triceratops

Wow, Jordan! Did you use the pre-glued packaged stuff or cut down a sheet of regular veneer? Best in horns, triceratops

Maybe Michael or others who have experience with Crown or the other amps in this link can comment. Are any of these good choices for driving Klipsch in a home setting (recognizing you would probably want to use a rack mount)? Here's the link: http://www.musiciansfriend.com/home/navigation?N=100001+701674&src=3NL6EBA I have no association with Musician's Friend--other than occasionally buying something from them. I believe they do have a 45-day no-questions-asked return policy. Best in horns, triceratops

Hey Chris, Thanks for the note of sympathy. I would have been all over this deal if I hadn't been 600 miles away for my job when it posted. I probably should have committed to buying them sight unseen, but I hate to do that--especially with no photos. Like with the money thing you mentioned, timing is everything. Best in horns, Triceratops

Yeah, I've got nothing against buying and selling stuff. That's how we learn and how we get experience with different Klipsch models and different vintages. But if you buy a pair of '67 Khorns for a screaming good deal--why not at least give them a listen for a few weeks (or months, or years) before cashing them in? I also feel the seller collaborated with the buyer to help him get there first, and I don't know why. Maybe the buyer implied he would take both pairs, whereas I had admitted I would only be able to handle one pair. Even so, I wouldn't have felt as bad if they went to another Klipsch lover, but I guess they'll get to someone who loves them eventually (the auction winner is in South Korea). Well, on the bright side I did get my PRS guitar back from my tech guy this week and it plays great! Best in horns, triceratops

Geez, I feel kinda sick. I made arrangements on Wednesday with Wid to see the Khorns on Friday morning. I was in Boise for my job and headed back to Eugene on Friday. These were over on the coast a good drive from Eugene, so I decided to drive directly to his place to minimize the travel time. Asked him to keep me updated if anything changed and gave him my phone number. I called in at 8:30 AM on Friday when I was about two and a half hours away and told Wid I was getting close and would be there around lunchtime. He said he had made arrangements for another guy to see them and that guy was already on his way and would be there at 10 AM. I said what? Why didn't you call me and let me know (that's why he had my phone number). He told me whoever got there first would get them. Nice, huh? So I would have added about another four hours to my trip for no reason? So I stop driving and figure I'll wait to see what happens before I head over there (I'd already driven about 400 miles in the last few hours). So I wait till 11 AM and still haven't heard anything. I call and Wid says the other guy just got here, and he hasn't decided yet. Crap--I could have been there by then! Then Wid calls me back a half hour later and says the guy just bought both pairs. I assumed he paid full boat for these. Why drop the price when another buyer is waiting? And then they immediately get flipped on Ebay (looks like they've already sold). This reminds me of that Florida Belle transaction last year. I need a beer--good night! Sorry for the rant, triceratops

Well, I hope someone on the Forum got these! I was in Boise when the ad came up and talked to the seller about seeing them on Friday morning when I was returning to Oregon. I called while driving, only to find he had scheduled someone else the same morning. It was a pretty long haul out there so I stopped travelling and waited for the outcome. The other person bought both pairs--hope they didn't just buy them to flip. Best in horns, triceratops

Hey Scott, My 3009 Improved has a removable headshell, which means it is a slightly heavier arm, but I don't know if that makes it heavy enough for the Denon cartridge--clearly the arm would be no more rigid than the one with the fixed shell that you have. I will be really interested to hear your feedback. Also, I totally agree about your listening strategy--that's why quick slurp beer taste tests are somewhat bogus, IMHO. You've got to quaff a brew for a few weeks to decide if you can live with a long term relationship. What were we talking about? Oh yeah...music...that's right... Best in horns, triceratops

