wheelman Posted March 5, 2004 Share Posted March 5, 2004 I finally ordered some white ss.1 surrounds. Sweet in my opinion i love aluminum tweeters. I can't wait to hook them up and hear it all matched. Now i have to figure where to put them on the side walls. Or on the side on stands so they are literally seemless. Or put them up high above and behind me by five inches left and right of the couch. Any help? I just don't want to have holes every where. Buy the way i scored big time got them in box new of off a retailer that had them left over before bb took over. All i did is put up a wanted ad and in two days i got them. Exactly what i wanted some white mint ones. That is if i don't get scammed we'll see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wheelman Posted March 6, 2004 Author Share Posted March 6, 2004 CONGRADULATIONS! WHEELMAN on your new speakers. Oh you got synergys never mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted March 6, 2004 Share Posted March 6, 2004 LOL.... Ahhhh nobody giving wheel da love? Congrats man! Hope you enjoy them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted March 6, 2004 Share Posted March 6, 2004 ---------------- On 3/5/2004 4:49:55 PM wheelman wrote: Now i have to figure where to put them on the side walls. Or on the side on stands so they are literally seemless. ---------------- What do you mean by seamless? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wheelman Posted March 6, 2004 Author Share Posted March 6, 2004 Thanks Moon, what i mean by seemless is like their is no seem. You know tibre match they refer to it as seemless like you can't tell the difference when the sound moves to another speaker. But when you have all your speakers at the same height you acheive even a better seemless sound.Especially your front three. But with surrounds i am not sure because of fly bys and stuff like that may sound better higher up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted March 6, 2004 Share Posted March 6, 2004 Ahhhhh... Ok. When you said seemless I though you were referring to room decore. Have you gone to the dolby digital site and read any of their docs on speaker placement? http://www.dolby.com/digital/ I can't remember what their specification is, but I think it's something like 12" ~ 24" above the seating postion for the surrounds... I think i have also seen specs where they say about 6" down from the ceiling... I could be mistaken (been a long time since I read through the docs) so I would really suggest going and doing some reading... Lots of great stuff on that site. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wheelman Posted March 6, 2004 Author Share Posted March 6, 2004 ---------------- On 3/6/2004 2:42:10 AM m00n wrote: Ahhhhh... Ok. When you said seemless I though you were referring to room decore. Have you gone to the dolby digital site and read any of their docs on speaker placement? http://www.dolby.com/digital/ I can't remember what their specification is, but I think it's something like 12" ~ 24" above the seating postion for the surrounds... I think i have also seen specs where they say about 6" down from the ceiling... I could be mistaken (been a long time since I read through the docs) so I would really suggest going and doing some reading... Lots of great stuff on that site. ---------------- Yeah that is a cool web site. I like the surrounds on the sides up high for ambiance sounds like rain and crickets. but on 5.1 surround when their behind you i like that stereo image you get sometimes between the front and rear so it seems like their are speakers on the side walls or actually in the other room. But if it were totally dolby pro logic side walls no two ways about it. i just don't want to put a bunch of holes in my walls. Because my hometheater is my living room. I have my surrounds in a weird spot right now but it gives you a pretty cool effect on dvd sound tracks. I probally shouldn't even of asked that question. Because i have had them in both positions. Like i said i am missing that surrounded rain effect but on dvd's the stereo imaging between all the speakers is present. Just rain is more audible in the front three. Hopefully my new surrounds will take care of that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HornEd Posted March 6, 2004 Share Posted March 6, 2004 It's a sad day for wheelman in this neck of the woods. Filling your ears with reflected sounds that destroy timbre-matching is an extension of the THX disease that started by making "theater sound" mediocre in every seat and then convincing the public it was better sound. The only scam bigger than THX surrounds is the artificial wool Bose has pulled over the eyes of the public to become the world's largest selling speaker company. Of course, if the acoustics of wheelman's listening area is so poor that it needs a WDST thrash metal band-aid... I suppose it's a good thing. But, as negative as this reply may seem, I am sending you love wheelman... and a sincere hope that you get well soon... and discover what you have now committed yourself to missing... the lightly varnished joy of monopole surrounds... correctly set up. -HornEd PS: Paul W. Klipsch never bought into the dipole, bipole, tripole scene. In fact, the whole multi-polecat theme earned a malodorous yellow BS button! