1911 Purchase and Value

[russ69]

It's a newer model. I'd trade in a 1100 anyday of the week unless it was a 28 or 410 gauge. Colt was at their best with the series 70 pistols but the 1991 is good to go.

Thanks, Russ

[Professor Thump]

From the great forum you recommended, here is the definintion for the 1991. It is basically an entry level 1911 80 series

http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=15201

1991 vs. 1911

For those wondering what the difference is between these pistols, the fact is there really is none. Back in 1991 Colt decided to market an economy version of their basic Series 80 Government Model. The polished blue was changed to an all-matte parkerized (later matte blue) finish, checkered rubber grip panels were used, and the serial number sequence was a resumption of the ones originally given to US military M1911A1 pistols. The resulting pistol was cleverly named "M1991A1", after the year of introduction. Mechanically however they are the same as any other Colt Series 80, 1911-type pistol. Around 2001 or so Colt upgraded these pistols with polished slide and frame flats, nicer-looking slide rollmarks, stainless barrels, and wood grips (blued models only). The newer ones are commonly called "New Rollmark (NRM)" pistols by Colt enthusiasts, to differentiate them from the "Old Rollmark (ORM)" 1991 pistols. The earlier guns are easily identified by having "COLT M1991A1" in large block letters across the left face of the slide. The NRM Colts will have three smaller lines of text saying "COLT'S-GOVERNMENT MODEL-.45 AUTOMATIC CALIBER", along with Colt's rampant horse logo.

[SilverSport]

If the value of the 1100 is less than $550 or you just don't need it and he is willing to do the deal...get the 1991...I would only caution you to the "don't know the round count" but that can be checked by a gunsmith or gun guy you trust...itza Colt...[]

Bill

[winchester21]

got that Colt yet?????????????????????

[Gilbert]

As you are probably aware, 1911's .45ACP's are extremely common. You can mull over several hundred at just about any gun show. Lot's and lot's and lot's of directions and options to go with. Anything particular about the Nam ear 1911's, or is it just to nostalgia?

I own a couple a Nowlin's, a Les Baer, Jim Clark Custon, Colt Goldcup in .38cal. My prefered choice for conceal carry though is a SIG P239 .40cal / .357cal S&W. Sig's are my favorites, due to durability, jamb free friendlyness, and they always seem to fit my hands perfect, not that the 1911 is any slouch, because it's not. The most accurate 1911 I've ever bench tested in a ransom rest is my Nowlin Match Master. A 1" group or better at 50yds, freaking unbelieveable. It a perfect bowling pin gun, as are the Clark Customs.

[winchester21]

We had a little informal comparison last month at my private range. we do not have a ransom rest- have used one in the past at another club. We test fired my Kimber Gold Combat 2- my HK Usp tactical-a friends older Colt gold cup- an Ed brown that I bought and quickly sold. 3 shots off tightly positioned sandbags at 50 yards. The HK came in last at 2-1/2 inches- the gold cup was about 2- the Ed brown was 1-1/2 inches- the kimber with night sites was literally one ragged hole.Pretty dammed impressive group of guns. I also had a Kimber gold matrch which turned in amazing performance but the black target sights drove me crazy and I sold it. Have not shot the Nolin- would love to test drive it.

There are plenty of 1911s around but prices have been creeping up as of late.

[Professor Thump]

Not yet Win... I got a little sentimental and teary eyed when I pulled out the 1100. I had shot my first perfect 25 in trap with that gun and decided that anything that shoots that good is not getting traded. This gun has been babied for being 26 years old. It has only been shot at the range so there are no scratches on it. I would have traded the Armsport O/U, although it works well for hunting and I would be concerned with getting it scratched. I also wasn't as impressed with the build of the 1991. I guess the plastic turned me off.

I am really leaning towards a nickel plated Kimber after your advice. Maybe I can trade some RF-83's for one or save more money.

