I went. I saw. I drove. I bought.

[TBrennan]

Allan---You're the kind of boss it would be a pleasure to give 8 for 8. Enjoy your Dodge.

[SCOOTERDOG]

Wow! I love this new car by dodge.

In response to Frz I must say. I have a 99 Ram 1500 4x4 that I bought new. It is now 5 years old and has 88K on it. Not once has it ever seen the shop for any repairs. It runs as good as today as when I first bought it. Tires, breaks general maintance is all I have done to it. In fact in 2001 I was so happy with the dodge product I bought my wife a stratus. This is now 4 years old and the same thing appplies to it, great little car and very sound. I would buy antother crysler product in a heartbeat.

[kenratboy]

----------------

On 5/18/2004 12:21:18 PM dgb wrote:

The Hemi powered 300s look awsome! Too bad I'm not in the market.

You could also go with the ultimate sleeper, the Subaru Forester 2.5 turbo. Safest small SUV on the road, and it will do 0-60 in under 5 seconds. Listed at 230hp, but the 1/4 time points to closer to 300hp. Same engine as the WRX STi.

----------------

I'm with you on that one. We are in the 1960's all over again, cars are under-rating their HP. Don't forget that thing has GOBS of torque from 2000 RPM's, so that helps.

Subaru is really putting out some great stuff. The Outback/Legacy replacement is on the way - and it too will be another sleeper if you opt for the turbo, or even the new H6.

[Q-Man]

I'm looking for a new car for my wife and I recently test drove the Pontiac Bonneville GXP 4.6 Litre Northstar V8 with 275 Horsepower and 300 lb-ft of Torque, the Cadillac CTS 3.6 Litre VVT V6 with 255 Horsepower and 252 lb-ft of Torque, and the Chrysler 300C 5.7 Litre Hemi V8 with 345 Horsepower and 390 lb-ft of Torque.

The Bonneville was the worst of the three. I don't like the handling of a front wheel drive car and the traction control slowed you down too much. It was also to small for drivers and passengers who are over 6' tall. It was quicker then the older 3.8 litres, but didn't feel like a true sports car.

Next we went and drove the Cadillac CTS, because I want a car that seats 5 comfortably and has enought power to have a little fun with. I was surprised, because I really liked the CTS and I don't like six cylinder engines. This car is roomier and quicker then the Bonneville. The power was more head jerking and my 6'7" son wasn't hitting his head while being tossed around in the back seat. It handled better and was much more fun to drive. It did have a little more body roll then the Bonnivile. With the traction control turned off you have enought power to slide the rear end around, yet it is still very controllable. The traction control will kick in even when it is turned off when you put the car in more then 180 degree spin. The bonneville won't let you do that much. When I got the Bonneville's wheels spinning and the car drifting it was like it slamed the brakes on to slow you down. I was literaly jerked forward. The cadillac also has a very cool transmission which has a switch called sport mode. In sport mode it won't let the RPM's drop below about 3 grand, or it will down shift and keep the rev's up for more power. This is a very nice feature for those who want that head snapping power everytime you touch the gas. This works well when powering through a curve so you can let the rear end slide out and do some of the steering for you. And isn't that the only fun way to drive?

I drive a truck and sold the first Dodge Ram that I ever owned two years ago because I was always having it repaired. I sold it with 50,000 miles on it and went back to GMC trucks which I only have to do service on. The Dodge left me with a sour taste in my mouth for Mopar products, but they do make the best looking trucks. This is why I almost didn't take the Chrysler 300C Hemi out for a test drive. My kids pushed me into it, and I did want to try the Hemi engine. The downside here is that the salesman rode with my two sons and me. I never had a salesman go along for a ride with me before. This ment that they could't drive it, and it cramped my style a little. Since I had him in the car I didn't take it out of the traction control mode. I did proceed to floor it a number of times and the hemi did have good pick up, but not to much different then the CTS. I did give it all the power that it had through a couple of long sweeping curves to find it's breaking point. When the rear end began to break loose I would go to correct the slide, but the traction control was also attempting to correct the slide at the same time. This made for some jerky side to side movements of the car around these curves at about 70 miles and hour. I'm not use to driving with traction control, I don't think that I could ever retrain myself to leave the car alone and let it do it's thing. I spent to many years pushing cars to their limit so I could bring them back, it's now too much of a reflex reaction. But the car did what it is designed to do, save someones a** who doesn't know how to drive. The salesman remained cool even durning one hairy situation and said "this is why I love this car". The 300C remained stable and the body roll was better then the CTS, and Bonneville. When we got back to the dealership I told the salesman that I might concider buying the C, but I would have to come back again and take it for a ride without using the traction controll. That I neede to see what the car could really do. This would mean some controlled slides, spin outs and drifting. He didn't reply. I didn't go back to drive it again, but I will. I need to push this car as hard as I did the other two to know if I like it more then the CTS. I forgot to say that the C does have a nice Mercedes Benz auto stick transmission. It works something like a manual so you can pich your gear and have the RPM's where you want them for the most torque. I also like the looks of it's chopped top.

There is a chance that my wife will be driving the 300C instead of the cadillic CTS. It is a lot of car for the money.

[Marvel]

My wife has been driving Caravans and Town and Countrys for a few years, but switched to a Stratus this past summer. The small town Chrysler dealer here told her that since Mercedes got involved that his services and repairs have dropped 60 percent. This guy doesn't usually blow a lot of smoke, and I tend to believe him. The newer vehicles are great cars.