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HornEd Posted March 6, 2004 Share Posted March 6, 2004 Oops... if I was astute I would not double post... but my dread of creeping "Boseasspecks" of surround sound sprayers makes my "Submit" finger twitchy. Mea culpa! -HornEd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beesley Posted March 6, 2004 Share Posted March 6, 2004 Wheelman, CONGRADULATIONS on your new surrounds, makes a world of difference. I had Synergy for a LONG TIME (ksf-10.5, c-5, s-5) and liked them A LOT. The only reason I was able to upgrade was because a buyer offered me a great deal for the synergy, and the seller for the Legends gave me a great price. Enjoy! PS Just have two loyal friends come buy the house to "help you set up your theater"......one on each surround til you like what you hear Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wheelman Posted March 6, 2004 Author Share Posted March 6, 2004 Actually Horny ed i have had monopole speakers for surrounds for years. They are great no doubt. I do agree properlly set up they sound better, but i noticed gaps in my room with them and i was hoping this klipsch design would help. I hope i get the clarity monopoles have that is unbeatable. Really three dimension. I was gonna go with a bookshelf but if only i had a digital camera you would understand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T2K Posted March 6, 2004 Share Posted March 6, 2004 ---------------- On 3/6/2004 10:03:32 AM HornEd wrote: It's a sad day for wheelman in this neck of the woods. Filling your ears with reflected sounds that destroy timbre-matching is an extension of the THX disease that started by making "theater sound" mediocre in every seat and then convincing the public it was better sound. The only scam bigger than THX surrounds is the artificial wool Bose has pulled over the eyes of the public to become the world's largest selling speaker company. Of course, if the acoustics of wheelman's listening area is so poor that it needs a WDST thrash metal band-aid... I suppose it's a good thing. But, as negative as this reply may seem, I am sending you love wheelman... and a sincere hope that you get well soon... and discover what you have now committed yourself to missing... the lightly varnished joy of monopole surrounds... correctly set up. -HornEd PS: Paul W. Klipsch never bought into the dipole, bipole, tripole scene. In fact, the whole multi-polecat theme earned a malodorous yellow BS button! ---------------- Congrats on your purchase wheelman. Don't pay any attention to the negative posts. Your speakers will sound great once properly positioned. The WDST's will give great surround effects, which is their purpose. In other words, the EFFECTS will sound non-localizable, which is exactly what they are designed to do. It will not sound like there is rain in the corners of your room, as you already have experienced. Hope you enjoy them! Keith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T2K Posted March 6, 2004 Share Posted March 6, 2004 ---------------- On 3/6/2004 2:15:54 AM m00n wrote: Our society will be a better place when we can learn to disagree with dignity. ---------------- I couldn't agree more m00n. Keith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HornEd Posted March 6, 2004 Share Posted March 6, 2004 Wheelman, the quality of many of your posts caused me to hesitate posting a dissenting opinion to the many congratulations you are likely to receive here. And, admittedly, in my Legend Theater I have gone the extra mile of converting my KLF-30's to be mounted horizontally on the wall about 5' above the floor. This pulls more seating areas into the sweet spot and creates an angle of incidence that covers the 30' circular room without a gap. The motorboards on the KLF-30 rear array have been altered to have the woofers as close to each end as possible... and the midrange and tweeter horns are stacked in the center of the motorboard. The sound is so good that I have not been in nearly as great a rush to build my 7 Klipschorn Theater with a custom subterranean subwoofer done in gunite under a concrete floor. The subwoofer chamber will have a separate reinforced concrete door entrance. Okay, so I may have the ability to be a bit over the top... and have used WDST speakers to make up for the lack of room in the 30' motorhome... that has to stay narrow enough to get down the highway. Although I am designing one that will fold out to provide a much better listening environment when parked. It seems that taking on an adventurous 38 year-old fiancé