formica Posted November 30, 2004 Share Posted November 30, 2004 I'm just thinking out loud... as I'm considering converting the pair of Klipschorn "D" models which I just bought into "B" style cabinets. This would be a "next summer" project... but the speakers should arrive at my place in about a week. Right now they are in varnished Birch plywood... and the previous owner added side grills, toe kick, and a top panel to the relatively clean original enclosures. I have not seen or heard them in person yet. Obviously I would have liked a pair of "B" style Khorns like everyone else... but these presented themselves in Canada at a reasonable price. I guess form follows function. The way I see it, I can 1. keep them as is... enjoy their sound. 2. restore them to factory "D" models with no top cabinet... (any collector appeal?) 3. convert them to "C" or "B" style and perhaps try a custom veneer. I don't mind buying another set in "B" style if they do turn up... in which case I'd resell these... and hence options 1 and 2. I've also toyed with the idea of experimenting with John Warren's JBL mods. The question is what would they be worth if they were converted to "B" style versus being a true pair of "B" or a "D". The carpentry and finishing skills required are well within my capabilities. But the label will still say "KD-BR"... and I wouldn't want to miss-represent them either. I'm just looking for different opinions, that perhaps i haven't thought about. I'll post some pictures in a minute... Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formica Posted November 30, 2004 Author Share Posted November 30, 2004 Front of speaker 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formica Posted November 30, 2004 Author Share Posted November 30, 2004 Front of speaker 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formica Posted November 30, 2004 Author Share Posted November 30, 2004 Back and side with access trap... and home made side grills Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formica Posted November 30, 2004 Author Share Posted November 30, 2004 last one... picture of top. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ricktate Posted November 30, 2004 Share Posted November 30, 2004 As good as those look i would just finish them off with front grills or leave them alone. The reason i changed mine to Bs is i had to take them all apart to veneer them so why not.But in your case they look pretty good from the pictures and to change those to Bs would be alot more work to. Rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-MAN Posted November 30, 2004 Share Posted November 30, 2004 Wow, Rob! those are HARDLY in need of a fancy veneer, IMO. I would do the B-style riser and grill cloth the top cab. I would make a front grill frame and cover the plywood edges of the top cab, so that essentially, the grill frame is dimensionally the same as the front of the top cab. Add a 1" riser, and hey, close enough to a "B" without all the work! DM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dylanl Posted November 30, 2004 Share Posted November 30, 2004 If you sill want to make the changes I have the specs. to do it. I posted them a while ago but cannot remember the thread name. If you need them let me know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formica Posted November 30, 2004 Author Share Posted November 30, 2004 ---------------- On 11/30/2004 4:08:31 PM D-MAN wrote: I would do the B-style riser and grill cloth the top cab.... Add a 1" riser, and hey, close enough to a "B" without all the work! ---------------- Yeah I know... but just a little more work and they would be model "B" clones. I'm leaving them as is, for now... but you have to admit it's tempting. ---------------- On 11/30/2004 9:16:50 PM Dylanl wrote: If you sill want to make the changes I have the specs. to do it. I posted them a while ago but cannot remember the thread name. If you need them let me know. ---------------- I think you are referring to this Model B spacer thread? I also have the side grill details you emailed me at that time. It's your info, with some cross checking, that would be the basis of the possible conversion... BTW, I'm a little off topic for technical questions... but I wanted to post this in Odd and Mods... and somehow I put here . Not a big difference as both forums share their frequent members anyways... Thanks for the input so far... Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triceratops Posted December 1, 2004 Share Posted December 1, 2004 Rob, I've always thought that "B" Klipschorns with the riser look so much better than the "C" style without--but that was before seeing your Khorns. They look gorgeous! I wouldn't change a thing. That expansive birch plywood on your Khorns looks even cooler than a pristine pair of birch raw La Scalas--and that is saying something! Best in horns, triceratops Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJkizak Posted December 1, 2004 Share Posted December 1, 2004 I wouldn't mess with the finish other than maybe reducing the size of the kickplate or no kickplate at all. The person operating the vacuum cleaner has to be outragiously careless to do any damage. Paint the sides and under top with black paint instead of grill cloth. It's easy and it works. You can't see anything when they are in a corner unless you have a spotlight on them. The grill cloth for the mid and high end horns can be tricky. I made mine out of the drop ceiling 1/2" squares plastic painted Corvette tobacco interior with black fibreglass screening as a base and some very thin flower pattern (by order of Starfleet Command) cloth over that with both hot melt glued to the back edges as tight as possible. Then using an iron to flatten the glued edges and then applying 1/2" square plastic over the edges with painted brass corners with a 1/4" hole drilled in them at a very precise spot. Also glued 8 5/8" nylon spacers with 1/4" holes into the grill then used 1/2" rubber inserts into the cabinet with 1/4 x20 threads. Used 2" x 1/4" dark colored fat head decorative allen bolts from home depot to fasten. Painted again using the Corvette Tobacco interior vinyl paint. The rubber inserts put the finished grill about 1/8" away from the surface of the cabinet and it is mounted in rubber kind of like the new Klipsch stuff. The 1/2 inch "U" shaped plastic was in the Oak floor transition kits at Home Depot for tile foors. The nylon spacers tighten against the rubber inserts. After doing all of this bullcrap I sure wish I could have purchased them. They look good though. JJK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted December 1, 2004 Share Posted December 1, 2004 shocking at first, but I like them, I like the look of horns! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formica Posted December 2, 2004 Author Share Posted December 2, 2004 ---------------- On 12/1/2004 8:12:15 PM Colin wrote: shocking at first, but I like them, I like the look of horns! ---------------- That was my impression first time as well. They kinda grow on you... but definitely low WAF. I think JJKIZAK is right about those toe kicks... but I don't know if there is any finish (varnish) behind them yet. My girlfriend hasn't seen them either, but I've made her aware that the speakers I bought are large and industrial looking. Her response was "bigger than the ones you have now??" Without a doubt. Thanks for the positive comments... Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dylanl Posted December 3, 2004 Share Posted December 3, 2004 I am making the same mod on my model C's. Before I place them on ebay, I am going to add the riser and veneer.I think by doing this I can get more than the way they are (white from factory). I may post my results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formica Posted December 3, 2004 Author Share Posted December 3, 2004 ---------------- On 12/3/2004 10:18:34 AM Dylanl wrote: I may post my results. ---------------- You may? I'd definitely enjoy seeing that! BTW, I hadn't recognized your Audiogon alias of "Brettl"... too bad you're the wrong side of the border and too far a drive from me, as your asking price was quite reasonable (you replied to my ad, and i saw your post on here too). Actually, I'm kinda surprised you didn't get any takers white "C" models and all. If you do decide to add the collar and veneer... I'd be curious on their resale appeal. For those wondering why I'm so cautious... well, I'm an old car fan and I prefer my classic cars stock when I buy them and keep them that way. You don't know how many times I cross a great car for sale with the worst mods possible (poor choices and workmanship) that make the vehicle worth next to nothing for anyone except it's owner. So for the Khorns, it's not that I'm intending to sell them, but with the amount of investment put into them... I'd hate to kill their value. Rob PS: With all the equipement changes, I guess I'll have to change my sig... and loose the html. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3dzapper Posted December 3, 2004 Share Posted December 3, 2004 Those are great looking D's! Over the years I have thought about making risers for my model C's many times. Then the thoughts of an additional 2+ inches in height and seperation between the bass and midrange elements and elevated soundstage have stopped me. Building a new top section should be no problem for a half decent woodworker. ( That leaves me out! ) That would help with the WAF by covering the maws of the horns. B or C design would be a matter of personal taste. Model D's were meant to be customized or built in by the end user. Raw birch units were meant to be finished by the same. Rob, you have a blank canvas upon which to practice your talents. Chose wisely. Rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-MAN Posted December 3, 2004 Share Posted December 3, 2004 Yeah, what Rick said. I would be tempted to leave them as is, they look just fine. Unless you're going to put them