Marvel

[Champagne taste beer budget]

Allan, cudos on a very good choice of vehicle. Being in the car biz, we have subscriptions to several car rags, both the general consumer type, i.e. Road & Track, Auto Week, etc., and also the technical type, i.e. Motor, Brake And Front End, etc. There have been nothing but good comments from both sides on it. I'm a GM man myself, though that is certainly a tempting piece of machinery. I'm sure you'll be very pleased with it for several hundred thousand miles, or until you decide it's just time for something new, even if there's still nothing wrong with it.

As to the quality of the American made vehicle...

Chrysler made the K-car. Now the 300C. Or Viper.

Ford made the Pinto. Now the GT. Or Focus SVT for more approachable.

Chevy made the Vega. Now the Corvette C6, lotsa bang for the buck.

Although I personally feel fit and finish isn't up to par with the European or Japanese imports on MOST of the American made vehicles, there are exceptions. Quality of materials (plastics, cloth, etc.) is steadily improving, ergonomics are no doubt improved, fuel mileage is increasing steadily, and looks, of no minor importance, are getting better all the time. And things are looking better all the time for the future of American cars.

For you Chrysler fans:

http://autoweek.com/cat_content.mv?port_code=autoweek&cat_code=carnews&loc_code=&content_code=01732990

For you G.M. fans:

http://autoweek.com/search/search_display.mv?port_code=autoweek&cat_code=carnews&content_code=06912279&Search_Type=STD&Search_ID=2142648&record=6

I could find others that I would guess the average motoring public isn't aware of, but I need to cut this short to get home, storms coming in and don't want Becca and Claire alone in our lovely "Van Down By The River". (Actually a 14' trailer, smaller than some vans.

)

In closing, how do they compare to this?

http://autoweek.com/search/search_display.mv?port_code=autoweek&cat_code=reviews&content_code=05826548&Search_Type=STD&Search_ID=2142652&record=5

I know, pipe dreams, but then again, if they build it, they will come. Not saying I like the styling, or that I, nor likely anyone that reads this, could ever afford one, but they are out there. Kinda like the Ferrari Enzo; MSRP is 650K +/-, but they are for sale for 1-1.2 mil, with one caveat: you likely have to have an established relationship with the Ferrari dealership to buy one. In fact, Ferrari was in court a year or two ago when they tried to prevent anyone from purchasing an, I believe, F50 unless you signed a contract that you wouldn't sell the car for at least a year in an attempt to keep the marque true to it's performance minded owners rather than letting those with simply enough cash buy one to store for 5 years with out ever driving it and then sell for an exorbitant profit. I forget what heppened with the case, but now it's starting to do some SERIOUS rain, I gotta GET!!!

Once again, nice choice Allan, if it weren't for this pesky house building thing, I'd even look at one, even though I haven't owned a Chrysler product since the 1971 Dodge Monoco I had about 23 years ago, nice paisley interior and a hood you could picnic on, but that's another story.

[Champagne taste beer budget]

Q-Man: Nice review! I never knew you were a driver! Too many people crap their pants when things get "interesting" around curves. Doesn't the Bonne have a Traction Off button somewhere? Maybe not, but seems like it does, chances are if you were in it you'd have seen it, I've been in em, but usually only to pull into the shop for work and back out, maybe for a short test drive, never get a chance to check all the bells and whistles, and don't believe in "wringing out" a customers car. NOW I'M REALLY LEAVING!!!!

[Allan Songer]

There's a great road coming down from Signal Hill (a town smack dab in the middle of Long Beach that was until the last several years inhabitated by more oil wells than people, but now there are hundreds of $900,000 homes there that are built AROUND the oil wells---YUCK!) with a downhill decreasing radius turn that I took at 60 mph and had the sales guy crapping his pants. I didn't get into any 4-wheel drifts but I have to tell you this wagon handles BETTER than my parnter's BMW 525i wagon and it is WAAAAAY faster.

[Frank Speaker]

You want a Mercedes, I just know it. Go drive one.

Why settle for its little step sister?

Actually thats probably what youre buying (Mercedes) at way less money!

[Frank Speaker]

Heres the one to get. Oh what styling, and it costs less than 4 times what the Magnum costs. And did you know that all the window glass in a G55 is flat for easy replacement in remote areas or where kids throw a lot of rocks!

THE 2004 G55 AMG

The G55 AMG is the king of SUVs - combining the unique handbuilt G-Class design with unrivalled AMG performance.

MSRP $94,170.00

Engine AMG-built 5.5L 24-valve V-8 engine

Net Power 349 hp @ 5,500 rpm

Net Torque 387 lb-ft @ 3,000 rpm

0-60 mph in 7.2 seconds

Actually the E500 wagon is more like the Magnum but it costs..... a lot

THE 2004 E500 4MATIC WAGON

A powerful engine, luxurious interior, room for up to seven passengers combine with the confidence of full-time all-wheel drive in the E500 4MATIC Wagon.

MSRP $60,670.00

Engine 5.0L 24-valve V-8 engine

Net Power 302 hp @ 5,600 rpm

Net Torque 339 lb-ft @ 2,700-4,250 rpm

[dantfmly]

I'm starting to like the wagon, but i like the hemi powered 300c better. not fond of station wagons. But anyway it is nice to see the return of the rear drive v8 powered hemi family car return. i might just buy one instead of the hemi powered truck i want. well maybe not, well see.