Tarheel Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 I have been told the Altec 902/511b is not the combination I want in the LaScala modification. The 811b was suggested with the 902s. " Your plans sound good but you do not need to crossover so low that you need 511 horns. "The LS woofer will go higher. Cross over at 700hz and use the 902s with the 811b horn instead". Can I try the 902s and 811b with BEC crossover that I now have that cross at 400hz(?) or must the xover be modded to cross at 700hz or will the xover recognize the different horn and adjust? I just want to sit the horns and drivers on top of the cabinet and listen fo awhile before I build a new set of scalas. All this is to deal with the midrange that I do not like. Comments appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrestonTom Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 Every once in awhile I toy with this idea also. So I am interested in how this works out. Most folks pair the 511 with the 902, can you give a bit more detail about why you are selecting the 811 instead? -Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 both of my fav Altec's ... X-over @ 800 - 1200hz... most of the other speakers i like also crossover 800 - 1200 hz THO ....they are Direct Radiators they are not 'Scala's, w/ a horn loaded woof ... i'd say .... hafta hear it .. Can't See how it's gonna work Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest " " Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 "Can I try the 902s and 811b with BEC crossover that I now have that cross at 400hz(?) or must the xover be modded to cross at 700hz or will the xover recognize the different horn and adjust?" Those are AA xovers. The slope on those xovers are identical to the klipsch design. A lot of the heritage sound that folks like. is a function of how the mid horn and tweeter horn contribute to furthur taper off the sound. Having said that, I' not sure that the LaScala bass bin can actually meet the 811's natural horn rolloff. The Belle can come closer. The LaScala has a restricted 90 degree turn that does not expand for 7.5 inches. The function of this arrangement actually lowers the effective upper response ceilng of the LaScala bass bin. This is often refered to as cabinet capacatence. A lot of folks feel the LaScala bass bin can be functional up to 600hz . Can I suggest you look into Al's wooden trackhorn. Reports are that the midrange sound is impressive. Having had wooden midrange horns that extended down to 250hz in the past, I can tell you that the k-400, the 511, and the 811 can not hold a candle to the sound of a wooden horn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted October 20, 2006 Share Posted October 20, 2006 . Can I try the 902s and 811b with BEC crossover that I now have that cross at 400hz(?) Terry, I.B..... runs the 902's that low .... w/ the 811 horn tho, you are well below fC, at 400 hz ... this is to deal with the midrange that I do not like. what you don't like, is that High Compression Ratio horn ... PWK wanted the max efficiency outta everything, the 3/4" throat as a result is just too small for higher volume use . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coytee Posted October 20, 2006 Share Posted October 20, 2006 I don't know anything about the horns you mention... so discount my comments by about 90%. That said, don't forget you can get the K-402 horn with the K-69 driver from Klipsch and make your LaScala a 2 way. Word from Roy is he thinks it would be a great match and he could run the numbers for the xover in the chamber. Cost (delivered) at/under 1K each Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Lindsey Posted October 20, 2006 Share Posted October 20, 2006 I am running a 511B with my La Scala's and it is head and shoulders better than the K400. However, I am using the Klipsch K55 driver with mine. Like someone else mentioned the La Scala bass horn rolls off well below 800hz and therefore rules out the 811B. I suggest you try just the 511B's with your existing drivers first and then go from there. In order to use the K55's you will need an adaptor that allows the 511B's to mate to them. You can get this adaptor from Parts Express for about $5. I'll find the part number for you. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarheel Posted October 20, 2006 Author Share Posted October 20, 2006 Thanks guys for all the good advice and comments. I still don't know what I will do but there are a lot of options....I just want to do it right this time since this will be the second pair of LS in two years and I want it to be the last. On the plus side I have a pair of 511horns and a pair of 811 horns on hand. I could take Mike's idea and hook those up to the k-55 drivers after I get the adaptors and see how the horns sound compared to the k-400 I am not fond of. If cost was not a consideration I would just get the trachorn and ALK crossover and be done with it. Those 2 items alone would exceed my cost for all components in the first pair of LS! Then I would have to buy the k-33 and Beymas plus pay Bluesboy at least minimum wage for his excellent cabinet work...not to mention the piano black lacquer. Enough whining. I will throw out one last hypothetical. If you had to work with the width of the LS being the only given and a ceiling of $1200 for parts, and the rest of the speaker a blank canvas what would you do and why? See what I am doing....picking the brains of the experienced for free consultations to further lower the price! But youre all my best buds ...right Chuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarheel Posted October 20, 2006 Author Share Posted October 20, 2006 I am running a 511B with my La Scala's and it is head and shoulders better than the K400. However, I am using the Klipsch K55 driver with mine. Like someone else mentioned the La Scala bass horn rolls off well below 800hz and therefore rules out the 811B. I suggest you try just the 511B's with your existing drivers first and then go from there. In order to use the K55's you will need an adaptor that allows the 511B's to mate to them. You can get this adaptor from Parts Express for about $5. I'll find the part number for you. Mike Thanks Mike.... that is an idea I had not considered. If you can get me the part number I would appreciate it. Can I use the BEC cossover to this? Chuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest " " Posted October 20, 2006 Share Posted October 20, 2006 There's a forum member working on installing a pair of trackhorns in his LaScala's, not sure how that is coming along. But assume for now, they will sit on top of the LaSala cabs. I would sell the 511's and 811's and buy a set of trackhorns. If you have k-400;s sell those too. 511's = 150 811's=125 k400's=150 Money saved by not buying 902=250 Total money to play with = 675 Wouldn't that pay for the trackhorns? