Scp53 Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 ive have decided to build a diy sub. i have a 250watt plate amp from PE and think im going to get the atlas 12 or 15. has anyone on here used one before? it looks like a pretty nice driver for the money but i havent modeled it yet. i have decided that i want a cleaner sound than my titanic(not that the titanic isnt) with out stressing the driver(works too hard for my use). im hopeing to build this and put an end to the "sub hunt". my other option is the adire tempest. my budget for the driver and cab togather is $200 and the cab cant be bigger than the 6cu.ft. ill be using it for music and movies and want to hit 16hz in room with decent spl(i was told i could but havent modeled it my self yet). the TOP goal is VERY clean sound. the cab is going to be made of mdf and braced and will be painted as a temperary thing(want to put all $ in performance not looks). thanks for any input. scp53 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olorin Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 I think it will be a challenge to achieve all your goals with this driver and 250 watts. EDIT: I took out the big honking pictures since they didn't help as much as I thought they would. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scp53 Posted March 17, 2005 Author Share Posted March 17, 2005 i just talked to the MAKER of these subs(i read numerous post on boards too, so im not buying off talking to the sales/designer person). i m 99.9% sure im gonna get the atlas 15in in a 3-3.5 cu. ft box. has a 3year warrenty and has BOTTOMLESS suspension. wow. plus a VERY light cone and excellent motor(xbl). i think my titanic is gonna get schooled by it. and just to show how light the cone is, my titanics cone is heavier than the atlas 15in cone. anyone on here have a ascendant sub yet? and Olorin, i found out that 250watts is what the sub was designed for. so power wont be a problem. id go for a avalanche but that cost more and i dont have the power for it right now. any one got any comments about this sub ill build? scp53 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olorin Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 I've been thinking of using them myself, but in a different configuration. I'm interested in how yours turns out. You planning on vented or sealed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scp53 Posted March 17, 2005 Author Share Posted March 17, 2005 ill be sure to tell you how it turns out. its gonna be sealed ina ~4cu. ft box with 4lbs of poly fill and powered by my 250watt plate amp. I should be hitting 20hz in room easily(hopefully if the room has decent acousitics). right now im a little worried though, i didnt get my confirmation email. i think he got the wrong email address or something. i guess ill call him tomorrow. either that or the email just hasnt been sent out yet(he was working 1.5hrs past when they closed). scp53 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tpg Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scp53 Posted March 17, 2005 Author Share Posted March 17, 2005 yea, Chad is the man i talked to. VERY nice person and VERY VERY VERY smart imo(at least with speakers). he answered EVERY question i had and then some. i can hardly wait to get this sub and put it togather. i suppose ill have to get a digital camera to take some pics because everyone will want to see it. ill say right now its not going to be pretty at first. ill build the cab and such and put a nice paint job or something on it later. its going look like mdf for a week or so for sure. i wont be able to see it anyways when im in the dark watching lotr . ill update the thread when i get the driver and then put it togather. scp53 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formica Posted March 18, 2005 Share Posted March 18, 2005 I'm also a fan of the Ascendant Audio products... esp given I have a IB in the works. They have one of the only long throw 18" subwoofer drivers around... and it features XBL to boot. I know... it's a little bigger and more expensive than your entire budget. As for the Atlas series... did you model it yet? I didn't take the time to re-verify the TS parameters I have... but if I recall, it prefers large enclosures? Obviously not as critical if you are going sealed. I'd run some numbers on it, the Tempest, Titanic 15", etc... just to be sure. It will give you significantly more SPL than the Titanic 10" in any case... Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digjr Posted March 18, 2005 Share Posted March 18, 2005 Hi, Looks like you are a little undecicded on an enclosure. Have you given a sealed tube any thought? A little less chance for distortion with no corners. After building a half dozen boxes or so I settled on a PVC (heavy walled about 3/4" thick) 18" dia. x 28" high tube. I enclosed the ends with 1 1/2" (2 pcs 3/4") of mdf, wrapped the inside with some damping material and another layer of 3 1/2" insulation. It started out vented but I ended up sealing it and have been very pleased. I am using the Eminence Lab12 Gen II. I included a shot of the setup incuding the PE 250 watt amp in a seperate enclosure. It sits in a kneewall/closet behind the TV so you don't see the ugly plywood patch! Rob's sub is beautiful, well made, a real work of art. Just an option for you to ponder. Don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scp53 Posted March 18, 2005 Author Share Posted March 18, 2005 I just talked to Chad and went off what i heard on the avsforum and decided i could deal with a larger cab. right now im thinking of making a 4cu. ft. box sealed but i may consider the tube idea. i plan to use 3/4in mdf for all walls and double thinkness on the front baffle. i need to go to PE's site and order some mounting screws and hurican nuts or something(the screws or bolts will need to be quite long because the baffle is thick). then i'll brace it internally with some mdf and stuff 4lbs of poly fill in it. while im at PE's site, what should i cover the cab with? should i buy a paint or something(needs to be cheap though)? i asked Chad about using spikes or feet of some kind and he said it wont help. He said as long as it stays put and doent move around the cab can sit right on the floor. I think i still may get some cheap spikes or something. and at the moment i dont plan for getting a grill. what do you guys think? i have no animals or kids around that could damage it. scp53 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scp53 Posted March 18, 2005 Author Share Posted March 18, 2005 heres a diagram that i made of the enclousure im going to make. by the way, this isnt the final model, i might go with a tube still. i think ill need to find out more info though so i make the tube correctly. scp53 edit- cant seem to get pic to come up on thread? