Monster Cable mentality

[myriadcorp]

Avoid monster cables.

Over priced

Check out bluejeanscables.com and ac4l.com You can get some nice cables cheap. I spent $270 for my cables for my basment HT.

[Cleve]

----------------

On 12/21/2004 2:29:06 PM colterphoto1 wrote:

I'll never fall for the 'good' stuff again. Klipsch would do well to eliminate this from it's marketing jargon as it just shows how they have done the same swan dive into the mung!

Michael my .02

----------------

Amen! Paul Klipsch didn't need no stinking Monster Cables.

[boomer9911]

do you sell svs on the side, just curious...

[Fish]

You do need good quality cables,that is cables that are of sufficient guage and/or shielding and reasonably well constructed.

Just about anything besides the free stuff will suffice,imo.

[Griffinator]

----------------

On 12/21/2004 10:42:30 PM Fish wrote:

You do need good quality cables,that is cables that are of sufficient guage and/or shielding and reasonably well constructed.

Just about anything besides the free stuff will suffice,imo.

----------------

I don't know that I'd go that far. There are a few of people on these forums who believe that attaching RCA ends to cheap coax is a perfect solution. I'm of the mind that these people have no idea what they're talking about.

[kenratboy]

----------------

On 12/21/2004 9:17:32 AM Griffinator wrote:

While I believe in good quality, well constructed cabling, I also believe that Monster has the worst price/performance ratio of any cable in the business. Their cables are fragile, easily compromised, and in general not as well built as similarly priced cabling by other brands. When I went into business selling and installing home theater, I went out of my way to find other cable brands for my installations, simply because I didn't want to deal with the headache of coming back to someone's home to replace a cable that had broken or otherwise degraded prematurely.

I include Ultralink cables with my standard installations, and if someone really wants an expensive esoteric cable, I offer them XLO.

Rat Shack has now embraced the Monster brand for the same reason Best Buy and Circuit City did - the gross profit margins are absolutely ludicrous.

----------------

Griff, I'm sure your making a nice chunk of change on your cable sales, just as every other electronic retailer is. Nothing wrong with that, but are you somehow above everyone else?

[Steve_L]

Thanks for the alternative bluejeancables link.

Much appreciated.

[Steve_L]

----------------

On 12/21/2004 8:58:17 PM boomer9911 wrote:

I will say, I DO support Monster Cable and their line of power conditionerssurge protectors...

I saw a picture here posted by a member from the original trek to Hope in 01, that showed a pair of Khorns powered by an Adcom GFA-555 I believe, and hooked up to Monster Cable...could PWK be wrong...doubt it...

North American made all around...

----------------

I have my doubts about the Monster Cable "power conditioner/surge protectors" too. I see the same mania

behavior from the sales guys when I ask about them. (their hair stands on end, their eyes glaze over and a

robotic tone takes over their vocal chords.)

I do think they are nice from a physical keep all the wiring nice and neat and add a layer of surge protection

between the power compnay/street and the expensive circuitry. I'm guessing many other brands at much more

reasonable cost do an adequate job.

[Griffinator]

----------------

On 12/22/2004 1:13:42 AM kenratboy wrote:

Griff, I'm sure your making a nice chunk of change on your cable sales, just as every other electronic retailer is. Nothing wrong with that, but are you somehow above everyone else?

----------------

Actually, I don't, Ken. When someone buys the cables by themselves, I sell them at deep discount off of retail. When someone buys a package from me, I give them the cables. As a result, my customers respect me for not trying to schlep cables on them, and I still make money on the installation labor and gross profit from the entire package, which is (even with the cable giveaway) somewhere in the neighborhood of about 25%. That's a solid profit margin for me, considering that my A/V system packages start at around $10,000 installed.

[Tom Adams]

Steve_L - If you order anything from BlueJeans Cable, I think you'll be very pleased. I needed (7) XLR balanced cables to connect my B&K to my Sherbourn. I got 6 foot cables @ $27 each. Other brands, including Monster, were on the order of $70 each. I defy someone to be able to tell the difference in the two in a true double blind test.

The griff said: "There are a few of people on these forums who believe that attaching RCA ends to cheap coax is a perfect solution. I'm of the mind that these people have no idea what they're talking about."

Careful there Pilgrim - I resemble that remark. Just because you worked at BB and now package $10K+ systems doesn't qualify you to level that kinda accusation. I've got a run of "cheap coax" (RG6 quad shield) from my rack to my sub location for my sub and it's terminated with RCA's. This is a standard practice for many custom installers. I've measured the resistance and it's nil. And I've read a few articles that says there is nothing wrong doing this. Would I use it for speaker wire? No - there's cheap speaker wire at Home Depot for that.