Seti, Great to hear about your affection for the Magic Band. Like religion and politics, Captain Beefheart's (a.k.a. Don Van Vliet) music is one of those things on which many people disagree--thus I usually only discuss this particular musical fetish with my close friends. In any case, I think that the early Magic Band was one of the most original and challenging "rock" musical groups in history--I'm referring to the classic iteration which included Zoot Horn Rollo on guitar (Bill Harkelroad), Rockette Morton on bass (Mark Boston), Drumbo on tuned drums (John French), and Ed Marimba on percussion and trap set (Art Tripp). There has been a lot written about Beefheart's composition and his relationship with this band. The lore is that he composed the entire contents of Trout Mask Replica (their 1969 magnum opus 2-record set) by singing into Uher portable reel to reel tape recorder for a few hours and then spent most of a year teaching the band to play it's constantly shifting wacky harmonies and time signatures. But this has been disputed over time. It seems hard to believe that Beefheart, who doesn't really play any instrument other than voice--although he will sometimes assault the soprano sax or harmonica--could possibly have constructed the ridiculously complex guitar harmony in "One Red Rose That I Mean" that appears on the follow-up album Lick My Decals Off, Baby. Jeff Moris Tepper--the guitarist who was responsible for the Beefheart resurgence in the late 1970's and early 1980's with a reformed Magic Band--credits Beefheart with everything he played saying he followed the Captain's direction. Others claim that much of what was performed by later versions of the band was actually derived from work tapes of the earlier group described above. And when the early band had an acrimonious split with Beefheart in the mid 1970's over the horrific album Unconditionally Guaranteed, they formed a group called Mallard which recorded two albums, and sounded more like the Magic Band than Beefheart's rival ensemble at the time. But regardless of the drama, there was some truly incredible music from this group as well as some really lame stuff. Trout Mask Replica (as mentioned by Mark) is a great place to start. My personal favorite is their next album Lick My Decals Off, Baby which is apparently out of print at this time (email me for help on this). And later Clear Spot and Spotlight Kid which are available as a double CD, but are much less consistent. If you are less worried about giving credit to the original ensemble, the later group put out some excellent releases including Bat Chain Puller, Doc at the Radar Station, and Ice Cream for Crow. Also don't forget Zappa's greatest album (IMHO) Hot Rats with Beefheart's memorable vocal on "Willy the Pimp." As for the really early recordings like Mirror Man and Safe as Milk, the music on these is quite conventional and not worth bothering with unless you're collecting everything in the Beefheart catalog. In any case, avoid Beefheart's later attempts at mainstream music Unconditionally Guaranteed and Blue Jeans and Moonbeams at all costs. Michael will want to know if I ever saw this band live, and yeah I did. On their first national tour in the gym at Boston University in the winter of 1971, and on their second tour at the Univ of Penn's Irvine Auditorium in February, 1972 (at that show the opening act was a new band called Little Feat). And then I saw the various other reformed versions of the group over the years, although I haven't seen the latest assemblage. You guys might also be amused to know my theme music for my college radio show "Another Hamburger" at WVKR in the late 1970's: the intro was "Woe is a Me Bop" from Beefheart and the outro was "Muffin Man" from Zappa--ah those were the days... When I moved to Eugene in 1992, I learned that my childhood guitar hero Bill Harkleroad lived here, and started taking guitar lessons from him (I had hung up my guitar about 20 years earlier). These days, he is my son's teacher--kind of amazing, eh? Harkleroad has a solo album out that is available on his Zoot Horn Rollo website. I'll shut up now. Best in horns, triceratops

Paul, thanks for your thoughts on this. I already had a nice 125 MKII with a Thorens arm, but I bought this 125 MKII with SME 3009 "Improved" arm thinking it would work well with the Denon cartridge. I wonder if Allan has any ideas about any cartridges that would mate well with the "Improved" arm? I also wonder if the Thorens arm is worthy of the Denon cartridge? I never have tried a Shure V15--like Grey Coupe I used the old Stanton 681EE's a lot during the 70's and 80's. Mike--sorry about partially hijacking the thread--thanks for your interest in this topic. I've clearly got a lot to learn in this area. Best in horns, triceratops I don't know why the Denon won't mate with the 3009 Improved. I'll find out this weekend though as I plan on putting it on my 125 which has the 3009 II Improved arm on it. I've got a "non-Improved" 3009 I can try too. Hey Scott, That's really cool--are the headshells on the two arms interchangable? Look forward to hearing about your experiences! Best in horns, triceratops

Paul, thanks for your thoughts on this. I already had a nice 125 MKII with a Thorens arm, but I bought this 125 MKII with SME 3009 "Improved" arm thinking it would work well with the Denon cartridge. I wonder if Allan has any ideas about any cartridges that would mate well with the "Improved" arm? I also wonder if the Thorens arm is worthy of the Denon cartridge? I never have tried a Shure V15--like Grey Coupe I used the old Stanton 681EE's a lot during the 70's and 80's. Mike--sorry about partially hijacking the thread--thanks for your interest in this topic. I've clearly got a lot to learn in this area. Best in horns, triceratops