while having 65 years of audio experience has made a sound difference in my recent lifestyle. Never-the-less, getting an honest set of waves aimed at the sweet spot that are limited to those sounds between say 50 Hz to 2,000 Hz severely limits your potential to achieve the clarity of monopoles. Every nuance of sound over 2,000 Hz in your WDST surrounds is sprayed everywhere but where your sitting which means all those sounds bounced from all those angles hits your ear at so close to the same time that your ear tells your brain that your so flooded with sound you cant determine direction or timbre from 2,000 Hz to 20,000 Hz even if the sound engineer who mix the CD or DVD intended for you to hear the difference. Also, when such sounds are also coming out of your front array, much of the acuity is also lost. However, that very brain confusion as to sound is what makes Bose have a greater profit margin (cheap speakers sold at substantially higher prices) and the worlds largest speaker manufacturer. Granted, small listening environments with significant acoustic challenges are indeed a reason to compromise your ears/mind and take the WDST alternative which is a definite cut above bipole and (shudder) dipole which in addition to spraying the sound deliberately has its speakers wired out-of-phase. To me thats close to audio necrophilia! Multiple bookshelf monopoles can be used to great effect for a more natural sound experience. Again, set them up with an SPL meter and if they have two woofers, lay them horizontally. 7.1 systems work well with such bookshelf speakers as they can be aimed to cover larger areas with monopole crispness. =HornEd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HornEd Posted March 6, 2004 Share Posted March 6, 2004 Looks like the Tide is still rolling in "BamaJamaCramaSound" as T2K continues to march to the bleat of a different Theater Sound Ear Drummer. Hmmm, T2K... his new handle does fit... he chooses to have direct radiators up to 2k (Hz)... t2k... Yep, give me 2k direct and spray the rest around room... sounds like the audio equivalent of a drive-up Alabama fast food order. No thanks, Keith, I'll take my Klipsch full-range like Mr. Paul thought it ought to be. But I am glad that there are enough TideEars to buy fast-audio at the local discounters it keeps the company profitable enough to make systems that dont require the audio-training wheels that WDST provides for those looking to transition from being BamaBosers. Its a nice sunny day here, Keith, thats about all the negative humor such a pretty day can stand. Hope you get well with your next avatar. =HornEd PS: I guess I won't earn a friendly m00n pie award on this one! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted March 6, 2004 Share Posted March 6, 2004 ---------------- On 3/6/2004 3:55:14 PM HornEd wrote: Looks like the Tide is still rolling in "BamaJamaCramaSound" =HornEd PS: I guess I won't earn a friendly m00n pie award on this one! ---------------- LOL... Sorry Keith, but that was kinda funny. Horn you can have one simply because you made me giggle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted March 6, 2004 Share Posted March 6, 2004 Its funny this topic should come up... I have been debating selling my 4 RS7s and replacing them with 2 RC7s... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wheelman Posted March 6, 2004 Author Share Posted March 6, 2004 ---------------- On 3/6/2004 3:32:28 PM HornEd wrote: Wheelman, the quality of many of your posts caused me to hesitate posting a dissenting opinion to the many congratulations you are likely to receive here. And, admittedly, in my Legend Theater I have gone the extra mile of converting my KLF-30's to be mounted horizontally on the wall about 5' above the floor. This pulls more seating areas into the sweet spot and creates an angle of incidence that covers the 30' circular room without a gap. The motorboards on the KLF-30 rear array have been altered to have the woofers as close to each end as possible... and the midrange and tweeter horns are stacked in the center of the motorboard. The sound is so good that I have not been in nearly as great a rush to build my 7 Klipschorn Theater with a custom subterranean subwoofer done in gunite under a concrete floor. The subwoofer chamber will have a separate reinforced concrete door entrance. Okay, so I may have the ability to be a bit over the top... and have used WDST speakers to make up for the lack of room in the 30' motorhome... that has to stay narrow enough to get down the highway. Although I am designing one that will fold out to provide a much better listening environment when parked. It seems that taking on an adventurous 38 year-old fiancé while having 65 years of audio experience has made a sound difference in my recent lifestyle. Never-the-less, getting an honest set of waves aimed at the sweet spot that are limited to those sounds between say 50 Hz to 2,000 Hz severely