headhsell too? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allan Songer Posted April 15, 2003 Share Posted April 15, 2003 CORRECT! That way the tracking force remains at 2 grams!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fini Posted April 15, 2003 Share Posted April 15, 2003 Essentially increasing the mass of the tonearm, to provide more inertia to resist the vibration? My tonearm is already, what the local hifi shop called a "tone leg": very massive. What material do you use? Pennies? Reminds me of my youth... fini Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whell Posted April 15, 2003 Author Share Posted April 15, 2003 I've used a couple of washers held in place with Blue Tack on the counterweight. I'll see what I can figure out for the headshell. Wonder how a cabbage roll would work... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Mobley Posted April 15, 2003 Share Posted April 15, 2003 A cabbage roll would only help if it was wound counter-clockwise when viewed from the south end. Otherwise the magnetic flux lines would just cancel each other out. Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fini Posted April 15, 2003 Share Posted April 15, 2003 I think I will go ahead and use some pennies. I was wondering if anyone had recommendations as to date and mint mark, as well as condition (is MS-65+ really neccessary? Will a stack of 1909-S VDB's work?). I'd use cabbage rolls, but my wife won't allow food in the living room. fini Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Invidiosulus Posted April 15, 2003 Share Posted April 15, 2003 Those steel pennies from the WWII era have a sound that is to die forwhen you use them to increase the mass on your tone arm. You could always take some lead solder and wrap it around the tonarm on the headshell end. Peace, Josh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allan Songer Posted April 15, 2003 Share Posted April 15, 2003 Are you CRAZY?!?! With Klipsch you simply HAVE to go Indian-Head!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
middlecreekguy Posted April 15, 2003 Share Posted April 15, 2003 Wheat pennies could produce a grainy sound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
middlecreekguy Posted April 15, 2003 Share Posted April 15, 2003 But seriously, does side 1 of this record that you are having trouble tracking contain loud passages, such as the cannons on the 1812 Overture? If not it might just be damaged. Noun of your other records are doing this. Right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.