Well, I definitely screwed up on this! I was riding Mike's coat tails on this topic and had an opportunity to pick up a Thorens 125 MKII with SME 3009 arm locally. There was just one of the Denon DL-103 cartridges left on Ebay so I snagged that, too. Obviously, I should have done at least a little homework on this, but I had the week off work and a tax refund coming so I didn't give it much thought... It turns out the arm on this table is the SME 3009 "Improved"--apparently not the right arm for this cartridge. So I have a few questions: 1. I have an old B&O SP-12 cartridge (it's a big cylindrical thing) with an almost new stylus. Any chance that would be a decent match with the 125 MK II and SME 3009 "Improved" arm? 2. Would the Denon DL-103 cartridge work better with a 125 MK II with a stock Thorens arm? Thanks for any advice... Best in horns, triceratops

Man, I gotta stop hanging out here! I'm taking some vacation this week so I checked in on this thread. I had just bought a Thorens 125 Mark II with SME 3009 arm from the local hifi store. The cartridge was crap so I just ordered the last one of those Denons on Ebay that Allan recommended. Fun stuff--I'll be curious to see what it all sounds like. Do I need any special tools to set up the arm? Best in horns, triceratops

Thanks, Michael. It's kind of odd to be thinking back on those formative experiences so many years later. I was fortunate to see some stellar rock (and later jazz) performances in the late 60's and early 70's--I'm 53 now. Like you, I envied the folks who were a couple years older than me who saw some amazing shows in the early and mid 60's when I was too young--I suspect there are some Forum members who saw the Beatles before they stopped touring, or saw Dylan when he first went electric... As for the memories, why is it that I can remember commercial jingles from my childhood, but can't remember what I had for breakfast? Best in horns, triceratops

In the summer of 1968 (?) in Philadelphia, my least favorite brand of local beer (Schmidt's) sponsored an outdoor summer concert series in a football stadium. One of the shows was called "The English Invasion" which included The Troggs, Pink Floyd, and the Mandala (from Canada-go figure!) as well as a few others. I think there were 5 acts on the bill, so it was a long summer night of music. It absolutely poured rain. We were all down on the playing field where the stage was set up and everyone got soaked to the bone. As soon as one band would start up the rain would begin again, and the performers would scurry offstage as there was minimal cover so all the equipment was getting soaked. After a couple hours of these frustrating episodes of musicus interruptus, Pink Floyd finally took the stage. I think Syd was already institutionalized at this point, so Gilmore was handling guitar duties. They had just recorded "Saucer Full of Secrets" but this was still before "Umma Gumma" if memory serves. It was a good thing there was no roof on the place, because Pink Floyd would have torn it off! They launched into a blistering continous set that included "See Emily Play," "Interstellar Overdrive," and I think the entire Saucer album. "Set the Controls for the Heart of the Sun" had Gilmore laying his Strat on top of a speaker cabinet and playing the slide lap-style, with generous feedback and echo added. As a 15 year-old high school kid, it was like nothing I had imagined as music. The rain picked up again and started pouring onto the stage, and the PA system began sputtering. I thought the band would get electrocuted, but they were unstoppable--they just laughed and kept playing. At one point, Waters stepped up to the microphone and said "We came 3000 miles to do this set and we're going to keep playing even if we have to finish under five feet of water!" The crowd went nuts! At the last song, Waters took off his Rickenbacker 4001 bass, held it over his head and on the final chord pitched the instrument across the stage--end-over-end like an underhanded tomahawk throw. It appeared to me that the bass came to rest in the general vicinity of the groin of the master of ceremonies, a particularly irritating Philadelphia DJ--but that may have just been wishful thinking on my part. In any case, the instrument appeared to survive the toss, and I think the rest of the show was cancelled. No matter, my friends and I ran to catch the last train back to the suburbs and buzzed the whole way home about the how cool Pink Floyd was. I still feel that way, and really thought Gilmore sounded great on the Tonight show. Thanks to filmboydoug for the tip on Gilmore--what a great Forum this is! Best in horns, triceratops