It's ok to have an opinion Griff - just don't be opinionated.

Tom

[gcoker]

Just my 2 cents but I tend to spend more per say

on the video side then the audio side of cables.

[Griffinator]

You're right, Tom.

Let me give a bit more detail on that statement.

There are those on this forum that believe that cheap coax with RCA ends is the appropriate solution for any and all connections, whether video, analog, or digital audio.

For a sub, I can see where quad-shield RG6 with RCA terminations could work reasonably well, since it's a very narrowband signal being transmitted.

However, for megahertz-bandwidth video and digital audio, you'll never convince me that RG6 is a good idea.

[colterphoto1]

Hey Griff,

You seem up on the topic, so here goes. I have three systems in house, Main LR HT/music with Corns, Office with iMac jukebox, and Basement mini-theatre rig.

I would like to interconnect the three on a line-level basis, so that the 'tape' out of main rig would play through all the other systems. This would be probably 50-80 foot runs of line level. How would you run this? I think I've heard an answer of good RG6 with RCA ends. WOuld this really work or would I need to use imp transformers at both ends and run line PA snake with hi-imp at each end and lo-imp through most of length of run?

Thanks,

Michael

[dodger]

Okay Griff,

I have respect for you. I know how I would do this. Let's see if we are close.

BTW: Merry Christmas and have a great New Year. Hope business is great.

dodger

BTW: Michael: you have not changed your sig yet.

[Griffinator]

----------------

On 12/22/2004 4:01:08 PM colterphoto1 wrote:

Hey Griff,

You seem up on the topic, so here goes. I have three systems in house, Main LR HT/music with Corns, Office with iMac jukebox, and Basement mini-theatre rig.

I would like to interconnect the three on a line-level basis, so that the 'tape' out of main rig would play through all the other systems. This would be probably 50-80 foot runs of line level. How would you run this? I think I've heard an answer of good RG6 with RCA ends. WOuld this really work or would I need to use imp transformers at both ends and run line PA snake with hi-imp at each end and lo-imp through most of length of run?

Thanks,

Michael

----------------

Simple.

I'd use twisted-pair CL3-rated inwall speaker wire to pull this off. Takes care of the in-line noise issue without distorting the sound like a pair of transformers on either end would.

And there's no way I'd use RG6 - I've heard the difference between quad RG6 and heavy-gauge two-conducter on short runs (i.e. <2M) and I've no doubt that heavy-gauge hot wire is going to maintain signal fidelity better than single-strand (RG6) will on long runs.

[AngryOrb]

Actually, Indy, I went to the Pilgrimage last year (in 2004) and I took the test twice. The first time I got 13 out of 13 correct. Then I found out that the test was set up incorrectly and it made it too easy to distinguish the nuances from the two sets of cables. So, I had to see if I could tell the differences after they corrected the mistake. And... lo and behold... I got 13 out of 13 - again. I'm not saying that I have golden ears, but I was able to tell the cables apart. When I was asked which ones were the better of the two (based on my listening to the ABX), I guessed that correctly also. Maybe it was luck. Maybe it was just that I really tried to hear the difference... or maybe it has something to do with one of my ears having a perforation in the eardrum and it allowed for some variation of the sound to be noticed. I have no clue. But I do know that I was able to "on a consistent basis... really identify a difference".

I think there are nuances in the way a cable transmits sound (And I'm no electrical student as you can tell by my words), but it may be so subtle that you really have to pay attention to the audio in certain ranges of sound and be in the right environment. Meaning that if you're playing Classical music you might be able to hear the differences better than you could if you were listening to say a movie or rock music because of all the variations that come in those particular sounds... the range changes so much that your ears often can barely hear words or are shocked with thunders or claps or explosions that they may not have time to adjust to the specifics when trying to distinguish the subtleties in the cables. And let's not forget (depending on the shielding) that even a halogen lamp a few feet away from a receiver can cause a huge amount of interference; and with all that interference, you're definitely not going to hear the subtle differences in the cables... your ears will be fixated on one thing... the humming in the background coming from that lamp. For that matter, you probably wouldn't be able to hear the difference at all in a BB store with hundreds of people talking and music playing in the background.