in the living room. That will have an impact on the decor, but I would think that they would go great as is with a Scandinavian look, lot's of clear finish birch and maple. DM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dylanl Posted December 3, 2004 Share Posted December 3, 2004 Formica, I still have the original woofers and left the original wires in place in case anyone would want to put them back to stock. Along with the sale you would have had it all, both sets of K33's and all original Alnico Drivers. IMO, It just seems that white does not have the appeal that veneer does. I have the talent & time to do the woodwork so why not. Maybe I will rethink the job & just veneer them as C's. Do you feel the overall value will go down if I change to B's? (YOUR QUOTE) "For those wondering why I'm so cautious... well, I'm an old car fan and I prefer my classic cars stock when I buy them and keep them that way. You don't know how many times I cross a great car for sale with the worst mods possible (poor choices and workmanship) that make the vehicle worth next to nothing for anyone except it's owner. So for the Khorns, it's not that I'm intending to sell them, but with the amount of investment put into them... I'd hate to kill their value. Rob" I also have interest in old cars like you. I have owned quite a few. I know a "HACK" when I see one. You do not fit the bill. Consider this, someone who has taken the time, refined their taste and reviewed all angles and landed with the Khorn setup as you & I have, it would be outragious to compare the changes you want to make to the Garage Man Mechanic mentality. I feel changes made if reversable ( that's the key ) should not bring down the value at all. Just save the original parts. Looking at your pictures that Kick plate must have been made for a giant. If you want stock that certainly is not. The original size was 1/2"W x 2"W so you are already out of the game so why worry. What is the serial number on those? Did they start out as utility models? Getting back to my garage & thinking out loud about my Khorn mods. I do have to admit that the primered car in my front yard might make a beautiful Khorn finish. How though can I get the peeling (rust) affect??? Hum, I am betting I get at least another 1M for the pair. Brilliant!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formica Posted December 4, 2004 Author Share Posted December 4, 2004 First off... I'd like to say that the Khorns arrived at my home today... on a huge pallet... all nicely wrapped. I'm having a great day. Unfortunately I finished work late, so I haven't even tried opening the coffin up... but x-mas is here early! Aren't we all a little cheesy posting everytime we get something new? ---------------- On 12/3/2004 12:45:42 PM Dylanl wrote: Formica, I still have the original woofers and left the original wires in place in case anyone would want to put them back to stock. Along with the sale you would have had it all, both sets of K33's and all original Alnico Drivers. ---------------- Definitely sounds like a car guy type of thing to do... keep the original parts. ---------------- It just seems that white does not have the appeal that veneer does. I have the talent & time to do the woodwork so why not. Maybe I will rethink the job & just veneer them as C's. Do you feel the overall value will go down if I change to B's? ---------------- You are probably right about white vs- wood... and I don't think they will loose value if you upgrade them to "B" but I'm not sure. That was somewhat the info I was looking for. ---------------- Looking at your pictures that Kick plate must have been made for a giant. If you want stock that certainly is not. The original size was 1/2"W x 2"W so you are already out of the game so why worry. What is the serial number on those? Did they start out as utility models? ---------------- The kick plates aren't original... and neither the top panel and side grills. They were added by the previous owner... as they really are n@ked "D" models. Actually my original option #2 two would be removing the added on parts and bring em back to true "D". All that would be left would be to buy the Scandinavian furniture to go with it... I'll post some pictures once they are out of the box. Right now I'm leaning towards the "B" conversion including new horn motor board so I can keep all original parts... well... original. Thanks again... Rob PS: they are 1978's KD-BR and serial 12S914 and 915. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dylanl Posted December 4, 2004 Share Posted December 4, 2004 Formica, it is kind of funny the feeliing you get when new audio equipment arrives. I think most of us would agree. Makes you feel kind of like a kid again in some ways doesn't it? I love the feeling, I am buying my second pair of Khorns now & I am excited as I was the 1st time. So, enjoy & let me know what you decide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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