[Kriton]

Qualifying this remark with the fact that I too am a 1911 enthusiast, owning two Wilson combat .45's (the CQB 5" being my daily carry - when I can carry), a hard chromed Les Baer and a Wesson Patriot - I wanted to make a couple of comments - cheaper with pistols is not necessarily a good deal in the long run - yes, you can get them checked out by a smith once you receive it, the chances of you getting your money back on a shot out pistol is unlikely if you get it through GunsAmerica or something - I buy new if I can, becauses I know how many rounds I put downrange - I will tell you that my CQB has at last count just shy of 10k rounds through it, and you could not tell upon casual inspection, that this is not a new weapon - despite three - week long trips to Thunder Ranch when they were in Kerrville, a trip to GunSite and all of the drawing from concealment over that period of time, etc. Only a very experienced shooter or good gunsmith is going to be able to tell you what you have, so buyer beware.

As for the whole "pulling your pants down" - all I have to say is that is bunkum - I wear a single stack .45 full size on right and mag and Surefire holder on left (to balance out weight) in a polo shirt with a t-shirt on under it untucked and you cannot tell I have them on - but that is becauses I spent almost as much time (and almost as much money) on good leather as I have on the weapons - don't scrimp on either, as these are important tools. In my experience, Alessi, Milt Sparks (and Brommeland) are some of the very best - and you will pay for the best -but 100-150 for an 1 1/2" hand made belt that will (should) last you a lifetime seems a small investment to me - properly sized with the right in the pants or outside the pants holster ( of which i have probably 20 from each of these makers in summer and winter, outside and inside configurations) and you can carry concealed and comfortable for a long period of time - break-in will take sosme time as these are tight holsters, but they will last my lifetime as good handmade items should.

Just my 2c.

K

[russ69]

Thump,

Your 1100 is very nice. Here's a link to the special trap version of an 1100, just a tad different.

http://www.remington.com/products/firearms/shotguns/model_1100/model_1100_classic_trap.asp

Thanx, Russ

[winchester21]

I havve bought and sold dozens of 1100s. Funny- The first round of trap I ever shot was with an 1100. Hit 24 and never duplicated the score. Switched to *****- then to sporting clays. Trap is making a HUGE comeback around here. I have turned into a Benelli Junkie so I no longer own any .1100s If you have emotional ties to the 1100 or any other gun.. never sell it. I have done that and sorely regretted it later on.

If you like auto check out the Benelli line. It is a hi-tech clay bird busting/game killing machine. I have a 30" Cordoba that I bought for a song after a buddy got back from Argentina. I have killed truckloads of doves,ducks and turkeys with it. It is ugly as sin but is infailable in function. This is one that I will never sell.

If it is within your budget- I thinking keeping the 1100 and waiting on a Kimber is the smart move.

[winchester21]

Prof- After a little resaerch it apperas that your 1100 is an 1100 TB made from 1963-81. select wood -or a tournament trap mfg from 79-86 with extra select wood- vent rib 30" bbl. The TB has a 100% condition value of 475.00- 495 with monte carlo stock. 90-95% drops into the 300 range. The Tournament Trap is 550.00 for 100% 365 for 90%.

Yours is special in that it has no hunting wear which would put it at the top of this range. No way would I sell it.

[russ69]

We have a VERY nice trap/***** club nearby (Oak Tree, So. Ca.). I got pretty good at trap and ***** after a few years of shooting every week (night shooting until 11pm). Anyway, I bought a beautiful Browning 425 competition shotgun but I keep going back to my cheap old Remington 870 and Browning automatic. Sometimes a friendly old gun is way better than a fancy engraved status symbol.

Thanx, Russ

P.S. I would have still traded for the 1991, I have a soft spot for 45s!

[winchester21]

Unless I coulda knocked a home run on the 1100 I would have kept it as well. There will be other opprotunities. I would have traded the Armsport if dooable. Never sell a gun that you cna shoot really well. I finally learned that after 30 years of horsetrading.

The 425 competiton should out shoot pretty much all comers if it is fitted properly. Gun fit on a shotgun is soooo critical. My friend won his class in the Jeep invitational Sporting clays tournament here a few years back with a 425.