Additionally, it's going to be hard to tell the difference if you're watching a 60 second clip of a movie and you have to restart that 60 second clip to switch to different cables or different speakers! because your ears have adjusted to the sound during the replay of that 60 second clip... and (most importantly) because of any pause or delay between the replay (or even length of audio clip) your ears have most likely forgot what they just heard! Now, if you're lucky enough to sit in a quiet room (as those of us who went to the pilgrimage were able to do), with no halogen lamps, while listening to one entire song of Classical music, playing through one set of speakers, using an ABX box to switch between two sets of cables and! can switch the cable selection remotely and not have to move or restart the song... you're should be able to hear some difference when you press that A or B button. There is not a doubt in my mind. The reason I say this is because there is no delay from what you heard to what you are hearing. And since most classical music or drawn out notes can be switched easily before the notes change, your ears can more easily distinguish the nuances over having to get up and disconnect or having to restart what you just heard. Again... your ears can forget what they heard just a few seconds ago. So... I think it is possible to hear differences in cables, as long as the test is done in the right environment. If you can't hear a difference, no big deal. In the end, it comes down to your preference or - more accurately - perception of what sounds best. Other than that, it doesn't matter how much you spend on the cables if they don't sound any better to you (the person listening).

Just my copper wire opinion.

Angry<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

[ScorpsFan]

I have both, a 60" Sony LCD projection TV and the 46" Samsung DLP projection TV, the colors are minutely deeper on the Samsung while the picture is smoother on the Sony, I have some discs for tweaking the picture but instead have used factory settings with minor adjustments and they are both good choices. The prices have dropped significantly on older models as new ones have come out recently.

As far as cables, I use a combination, mostly through a "best I can find for the $$$" philosophy, have some almost 20 yr. old "Original Monster" speaker wire which look as good a new and seem to work well for me. I also have some Tributaries as well as some Knuconceptz interconnects, and am looking at both Bluejeans cable as well as AVcables.com replacements.

Part of the "fun" for me is testing out inexpensive alternatives to the "hyped products" and learning from all of the knowledgeable people on this forum.

Welcome and best of luck with your choices.

[pathighgate]

In a way, I like the Monster (or any brand of over-priced)

cables. They offer a great starting

point when you are trying out a new audio store. You walk in, say hello to the salesman, let

him know what youre looking for and how much youre willing to spend. But prior to talking about equipment,

options, pricing and the like, you pose a very simple question:

Before we get started, Im curious about speaker

cable. I want to get a good sound, but I

dont want to pay more money then I need to.

Are these expensive cables worth it?

If the salesman says something to the effect of Some people

claim to be able to tell the difference.

In reality youd be better off--and would have a much more noticeable improvement--if

you spend $200-$400 more on better speakers/amp rather then laying down the

same amount of money on spool of Monster cables., then you know he or she is

probably on the up and up, and youre probably going to be directed towards

gear that sounds good, as opposed to what looks good or what theyre paying

spiffs out on that week.

On the other hand, if the salesperson lights up when you ask

him that question, explaining in a techno-speak gibberish that you need the

best darn cables you can afford. When

they tell you that your system wont sound good without the expensive cables,

or that you need to spend upwards of 25% of your entire sound budget on cables

. . . when that happens, you simply politely thank the sales person, walk out the

door and never come back.

There; you just saved yourself hundreds of dollars and

countless headaches which would inevitably come with dealing with a store which

holds a policy of fleecing their customers who dont know any better.

What Ive been curious about lately is the emergence of power

conditioners. Ive heard a lot of

different opinions, ranging from worthless to they improve the quality of the

audio and video produced by your equipment very noticeably. .

A few weeks ago I went to the local best buys Magnolia store,

and they confirmed that the higher priced power systems do indeed improve the

fidelity of your music and audio for HT, as well as the picture on your

television. I am by no means an expert

on electronics, but I fail to see how better (massaged, as one salesman put

it) power makes a difference in how the sound works. My B.S. alarm instinctively was activated and

I probed more. It seemed like the more

specific my questions became, the more vague their responses were. It reminded me why, other then buying DVDs, I

dont go to Best Buy.

Today I was driving home and saw I was close to a very good

locally owned/operated shop here in town.

These guys manage to never set off my B.S. alarm at all, a rare

feat. (they have a pretty telling view

about speakers on their webpage; http://www.custom-tv.com/myths/ ) .

They gave me a more rational explanation: power conditioners are little more then very

good surge protectors. Other then

keeping your audio gear safe from electrical disturbances and filtering out

interference from your various components, the really dont do much. The salesman confirmed my suspicion that the quality

of music your stereo system produces has very little to do with what kind of

power you have.

Its honesty like that which keeps me shopping at those

kinds of places rather then Best Buy.

[wally flick]

Id have to give props to bluejeans cables as well. Also I didnt see anyone address the Harmony remote. Id say he was correct on 50% of his advice although Id look for a better price, bought mine on-line. Ive got a 55 Sony LCD (projection) that Im very happy with.