I bought a University 15 inch woofer from Chris (AEP30) about a year or so ago from one of his Ebay listings. Since he is in Portland, OR and I am in Eugene, I was able to pick the driver up in person and save the cost and stress of shipping. The item was accurately represented and Chris and his wife were a real pleasure to deal with. Like Corvette and Michael, I think Chris travels far and wide to acquire stuff, sometimes taking significant road trips in the process. As per Bill and Munkiman, I can vouch that Chris is a great source for Altec parts. Best in horns, triceratops

Here's a photo (if this works) of my son Geoff playing his Godin fretless--it has a bridge pick-up and sounds a little like an upright bass. Most of the time he plays a fretted Yamaha 5-string. I think Victor Wooten plays a Yamaha sometimes, too. Best in horns, triceratops

At least this seller has credible feedback. I am always amazed when someone is new to Ebay and for their first transaction they'll launch an auction for a big ticket item like a pair of Khorns. Fortunately, this guy is not one of those sellers and he has an excellent transaction history. I'll bet these are the real thing. As a side note, I'm definitely rethinking what is a fair price for some of the nicer and harder to find Heritage pieces. Many of us have seen nice used Heritage stuff sell for 25% (or less) of the new replacement cost. But now I'm thinking about the relative rarity of a piece and how long I would have to wait for something similar. If these Belles are in the condition this guy says, I believe they are probably easily worth 3 grand to a lot of people. The factory boxes are an excellent selling point too. Best in horns, triceratops

Very interesting, Fini! I wonder if they have a flat rate for shipping these, since a motorcycle would be much heavier than speakers. Do they have any dimensions listed? Looks like you might be able to ship two (or more) pairs of Khorns in these! Best in horns, triceratops

I'm guessing RR is for Rosewood Raw (no finish applied to allow owner to stain, oil, or lacquer as they desire). I've had a number of Klipsch speakers that have been WR (Walnut Raw) or MR (Mahoghany Raw). It was apparently a pretty popular option in the Northwest to get the veneer unfinished. But I could be totally wrong about this too! Best in horns, triceratops

Diz and Meagain, The crate was made for a beautiful pair of vintage Cornwalls that DeanG bought years ago. Dean can tell the whole story, but the seller did not want to ship them because he was concerned about damage. Dean made arrangements to have someone pack the speakers for him but the seller became anxious that the Corns would be damaged and built "the Crate" (he was a professional metal fabricator if I recall). Dean was the custodian of the crate for a while but eventually passed it on the Audible Nectar. I used the crate to ship my 1968 Cornwall Verts to AN some years ago, and it did a great job. Paul Parrot had a wooden crate custom built for a pair of Belles I sold him a few years back which we also shipped by Forward Air. You can see details on this in the thread "Guess What's in the Crate?" The total cost including the crate was around $400 for the shipping. These also arrived in great shape. Yes, I think the same could be done for Klipschorns as you suggest. Getting a crate custom built is definitely a case of YMMV. I checked with a number of packaging companies and what they provide and how much they charge is all over the map. I am very curious about the pre-fab containers that Fini mentions. Are they reusable? Can they be rented instead of purchased, like the cargo containers they use for transcontinental shipping? Best in horns, triceratops

Hi Jordan, I did not receive your email. Maybe a glitch in the Forum email forwarding? Best in horns, triceratops

Hi Jordan, Thanks for the tip. I sent you a PM. Best in horns, triceratops

Jaco Pastorius created an incredible new (at the time) and beautiful tone for the electric bass. Rest in peace, Jaco. Best in horns, triceratops

I didn't realize that, probably because I've never had a center channel speaker myself. Is this because the lead instrument or vocal comes out in the center? Good point, Bill. My bad for forgetting that feature on the new 'Scalas. That is really a fine looking speaker! Best in horns, triceratops

Meagain, Another way to go would be a Belle Klipsch. Unlike the standard LaScala, the Belle is built with a separate top section. You could just unbolt it and fly it from the ceiling or whatever. The bass bin would be a good size to go under the TV and you wouldn't need to change the woofer because it already has the K-33. Best of all, you could try this configuration out without doing any mods (you could hang the top section upside down and use the existing screw holes to suspend it) then if you didn't like it, you could just bolt it all back together--no harm done. Don't get me wrong, I don't want to discourage you from building or modifying a Pro "Split" LaScala or CornScala into something unique. I'm just saying you can probably have something even more appropriate for your needs with a Belle Klipsch without any need for fabrication. Just my 2 cents. Best in horns, triceratops