Chris Robinson Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 We had a last minute change in schedule and Jean-Francois Lessard and Nancy came in from Quebec City with my Pantheon and Horus monoblocks. I had just enough time to call a few loco locals for a dinner party. Fortunately, Leo and Martha Keightley made it and we had time to break some bread, drink some wine, and solder resistors and caps during last minute adjustments. This morning, the party over, Jeff and I had some time to tune out the final buzzes and hums ... There is a tad bit of 120 Hz noise from the 5687, but it is negligible. Jeff will send down a resistor to eliminate this as well as a wayward screw which made its way under my work bench. To date, Leo's Moondogs have pretty much been the Gold Standard ... but given three months, these will mellow out and settle in ... and will be right there in terms of sonic quality. But already, combined with the Klipschorns and even a crummy room, the sound is fabulous and they're making unbelievable music. The transient-handling and bass is just out of this world. I'm a happy camper. Tomorrow, I'll be FedEx'ing Edster00's pair off to him in Atlanta. Stay tuned for his comments. BTW, Jeff and Nancy Lessard are great people. They don't come any nicer and they were wonderful house guests while here. My 3-year old didn't want Nancy to leave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike stehr Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 Time to update the signature. I'm jealous. Congrats, and enjoy!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 Those type amps may not be my cup of tea, but the fellowship you enjoyed sure is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leok Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 Chris, I've bee keeping quiet all day (well just turned the computer back on) .. I wanted you to break the news. Martha and I had a great time last night. I heard Klipsch horns like I've never heard them before. Very smooth and powerful. Also, that cd player of yours is very impressive. I don't think the Philips is any better. As the Horus Amps break in the sound will just get smoother and smoother. The quality of the Horus amps was like nothing I've seen before, in workmanship, design, execution, and material. Between burn-in, tube rolling, and an adaptive adjustment now and then, those amps will do anything a 2A3 amp can ever do. That's a perfect match for those big Horns. By the way, Jeff liked the KHorns. They're revealing, but with something as good as the Horus, that's what you want. leok Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 So guys, tell me truthfully. Is this SET for Dean? And you KNOW what I'm talking about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Robinson Posted June 23, 2003 Author Share Posted June 23, 2003 Hard to say ... but to my ears, little is left on the table. I'll let Leo chime in here since he has more experience on this and has no bias whatsoever .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leok Posted June 23, 2003 Share Posted June 23, 2003 Dean, At the powers you claim to use I would say a 2A3 SET is not for you. If you ever get a chance to put an oscilloscope on your speaker terminals and crank the volume up to as high as you would want an amp to be able to provide, and look at the +/- peaks. If they are under +/- 2.45 V a 2A3 SET is ok. I don't think that's what you are going to find..I think you want more. leok Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnysal Posted June 23, 2003 Share Posted June 23, 2003 congratulations chris! jeff says he really liked the sound with k-horns, not surprising huh? osunds like you have found audio nirvana! keep us informed as the equipment settles in. regards, tony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted June 23, 2003 Share Posted June 23, 2003 Man, I know I've got that scope sitting around here somewhere -- what the heck did I do with that thing? Can't I just use my tongue across the terminals? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leok Posted June 23, 2003 Share Posted June 23, 2003 Dean, I would have suggested the tounge approach, but at the levels you are used to .. no. Better use a scope .. maybe one with a high voltage probe. Really Dean, I don't think 3.5 Watts is going to do it. I occasionally swap in the Tripath amp for a few more Watts. Don't forget, Chris' speakers are twice as loud as our RF-7s. leok Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted June 23, 2003 Share Posted June 23, 2003 Oh, I never forget that -- except when I'm jerking Craig's chain about putting his MK III's in triode mode with his LaScalas I don't know Leo, what do you think -- stacked RF-7's? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Robinson Posted June 23, 2003 Author Share Posted June 23, 2003 Guys, I'm only 24 hours into this new chapter but I put on "Between the Sheets" (Fourplay version) tonight while Carrie had Jack in the tub -- and CRANKED it. That's all the way to 11:30 on the dial. I hadn't listened to this cut in about six months. I've NEVER heard music like this before. The Wrights are VERY, VERY good but something was a little different. Perhaps it's the AVVT's or the 5687's ... I'm not sure what it was ... but the music was damned perfect. The midrange was gorgeous and vibrant, and the bass was in your throat. My opposing-corners Klipschorn set-up (room limited) make the soundstage = zero, but the dynamics are way, way, way over the top. This is going to be a very interesting ride as these amps settle in and Leo helps me with the last few tweaks. Dean, you've really got to hear this sound ... If you're in Boston or Atlanta, give me or Ed a call. PS: I believe Wolfram is going to inherit my Wrights, so we'll have another SET-afficionado soon. I know SET is about 1 in 4 on this forum, but we're gaining on the PP guys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted June 23, 2003 Share Posted June 23, 2003 Dean, I really think your tongue method would work wonders. Let us know the results. If your eyes change colors and you hair becomes excessively curly after the test you know 3 watts of SET just won't do it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edster00 Posted June 23, 2003 Share Posted June 23, 2003 Chris, It goes without saying that I am looking forward to hearing the cobalt/parafeed Horus, your comments are very encouraging. Have you had a chance to roll those 6900s into the amps yet? Just curious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Robinson Posted June 23, 2003 Author Share Posted June 23, 2003 Yes, actually I put them in tonight ... Very, very nice! They have a sonic signature that is a little different than the TungSols ... a little bit of "sheen" on the HF. I think this is a nice quality if the recording is good ... and the midrange is lush as well. Bass is a no-brainer, esp. with the Khorns. I need about five more hours with it and a tube roll or two