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikie Posted March 18, 2005 Share Posted March 18, 2005 Digjr, I'd be interested in more info about your tube sub. Sounds a little easier than building a box enclosure - I'd appreciate your input on this. I'm still trying to decide how to proceed with my sub. I'll build something, either a 15" PE Titanic or something custom - don't know yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meuge Posted March 18, 2005 Share Posted March 18, 2005 You really should get the spikes... The ones at PE's site are not expensive (under $20) and they will really keep the sub from vibrating. Get the golden ones - they look nice. As far as appearance, the easiest thing to do would be to just use vinyl (you can get nice cherrywood-looking vinyl from PE as well). It's peel-and-stick... and should look better than a painted box. If you want the paint to look good, you'll have to go through a long process of sanding, using a primer... and several coats of paint with sanding between them. My only concern would be that the 250W plate amp might not be powerful enough for that driver. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formica Posted March 19, 2005 Share Posted March 19, 2005 ---------------- On 3/18/2005 10:51:02 PM meuge wrote: You really should get the spikes... Get the golden ones - they look nice. ---------------- Yes... they are alot about looks. Either spikes (carpet) or rubber feet (hard surface) can keep your sub from moving around. That is their only objective other than looking nice. Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scp53 Posted March 19, 2005 Author Share Posted March 19, 2005 i think im gonna stay cheap and use rubber feet(go to local hardware store). as far as finish, i think ill leave it mdf for a week or two till i decide for sure what i want it to be. on second thought, i could use the spikes on the titanic i have right now. those are silver and look pretty nice. the titanic will be sitting for a while till i get the 240 watt plate amp(or by a car amp and put it in my car). and for power, i looked on the website and talked to Chad(the designer and owner) and he said it was made SPECIFICALLY for 250-300 watt amps. so mine fits in that area, no problem. scp53 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formica Posted March 19, 2005 Share Posted March 19, 2005 ---------------- On 3/19/2005 2:03:43 PM Scp53 wrote: i looked on the website and talked to Chad(the designer and owner) and he said it was made SPECIFICALLY for 250-300 watt amps. so mine fits in that area, no problem. ---------------- Yes, they (Atlas drivers) trade box size for efficiency... so you don't need alot of power but need a relatively large box. Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scp53 Posted March 19, 2005 Author Share Posted March 19, 2005 Rob, could you look at the frequency vs spl for the atlas 15 on their webpage. http://ascendantaudio.com/Atlas%2015%20recommended%20enclosures.htm what q should i wire it for? i want to keep box size small so its either the low or mid q. seems like the low q in a 4cu.ft box would roll off quite early compared to mid q in the same box. will room gain make up for this? can i count on room gain giving the real low freq a boost? what im really asking is what enclosure size should i use? that "sharp" roll off listed on that graph(low q one) on their site bothers me a little. i do plan on using poly fill so will that boost the low end spl wise? or is that just for extension more so? the main goal is to have a tight musical sub(from what ive heard sealed or ported are both musical and tight) that has enough depth to be decent at ht. thanks for any help scp53 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formica Posted March 19, 2005 Share Posted March 19, 2005 Hmmmm you are now faced with one of the most significant tradeoffs subwoofer designers have to make. Hoffman's Iron Law of efficiency / size / bass extension. Since you already have the high efficiency as a given... you are left with size and bass extension. The answer is pretty simple... build the biggest box you are willing to live with. I'd stick with a Qtc on 0.707 which is a good trade between dry bass (Qtc 0.5) and thumpy bass (Qtc 0.9). So you have the 3.7ft3 for the Sealed alignments for .37 Qts setting .... or .... 7.8ft3 for the Sealed alignments for .45 Qts setting .... or .... Note that stuffing a cabinet will usually make it appear larger than it's true volume, but Chad has already taken this into account in the "recommended" designs. I would also consider the ported version at: 6.5ft3 for the ported 21Hz alignments with Atlas 15 set to Qts of .37 I find 7.8ft3 a little large for a sealed unit... and you might as well build a 6.5ft3 ported sub... and have the option of plugging the port. Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scp53 Posted March 19, 2005 Author Share Posted March 19, 2005 could you answer about "flatness" please. if i did go with a qts setting of .37 in a 3.7-4ft3 box would the bass be flat? that graph shows it slopeing down starting at 70hz or so. and if i do consider a 6.7ft3 cab ported, does port placment make a big difference? i mean on the side on the front baffle,etc? and i see that power handling goes down when its not ported vs ported in the same size cab and same qts setting. did i read the charts right? maybe ill have to call Chad up again and talk to him about the cab. scp53 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scp53 Posted March 20, 2005 Author Share Posted March 20, 2005 Well i just got the driver today and its NICE!!! have to get that box built now! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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