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarheel Posted October 20, 2006 Author Share Posted October 20, 2006 There's a forum member working on installing a pair of trackhorns in his LaScala's, not sure how that is coming along. But assume for now, they will sit on top of the LaSala cabs. Wouldn't that pay for the trackhorns? Use the k-55s with the trachorns? I will be building from scratch so I would be building a new cabinet for the horn either way I proceed. Chuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Spinner Posted October 20, 2006 Share Posted October 20, 2006 I don't know anything about the horns you mention... so discount my comments by about 90%. Here, Coytee ,..... I discounted your post 90% for these folk's .......[] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarheel Posted October 20, 2006 Author Share Posted October 20, 2006 Tom....this being my second pair in two years I wanted to run it by Al first to make sure I was heading in the right direction. I hope he doesn't mind that I quoted him but thats what he emailed me. I am sorry but I can't elaborate further. As you may have gathered I have little to no skills in speaker building and don't know jack about crossovers and/or horns. Bluesboy, a friend of mine, does all the skilled work and I pay the bills. I also try to do a little research first and the forum is a great place for that. With the other equipment I have bought this will be my last chance for awhile to "get it right". I love the looks of the big 511 horn exposed and have heard it in a k-horn with the 902 and it sounds great to me. I just bought some 902s on ebay this week and I have the 511 and 811 on hand. I think I will buy the xover kit from ALK and experiment with the two horns before the cab is built for the midrange. The bass bins are already underway. I also will buy the adaptor kit and try the k-55 with the new horns. And just think....until I heard Bluesboys new K-horns with the 511b and Altec 902s and ALK xovers I was fairly content with my LS. Why don't you start your project first and I can go to school on your efforts? Chuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfogg Posted October 20, 2006 Share Posted October 20, 2006 Which crossover of Bob's are you running? His rebuilt type AA? That won't work with the 902s unless you go two way. The 902 does not at all rolloff like the K55 on the top end. So to stay three way you need a crossover that is bandpass on the midrange. Otherwise the speaker is going to be very bright since you will be doubling up on the treble between the 902 and the tweeter. Or you could run two way. A 902/511 on a LaScala run two way is a nice sounding speaker, esp. with an ES600 crossover. See this thread.... http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/thread/420122.aspx If you want to stay three way (get better tweeters....) look into having Dean cook you up something special for that combo. A 902 can go well beyond 6kHz so it is kind of dumb (imo) to cross it over there. Cross at more like 8kHz or 10kHz and let the tweeter just handle the last octave. That will sound better then a 6kHz crossover. Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarheel Posted October 20, 2006 Author Share Posted October 20, 2006 Thanks for more good comments Shawn....the BEC crossovers are type AA. Yes I do plan on changing the tweeters to Beymas. Going to check out the thread you sent right now. Chuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.4knee Posted October 20, 2006 Share Posted October 20, 2006 I am not sure about the 902's lower cutoff freq however I would NOT extend the LS bass bin up that high (800 hz), I know Al did with his Belle Klipsch but I do not see the LS bass bin performing that well up so high. Actually I think Al crossed at 700Hz but don't quote me on that. The FC for the 511b desinged to be a 500Hz but it actually roll down to almost 400Hz with the correct driver. I use a K55M w/my 511B's and Bob's CT 125 tweeters mated to Al's universal networks in my LS. The cut off on the Klipsch networks is very gentle and the acoustic roll off of the driver/horn combo has more effect on where you're actually crossing than do the filters in the networks. I am assuming you desire to make You La Scala's into two ways vice three way units . If so your network will need to be modofied to eliminate tweeter filter so all you'll have is a filter that rolls off the woofer and allows you 511b/902 to take it from say 500 hz on up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarheel Posted October 20, 2006 Author Share Posted October 20, 2006 J.4Knee.....no I want to stay 3 way...am considering Beymas. Have you mounted the 511 in a cabinet or is it sitting on top of the speaker? Would like to see a picture if anyone has done that. Chuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.4knee Posted October 20, 2006 Share Posted October 20, 2006 sfogg has done it (modified a LS cabinet to mount the 511B in the cabinet) and there is a thread on it with pictures, but you'll have to use the dreaded search function to find it. I set mine on top for now. If you are going three way why not use Al K's universal network then? I do prefer the 511B to the K400 for sure and Bob's CT 125s also add a nice spark of life when compared to my K77M's. I have heard the 902 in a 511B but for my taste I prefer K55M. But that is just me plenty o folks here are sold on the 902 driver for sure. IMO all I need is a sub for some of my media (mainly HT) and I am pretty much set for my speaker acquisition/configuration for now anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarheel Posted October 20, 2006 Author Share Posted October 20, 2006 Thanks for the tip...I will look for Sfogg's thread. I plan on using ALK universals with either horn. Just noticed I have passed my 100 post so I am going to take the weekend off. I certainly don't know enough to talk that much! Have a great weekend and I appreciate your help. Chuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Lindsey Posted October 20, 2006 Share Posted October 20, 2006 Tarheel, In order to be used with the K-55's, you will need a 1" adaptor. I got mine from Parts Express for 4.95/ea but looks like they went up to $6.50. Here is the link...http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=264-322 You will also need six 5/8" bolts that are 1" long with the corresponding locking nuts. They should run you about a dollar at the local hardware store. You will then have to drill 3 holes in the horns to mate up with the adaptor. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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