oldbuckster Posted November 13, 2006 Author Share Posted November 13, 2006 Fish I realize that the WATT thing can become confusing...and I sometimes don't explain things too well.....but here is what started this whole thing..............My last Sony prologic was rated at 120 watts in 2 channel..............and when playing it, I believe the figures seemed correct...liked the sound,was happy with it, what I didn't like was PRO LOGIC...once I heard 5.1, no more PRO LOGIC, had to have 5.1, so I bought new 5.1 DTS unit, 100 watts X 6, sounds great in those modes, switch to 2 channel for CD's , and the sound is weak, no punch, not happy in that mode at all. Wanted to buy the Sony ES line, but at that moment in time I could not swing the extra money for the ES line, and that move has haunted me ever since.....................So, here I am comparing different units again....................Now the Panasonic seems to fill the bill,but the wattage is the same, and deep down I'm afraid to repeat the same mistake I made before, I have a strange feeling it would be a wash if I go with the Panny..............Does that make an sense? Are you still with me here?..................Most of my listening is at LOW VOLUME, much of it EARLY MORNING when my wife is still sleeping, I do not like Headphones, so rule that out.......Now, I have found some good prices on ES line, so, I figure if I step ip to 150 watts X7 in SS, I may get what I'm looking for, better 2 channel sound, not louder, just more punch because of the added wattage at lower levels...............Does that make any sense, or am I just spinin' my tires?...................I never knew my stereo sucked until I joined this forum....................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klipschguy Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 Buckster, I'm not trying to play is safe with you - only keeping it honest. I am leary of trying to squeeze excellent two channel performance out of a home theatre receiver. Some of that is due to experience with some of the early 5.1 units, some is due to experience with the Panasonic (which may actually be defective), and some is due to ignorance about the capabilities of newer, more sophisticated units. You want a Yamaha integrated for two-channel? Yes, I think you will quite pleased with your bang for the buck. Will a Yamaha 7.1 to do the same job - I honestly don't know. As far as watts are concerned, as you know, to get only perceptably louder (3dB increase) one needs to double the wattage, i.e. 100wpc to 200wpc. To double the perceived loudness (10dB increase), one needs ten times the wattage, i.e. 100wpc to 1000wpc. The same applies to speakers. The high efficiency and dynamics associated with big Klipsch speakers is what landed us on this lovely forum in the first place. Going from 100wpc to 140wpc will not be too dramatic, but it will afford a little extra headroom. Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbuckster Posted November 13, 2006 Author Share Posted November 13, 2006 I understand, and I think I'm in the same ballpark with you on this, I like HT, it just adds to the movie when you watch.....I would not be just buying for improved 2 channel, the little extra wattage won't hurt period, I just DON'T want to spend money,and in the end get the SAME results as I had before I spent more money.......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fish Posted November 14, 2006 Share Posted November 14, 2006 Ob,I'm with you on the 2ch thing,this is where many avrs go wrong.Most any decent avr can do HT,they all sound pretty good.The 2ch mode is what separates the musical from the mechanical.There are avr's that can do music pretty well,I've auditioned a few that could and many that could not.You also make a valid point on the prologic units of old,they did better 2ch,all analog.Most any modest priced analog 2ch preamp or old HK X30 would shame a high dollar digital avr.But,like you said,we want DD/DTS too so you have to find a unit that can give a great show plus 2ch that's toe tappin good,it's not easy,but it's possible.We all know it's easy to get a unit that sounds like crap,it's only logical that it takes more work to get one that don't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbuckster Posted November 14, 2006 Author Share Posted November 14, 2006 Ob,I'm with you on the 2ch thing,this is where many avrs go wrong.Most any decent avr can do HT,they all sound pretty good.The 2ch mode is what separates the musical from the mechanical.There are avr's that can do music pretty well,I've auditioned a few that could and many that could not.You also make a valid point on the prologic units of old,they did better 2ch,all analog.Most any modest priced analog 2ch preamp or old HK X30 would shame a high dollar digital avr.But,like you said,we want DD/DTS too so you have to find a unit that can give a great show plus 2ch that's toe tappin good,it's not easy,but it's possible.We all know it's easy to get a unit that sounds like crap,it's only logical that it takes more work to get one that don't. YUP....................................Put the Cuda up for the winter yet?????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbuckster Posted November 14, 2006 Author Share Posted November 14, 2006 Boy, the more I look , the more I dig, the Yamaha 5890 is becoming a front runner, it has 140 watts per X 7, some really good prices, they vary all over the place..........easy to get. Pioneer has the Elite 80 TXV with one source says 140 watts per X 7, yet I find it listed as 110 watts per X 7 someplaces, kinda got me wondering, and that to is fairly priced....Boy I don't know,wanted the SONY ES but a $200. difference means alot right now.....................Damn why did I ever start this search? Damn Forum.......[] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbuckster Posted November 15, 2006 Author Share Posted November 15, 2006 Any one have any comments on the Yamaha 5890.............I'm like ready to pull the trigger on that Bad Boy........great price, power range I'm looking for,never owned a Yamaha, thought about it, but never have owned one..............limited supply at present price.....Good idea, Bad idea,................Final choice is mine....but can always listen to comments..............hunderds cheaper than next choice.......140 watts per X 7........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fish Posted November 15, 2006 Share Posted November 15, 2006 Ob,for the $400 price range I'd say this unit is ok.The last Yamaha I had was really bright w/ Klipsch,but thats been a couple years ago and it was only about $300(bedroom).If you can buy it local,try it and then decide it's worth a try.Otherwise ask about returns,just in case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay481985 Posted November 15, 2006 Share Posted November 15, 2006 OB I think that yamaha was made to compete against the pioneer 1016tx which is also a good deal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbuckster Posted November 15, 2006 Author Share Posted November 15, 2006 Ob,for the $400 price range I'd say this unit is ok.The last Yamaha I had was really bright w/ Klipsch,but thats been a couple years ago and it was only about $300(bedroom).If you can buy it local,try it and then decide it's worth a try.Otherwise ask about returns,just in case. I have seen that Bright comment before...........What do you mean Bright? Overpowering Highs.....too much Mid ?......$400. delivered to my door is a good price...worth the money I think..............I really don't want to spend $1000. or more...that should fill the bill I would hope. Would love Mac, or Marantz...but just can't justify the added expense, the Outlaw unit @ 65 watts per is $900. alot of money, but probably worth it..........Sony ES $600. to $10000. range.........and the Panny for under $300....quite a range........NO place around here to audition units, well Tweeters maybe.............So I go by the seat of my pants......remember, I don't want tubes.........A receiver is the Best way for me to go, for what I want my unit to do................UNLESS, someone has any other suggestions???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fish Posted November 15, 2006 Share Posted November 15, 2006 Ob,I suppose bright can be a wide term.My definition of bright is highs over done(mostly very highs).As I said,the unit I had was not Yamaha's good stuff so I took that into account.I only mention it related to return policy(as mine went back quick).I know others on the board think highly of Yamaha's better gear so that means something too.Lastly,you may love something others dislike and visaversa,we all have our personal taste and own way if interpreting what we hear. On a related note.I just bought an Onkyo 702 dispay model like new for $200(msrp$799).I'm no huge fan cause I've owned a few but they were ok with other speakers.I bought it for my garage 5.1 set(currently cheaper Pioneer).I did however hook it to my klf 20's and Denon 2200.I set it up and was kinda surprised,it sounded as good as earlier Onkyos I'd owned and better than a few more expensive newer Onkyo's I've owned(last one being the 898).It still is a hair bright,but it has an adjustable eq for every channel.At louder volumes it glares a little on symbols etcc. but I could live with it it need be,not bad and good stereo seperation.It still went to the carhole but it sounds great on my old klh bookshelf surround set up and is so much better than the unit it replaced.Point being,you just have to hear a unit to really know how it sounds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colterphoto1 Posted November 15, 2006 Share Posted November 15, 2006 I'm a happy Yamaha owner, used them with Cornies, now LS/CW in a HT setup. Also have a small 2ch modern Yamaha receiver for the bedroom I'm very happy with their sound with Klipsch. If anyone has any specific questions, be happy to answer. There is a difference in the RXV and HTR series- they rate the power differently. M Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbuckster Posted November 15, 2006 Author Share Posted November 15, 2006 I have seen other members respond to Yamaha's as being bright.......I have been on this computer for days and hours, seeking out info,prices, and such trying to find what I want, or better yet, what my wallet can handle at this time........I found the Panasonic quite interesting, but really feel given the power range, plug-ins, and such would really not be any different than my SONY.......Have looked at many units in the 500 to 800 range, and feel I wouldn't gain much for the extra lay-out of cash....................then I stumble on the Yamaha 5890...140 watts perX 7....plenty of plug ins.....many nice features, all that this old fart needs or will use.....delivered to my doorstep for $400. that's it $400. I think that is a great price........Just have never owned a Yamaha......bought this present Sony 2 years ago, took a year to figure out how to make it work right...........god damn cables...really like performance in 5.1 and DTS,,,,,,,,,,,but it blows in 2 channel....the 100 watts per x 2 seems real weak my other Sony at 120 perX2 was much stronger, I realize it's only 20 watts, it shouldn't make a difference, but it did...............So quanities on Yamaha are Limited, if I'm gonna do it, I better get going...................If I buy it and don't like it, I'm stuck with it...................That's why I ask about bright with Klipsch speakers........I guess I should just make a decision on it, and let the chips fall where they may, enough wasted energy...................Clock is ticking......