Tom Adams Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 Due to how my HT is configured, it's impractical to place (2) THX120's along the front wall. However, I could stack them vertically in the corner where my KSW-15 currently resides. Would this be acceptable or would there be issues? TIA. Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 If that's a good spot (room wise) for your current sub, the stacked THX's should do well there also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEAR Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 Due to how my HT is configured, it's impractical to place (2) THX120's along the front wall. However, I could stack them vertically in the corner where my KSW-15 currently resides. Would this be acceptable or would there be issues? TIA. Tom There you have it,stacked config in the corner(where the KSW15 resides). You should(yeah right,WILL)hear quite a increase in deep bass definition,power and depth. [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 Is it possible to put one in each corner? After moving to "stereo" subs (not discrete in my case) I could never go back to that unbalanced bass image. But ya, if you don't mind that factor then stacked in the corner is an ideal way to go about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEAR Posted January 18, 2006 Share Posted January 18, 2006 Unbalanced bass image! [] Cut too high yes,cut low with larger mains there is NO bass image,deep bass below 40Hz has NO image.This is IF the sub is a real sub and working only with very deep bass(40Hz down). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 Even with say a 40Hz or even 30Hz crossover it still feels unbalanced. You don't exactly have directionality with your ears at those low frequencies, but you can certainly feel the shockwave... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frzninvt Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 I have my dual Velo's next to each Klipschorn and I did notice a sonic improvement setting them up this way, but the biggest improvement was adding the 2nd one though. I am getting a 3rd one this weekend that I will stack on one of the others. My NAD T163 has dual subwoofer outputs, and the Sherbourn PT-7010A that I am going to replace it with has four subwoofer outputs - Woo Hoo! Three 15" Velodyne FSR-15 Servo's should pin me to the back wall I would think, not even counting the other 7 15" horn loaded woofers in the room. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Adams Posted January 19, 2006 Author Share Posted January 19, 2006 Is it possible to put one in each corner? After moving to "stereo" subs (not discrete in my case) I could never go back to that unbalanced bass image. But ya, if you don't mind that factor then stacked in the corner is an ideal way to go about it. First - thanks for the feedback. [Y] As for what you're suggesting DrWho....the problem is that when I wired the room, I ran RG6U to the location where my present KSW-15 is which, as it happens, is in the front right corner. I know, I know....I took a chance that that location would be ideal. And I'm sure that there's probably a better location in the room for a sub. I just felt that it would probably be the least compromising location. Anyhow..... The reason I said it would be impratical is that in order to have the dual 120's along the front wall or in the front two corners is that I would have to some how get a cable on/over/through the stage. I mean, I could run a cable across the back of the stage, but it would be visible and I'm not sure I could live with that. So, I got to wondering if the things could be stacked. Hope that makes sense. Here....this pic might clear things up. BTW, I'm really struggling with the decision to go dual 120's or a single new Ref 12d. Again - thanks to all. [] Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 Oh wow, I didn't make the connection that this was your room until you posted the pic...lol Now that I see what you're thinking I wanted to make one comment...Putting the sub in the front right corner behind the cornwall isn't a very ideal approach...not that the corner itself is a bad position, but the cornwall just in front is turning the space behind it into a helmholtz resonator. Just eyeballing the dimensions I bet you're noticing some suckout in the 80Hz region (making it less punchy). I suppose with an 80Hz crossover and a variable phase control that you could tweak your way out of the situation...or maybe I'm just over thinking things [] As an alternative I would recommend putting your sub up on the stage (provided the stage is well damped). To maintain visual symmetry the KW's would be perfect with one on each side. Anyways, what does the underside of the lip surrounding the stage look like? In many a church setting we have run cables tucked up in the corners and you would never know it was there unless you got down on the floor and looked up. I think it would be real easy to run some cables around in that direction...they make these little cable holder pinching things that you can use to keep the wire snug against the top. Another alternative for the wiring would be to drill a hole on each side of the stage and fish a wire through. Is there a space behind the black stuff surround the screen? I noticed that you've got the molding going around and it looks like the blackstuff sits in front of that...that little 1/2" or so would be plenty of space for a wire run. So all that said...the shape of the RT-12 would make it a very poor performer tucked in the corner behind the cornwall. If mounting on the stage is a no go then I would recommend sticking with the KW's with one in each corner pointing towards the middle of the room. In fact, I would go ahead and tuck the speaker all the way up against the side wall too, so as to get rid of the trapped air space. Going this route I would recommend a slightly lower crossover setting (like 40-60Hz instead of the normal 80) - but no worries, your cornwalls will keep up just fine. The RT-12 could be placed on the stage though...and a pair of those would probably demolish the Ultras [H] Btw, have you considered a DIY approach? You could totally custom build a subwoofer enclosure that would fit behind the cornwalls with an angled face on the inside edge...that'd be about 16 cubic feet per side? (the unused space behind the cornwalls). I can think of quite a few DIY approaches that would demolish the klipsch subs and cost you less too (well maybe the same if you wanted a really elaborate cabinet). Let's see here...that'd come to about 130dB with an F3 of 16Hz [H] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEAR Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 DrWHO, Bass shockwave,sounds like a case here. In a larger room where a sub is positioned near or in a corner on one side this makes