to know for sure what is my favorite ... but I know there are no losers in this competition. All the 5687's have been very nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lynnm Posted June 23, 2003 Share Posted June 23, 2003 LOL " I really think your tongue method would work wonders. " One of my favourite historical tidbits regarding electrical research concerns this very technique. Napoleon Boneparte on hearing of the excitement generated by Michael Farraday's electrical experiments in L' Angleterre was determined that anything cobbled up by some second rate tinkerer in a " Nation of Shopkeepers" could be bettered by REAL scientists at the Academie Francais and ordered that the resident techies build him the most powerful battery known to man. The boyos in the lab put together a wet battery consisting of about 1000 cells ( 2000 volts +/- ) in time for a demo at the Paris Exposition of Science and Technology. Boney dismissed the scientist who was scheduled to introduce the super battery to the assembled throng and launched into a speech about how the human tongue was an excellent detector of Galvanic activity. He went on to explain that touching the wires from a fully charged battery to one's tongue would result in a strange metallic taste to be percieved and that a really strong battery could actually cause the muscles in the tongue to twitch. Fortunately he went on to say - Electricity is completely harmless. With that he opened his mouth and proceeded to apply the wires from the super battery to his tongue. The lab boys made a flying leap trying to stop him but they were too late ! Boney emitted a loud (but rather clamped) gasp and collapsed . It is said that he lost consciousness for several minutes and lacked the power of speech for a time after regaining consciousness. It has been claimed that he always afterward denied recollection of that event - Vanity or Amnesia ?? Boney was a vain little PR but I have to give him the benefit of the doubt on this one - It is entirely possible that he really was amnaesic regarding that incident because intense electrical shock to the brain is well documented to ordinarily result in amnesia regarding the shocking event. The moral ? Never lick the wires coming into your house because you'll forget the effects and be likely to do it again ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted June 23, 2003 Share Posted June 23, 2003 LOL, and this guy was a military genius? I'm really starting to believe you guys with big Heritage and benign impedance curves really have some options open to you not always open to some of the rest of us. Am I jealous? Maybe, in a small way -- until I settle into my listening chair. I know Craig enjoyed the sound of the Paramour's on his Scalas when he had them, but ultimately did find them lacking in dynamics when even slightly pushed. However, I do know all SET is not created equal. I find most of the comments relating to bass and good SET more than paradoxical. The Apollos had very good bass as well, but I often wondered how much of what I was hearing was actually excessive 2nd order distortion riding on top of the fundamentals. Of course, the Apollos were 18wpc -- but even still. I've been working very hard at understanding the math behind this nutty hobby of ours -- and it is VERY difficult to understand how an amp with little or no damping, and 3 or 4 watts -- can drive a 15" driver with much control at the higher SPL's. The horn loading of big Heritage is nothing but a testament to the genius of PWK. I do think those of you with K-horns and SET will hear something quite different than those with SET and Scalas or Belles. There is something to be said for a wide frequency response. I'm excited and happy for you guys who have settled in and found something you are really pleased with. Sometimes this hobby can be so frustrating and disappointing. Deep down however, I still worry more about the last watt than the first watt. Enjoy the music Chris!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Robinson Posted June 24, 2003 Author Share Posted June 24, 2003 Dean, you probably have a point there, and much of this (for me anyway) boils down to ears and preferences. There is math and equations underneath it all, but that's not my forte and I'll leave it to the MSEE's and PhD's. I'm quite blown away by this experience but I'll let Ed chime in here in a few days. He'll have his gear Wednesday night and should have the minor adjustments made by Thursday p.m. Let's see what he says. Maybe it's just all the rain we've had up here this spring inducing early summer dementia. I was surprised when Jeff told me that he'd build no more Horuses. He is going to go back to building amps for himself and then selling them when a new idea comes along. He wants to finsih his PhD and "enjoy the music" again ... and get some time away from the production aspect of sniffing hot solder. I totally understand this. He suggested to Erik though that he could do a few of these amps if he was interested. Anybody wanting to try one of these might contact Erik to see if he can be persuaded ... but drop on by Boston or Atlanta for an audition first to see if they're right for you. They're right for me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Mandaville Posted June 24, 2003 Share Posted June 24, 2003 I can tell you are happy with your new amplifiers, Chris! I'm curious about this 120cps noise you are still getting. Do you happen to know the value and position in the circuit of the resistor you will be receiving? If you took voltage readings, do you remember what the heater supply on the driver tube was? If Leo is nearby, it might be possible to add a little extra capacitance in the rectifier/filter circuit. I believe 7,000mfd is what is shown on the schematic, however that is not a common value. You could use a 10,000mfd or even a little more, which may help. Such a capacitor could easily be 'tack-soldered' in parallel with the other one already in that position. If the situation is improved, the connection could be made neat and permanent. If the heaters are running too high, you could use a small value power resistor and another capacitor to bring the voltage down to where it should be. I'm sure it will work out perfectly, though -- having speakers of such high sensitivity makes even the smallest problems sound bigger than they really are! Enjoy, Chris! Erik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted June 24, 2003 Share Posted June 24, 2003 Chris, I was surprised when Jeff told me that he'd build no more Horuses. He is going to go back to building amps for himself and then selling them when a new idea comes along. He wants to finsih his PhD and "enjoy the music" again ... and get some time away from the production aspect of sniffing hot solder. I totally understand this. I totally know how Jeff feels ! When you turn your hobby into a job there are drawbacks !! It becomes a job Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.