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fish Posted November 15, 2006 Share Posted November 15, 2006 Ob,best case,you buy it and love it.Worst case,you buy,hate(not likely but...),can't return it and sell it for maybe $300 and start over,lol.Good Luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbuckster Posted November 15, 2006 Author Share Posted November 15, 2006 Ob,best case,you buy it and love it.Worst case,you buy,hate(not likely but...),can't return it and sell it for maybe $300 and start over,lol.Good Luck. GOD HATES A COWARD................think I'll go for it.......If I like it good............if I don't, I'll live with it.................that is a nice price......does have features I want......other places sell same unit for $600................Would really like Mac..........can't justify prices.......Could Sell Porsche 911 and get Mac's and Khorns...................NAH, not a good idea.......After all the Yamaha is a Christmas Present............So many choices...........What to do,What to do.....Supplies limited........Damn, why did I ever join this Forum???????? Never knew my stereo sucked..........until I joined this Forum???????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colterphoto1 Posted November 15, 2006 Share Posted November 15, 2006 RXV659..... That $400 Yamaha is nowhere close to 140 watts per channel fully loaded. Read reviews here http://www.pricegrabber.com/p__Yamaha_HTR_5890_Receiver,__7797071/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddy Dee Posted November 15, 2006 Share Posted November 15, 2006 I haven't heard the Panasonic, though I know it has a huge following in some circles. Basically, it's a multichannel chip amp. http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/thread/504392.aspx The Sonic Impact T2 spends a lot of time in my system: http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=300-956 The sound is neither like tubes or solid state -- it has a sound all its own. Output impedance with these amps is very low and I have very solid bass through my Klipschorns. Treble through tube amps is more airy or atmospheric in nature, but the digital comes close. What I mostly notice about the top end is how silky smooth and clean it is. Even good solid state always has a bit of grainy or hashing quality to it. The midrange is rich without sounding thick, and devoid of glare. The T2 is the second best amp I've ever heard. The best amp(s) I've heard cost almost 20 times more and turn my room into a toaster oven. Got the superT yesterday and have been listening driving Heresy. Wow. This is a sweetheart, indeed. A couple of years ago I had tried out the T-amp, which, of course, is something of a toy. The T-amp folks figured out they had a sleeper on their hands and built it right with the Super T. It has the same chip as the T-amp, so I hadn't been expecting it to be as good as it is. It is REALLY good. I'd sure like to compare it to the Panny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbuckster Posted November 15, 2006 Author Share Posted November 15, 2006 Read reviews...all seem to say 140 watts perX 7......Am I missing something........Seems like nice unit to me..................$4oo. delivered to my doorstep is a nice price...what do you see that you don't like? Please explain..................I can't afford McIntosh, that is my first choice.............I do not want to buy used, I would rather have NEW.........I have heard SET amps, do not like the sound..............Tubes are not what I want to do..............I like Home Theatre for movies, and Concert DVD's........SS fills the bill me........I see nothing to indicate that I shouldn't buy that receiver.......if you do please point it out to me, and if it's that bad I can cancel order.........I will not buy Denon or onkoyo..............Marantz was a choice too but expensive...............What is it you don't like? you own Yamaha, talk to me... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rsoxfan Posted November 15, 2006 Share Posted November 15, 2006 ob I own a yammy....very happy with it.....i do about 50/50 ht/music.... Very easy to set up. and adjust Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbuckster Posted November 15, 2006 Author Share Posted November 15, 2006 Now if we can get rid of MANNY in the off season.................EH I don't see what mike is talking about....the power ratings are the same no matter where I read them from 140 watts per X 7...that figure never changes....different web pages, different sellers...all print the same specs...........Yamaha 5890 receiver delivered to my door...final price $400. that's a good deal................I realize it not McIntosh, or Marantz, or any other top shelf, expensive receiver................I'm running Heresy 2's up front, and KG4's in the rear.......that Yamaha should be fine................Funny thing is, if I wasn't on this forum, I wouldn't change anything.............Damn Forum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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