sense.In smaller room where you have compression this will be a non issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEAR Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 Tom,, Looking at the BIG picture it is easy to spot a few very good spots to place dual subs.In either corner stacked,or on the "stage" under the screen on each side of the center channel.Since this is a bigger room and you would need a huge sub to win against the room so to speak. I would opt for placement on each side of the center channel. With dual THX120and the like(SVS Ultra,HGS18's) subs you will have plenty of headroom.No corner loading needed,and corner loading ALWAYS results in frequency dips and bumps. Nice theater [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Adams Posted January 20, 2006 Author Share Posted January 20, 2006 Alright, alright.....I give!! Sheesh. Just kidding....Seriously though, you guys have convinced me to re-think some things and your suggestions have triggered some solutions. Since the walls to either side of the stage will be covered by floor to ceiling drapes, I can hide the cabling from the amp to one 120 and via some "tucking" I believe I could hide the cable to the other 120. The amp then will reside (hidden) behind the right Cornwall. Hmmmmm......... BTW DrWho....could you elaborate a bit more about your DIY idea? I'm fairly certain I can cobble up some wood and hell, I even own a soldering iron! LOL...... Again, much thanks guys. Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay481985 Posted January 20, 2006 Share Posted January 20, 2006 ascendant audio just are releasing their new lines of subs. Adire audio tumults 15d2 are in limited supply (I am getting two very soon) good time to get a diy sub. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted January 20, 2006 Share Posted January 20, 2006 BTW DrWho....could you elaborate a bit more about your DIY idea? I'm fairly certain I can cobble up some wood and hell, I even own a soldering iron! LOL...... Just give me a budget and some specific dimensions and I'd be more than willing to design it all for you. I was thinking something like two 15" drivers per side with a 2000 watt amplifier powering all 4. 15 cubic feet per side tuned to around 20Hz would get four 15" titanics up to 128dB with an F3 around 18Hz. Or if you're patient and want to wait for the newer drivers to come out you could either go for more SPL (totally a waste) or you could probably extend your response down to 10-15Hz [H] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndyKlipschFan Posted January 20, 2006 Share Posted January 20, 2006 Tom just feed the line under the stage... The two subs are very black and will dissapear I am sure to both sides of your center Heresey. And, they are of course, front firing and will go great with your other Heritage selections. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Adams Posted January 22, 2006 Author Share Posted January 22, 2006 BTW DrWho....could you elaborate a bit more about your DIY idea? I'm fairly certain I can cobble up some wood and hell, I even own a soldering iron! LOL...... Just give me a budget and some specific dimensions and I'd be more than willing to design it all for you. I was thinking something like two 15" drivers per side with a 2000 watt amplifier powering all 4. 15 cubic feet per side tuned to around 20Hz would get four 15" titanics up to 128dB with an F3 around 18Hz. Or if you're patient and want to wait for the newer drivers to come out you could either go for more SPL (totally a waste) or you could probably extend your response down to 10-15Hz [H] I'd like to stay around $1000 but that's just a WAG since I have no idea what material costs for DIY would be. If I were purchasing ready made sub(s), my budget would be under $2000. So I'm just figuring 50% less. Am I off base???? As for the size of the room, it is 28' long, 15' wide, and the ceiling vaults up at a 45 degree angle from the 6' knee walls to 9'. If you look at the above photo, you'll get an idea of what a cross-section of the room looks like. It is a completely sealed room - i.e. the two doors at the rear of the room are exterior type doors that have seals all the way around the jamb. Anything else?? Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Adams Posted January 22, 2006 Author Share Posted January 22, 2006 Tom just feed the line under the stage... The two subs are very black and will dissapear I am sure to both sides of your center Heresey. And, they are of course, front firing and will go great with your other Heritage selections. Hey Indy - I'd like to do that but the problem is that there's all kind of cross bracing under the stage floor. I'd have to have a drill bit that was 12' long! [] I think I can just run the cables along the bottom of the black wall where it meets the stage flooring. Worse comes to worse, I can run the cables like described and cover them with some moulding or some such thing. I will say though that if I decide to forego the DIY route, I'm probably gonna do the dual 120THX's on stage. I saw them this past weekend at my local Klipsch dealer, but didn't get to hear them. The room they were in was being re-done and I didn't have time to hang around while they moved them to another system. Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted January 22, 2006 Share Posted January 22, 2006 About how far from the walls are your cornwalls? I was thinking it'd be cool to tuck a sub in the corner behind each one with an angled baffle off the inner side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remotia Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 Even with say a 40Hz or even 30Hz crossover it still feels unbalanced. You don't exactly have directionality with your ears at those low frequencies, but you can certainly feel the shockwave... no DrWho, it would only be a "shockwave" if your subwoofers were moving at about 760 mph at you.... in which case.. get teh **** out the way! http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&q=speed+of+sound&btnG=Search Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Adams Posted January 25, 2006 Author Share Posted January 25, 2006 About how far from the walls are your cornwalls? I was thinking it'd be cool to tuck a sub in the corner behind each one with an angled baffle off the inner side. Presently I've moved my KSW-15 onto the stage (which has made a decent difference for the good) and pushed the Corns back to within 1' of the wall behind them and about 6" from the side walls. Before, with the KSW behind the right Cornwall, I had the Corns pulled out around 3' from the wall behind them. Thanks guys for all your help with this. I'm really getting the DIY bug. Is that a bad thing?? [] Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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