I fell into a deal acouple of years ago.A friend of mine who is also talll with long arms bought a Perazzi SCO with 2 wood upgrades and 2 barrels. Every choke tube made by Perazzi and Briley for the second barrrel. The gun was custom finished for a tall person. My friend bought it for a live pigeon shoot and suffered a back injury requiring surgery. I was in the right place at the right time. He needed to get rid of it and I bought it right. Yes- it is a fancy O/U that attracts lots of attention but the important thing is that it fits me perfectly. I have shot some 25s in ***** and had some nice scores in sporting clays.

I also grew up shooting an A-5. Never totally adapted away from it. I have finally gotten used to the Benellis and I love them.

I also love 45s

[Professor Thump]

Yes finacially the trade would have been about an even swap due to the condition but you can't overlook the emotional aspect of it. I have decided it is easier to buy guns then to trade them. I tend to hate getting rid of any gun except for the double Brl side x side that had two triggers. I never did learn to keep just one finger on the triggers at a time. Can you say Blam KaBlam! Double strikes with a 12 gauge aren't any fun.

In the meantime, I am going to carry the XD9 sc to see how it feels and save up for a 1911.

[winchester21]

The old busted finger double trigger trick. 2 years ago I finally conned my friend out of a magnificent Beretta 20 ga ASEL O/U made in the 50s. The gun was stinking new. This gun was the foreruner of the Beretta SO series- you know the ones that can cost like 20-100k. The same baby fame action. Prince of wales grip- cross between a pistol grip and a straight grip. killer wood- beautiful scroll engraving- by hand - not CNC. I picked this beauty for a song 5500.00. I noticed that it had double triggers which was period correct for this gun- most of these did. I was instantly in love..until I tried to shoot it. this baby frame 20 ga weighed like 51/2 lbs- a sweetheart to carry and throw up to your shoulder..but when I tried to shoot it I kept pulling on that same trigger- all of my doubles are singe trigger models. I jerked and flinched like Joe cocker. I shot the ***** house with the second barrel. The trapper/ puller quit in the middle of the round. My gun was banned fron the range. People were running for cover and hiding behind trees and buildings(no kidding) My middle finger got tangled up in the mess was bleeding like a stuck pig. I cursed like a sailor all the way back to the car. After a year of begging and eating crow my buddy finally bought it back from me. That was my first - last - and only outing with double triggers. I have no desire to own any more.

[Professor Thump]

That is hillarious Win!

[winchester21]

I wish I could say that it is embellished ---- but it is not. I can still see the dust flying off the low house and the look on the trappers face.I am telling you.. that was one of the best made and most beautiful guns that I have ever owned. I contacted Beretta to see if there were parts available to convert it- no dice. I was physically sick over not being able to shoot it.I have been trading guns for like 30 + years and I have seen like 3 of these.

I passed on a 60 k Fran Soda 458 Win Mag double rifle 2 year ago- with double triggers- for that very reason. coulda had it for 10K. This deal prevents me from buying any English Double rifles as well.

I HATE DOUBLE TRIGGERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[russ69]

Win21 says: "I HATE DOUBLE TRIGGERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

Russ says: Plus one on that. Too much to remember. Is it the left barrel or the right barrel. On a rifle is it the setting trigger or the set trigger? I can't think that fast............

Thanx, Russ

[winchester21]

If you watch the big time gun auctions you wil see some old double trigger period guns that were ordered with single triggers going for really stupid money. I saw a 16 ga mid grade Parker-as new surface recenty- with all available options fro that grade- go for 40 k- the gun was resold for 55 then 70. The big deal was single triggers- rare in the early days of doublegun production. Now just the opposite-double triggers have to be special ordeered --and for good reason!!

[lbooles]

Hi

My name is Lee. I am PWK's grandson. I saw your post on the 1911 .45. I have what I've been told was Paul's service pistol during his Army days. He gave it to my father (Raymond) probably 30 years ago. My father had it reblued, ivory sight, and a "competition trigger". I am probably going to take it to a gunsmith and have the trigger spring changed. My father passed away about 5 years ago, but not before i got the 45. He also had a Remington 1911, which my mother has. It's defintely my favorite of my collection! Here is a pic of mine.

Lee