limits your potential to achieve the clarity of monopoles. Every nuance of sound over 2,000 Hz in your WDST surrounds is sprayed everywhere but where your sitting… which means all those sounds bounced from all those angles hits your ear at so close to the same time that your ear tells your brain that your so flooded with sound you can’t determine direction or timbre from 2,000 Hz to 20,000 Hz… even if the sound engineer who mix the CD or DVD intended for you to hear the difference. Also, when such sounds are also coming out of your front array, much of the acuity is also lost. However, that very brain confusion as to sound is what makes Bose have a greater profit margin (cheap speakers sold at substantially higher prices) and the world’s largest speaker manufacturer. Granted, small listening environments with significant acoustic challenges are indeed a reason to compromise your ears/mind and take the WDST alternative… which is a definite cut above bipole and (shudder) dipole which in addition to spraying the sound deliberately has its speakers wired out-of-phase. To me that’s close to audio necrophilia! Multiple bookshelf monopoles can be used to great effect for a more natural sound experience. Again, set them up with an SPL meter and if they have two woofers, lay them horizontally. 7.1 systems work well with such bookshelf speakers as they can be aimed to cover larger areas with monopole crispness. =HornEd ---------------- Whoa!!!!!!!!!!!!! that went right over my head. I do no how good monopoles are. I have owned them for ten years and i have had dipoles and bipoles. It's just a matter of space i would of went for the sf-2 no doubt about it if my room didn't have the front door where it would go. It was pretty much the deal i got and the size of the speaker, and i bet they are clearer than most bipoles even though i haven't heard them yet. My room is a big regtangle i sit in the middle of it so i am very close to my tv and mains. YOU put up monopoles no matter where they are an you get alot of reflection regardless. Still they are better than dipoles at times. Not all the time some times they can be annoying even when calibrated to a lower volume than they are supposed to be. Alot of times when i had monopoles i was constantly looking up at them because they caused so much attention and beleive me i have had them in all different place. The thang of it is the rectangle that i am sitting in is slitely off to because their are two doors left and right of my sofa. That is were i have my bipoles right now above the two doors. No annoying attention called to them. But they can not keep up with the spl levels of my mains so that is where i am thinking i haven't got the good rain effect. Wind however is amazing. If i had a different room i would of went with towers all at ear level for total 3d effect. I have had that set up in a different home. I even had dipoles turned up side down firing up and firing down. This set up is actually pretty good beleive it or not. One of the best sounds i heard for movies was having small bookshelfs on the floor tilted back up against the front wall (huge soundstage). I just did it for something to listen to while my good mains came in the mail and i really enjoyed the sound and they were blown. Must of been all the reflections hahahahahhahahhah. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steelie Posted March 6, 2004 Share Posted March 6, 2004 Just curious ... what modifications do you have to do to set up towers with rear ports for surrounds? Or do you just space them out from the walls? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T2K Posted March 6, 2004 Share Posted March 6, 2004 ---------------- On 3/6/2004 3:55:14 PM HornEd wrote: Looks like the Tide is still rolling in "BamaJamaCramaSound" as T2K continues to march to the bleat of a different Theater Sound Ear Drummer. Hmmm, T2K... his new handle does fit... he chooses to have direct radiators up to 2k (Hz)... t2k... Yep, give me 2k direct and spray the rest around room... sounds like the audio equivalent of a drive-up Alabama fast food order. No thanks, Keith, I'll take my Klipsch full-range like Mr. Paul thought it ought to be. But I am glad that there are enough “TideEars” to buy fast-audio at the local discounters… it keeps the company profitable enough to make systems that don’t require the audio-training wheels that WDST provides for those looking to transition from being BamaBosers. It’s a nice sunny day here, Keith, that’s about all the negative humor such a pretty day can stand. Hope you get well with your next avatar. =HornEd PS: I guess I won't earn a friendly m00n pie award on this one! ---------------- Your comments, like your avatar, reflect your true character bargain ed. Was nice while you were gone. Go back. Please. PWK, like your humor, is dead. Really. Keith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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