Mallette Posted March 5, 2011 Author Share Posted March 5, 2011 There is never a moment in all of known history when we were not on the threshold of an incredible advance. Dang, Mark, you remind me of Watson...No, Lt Cdr Data.[] Lousy choice of words on my part. Of course, I am on the threshold of death, the world on the threshold of destruction, and a new golden age is impending. What I MEANT to say is we've just crossed said threshold where I can see HS 2.0 in the lifetime of my son. I have no doubt he and his children will interact with all people and all human knowledge directly, without a "please recharge" message and that calculating sales tax or the roundtrip time to the asteriods at 343,206 mph terminal volicity and a constant 1G accleration and deceleration will be done in millieseconds and simply by posing the problem in the mind. And, IMHO, this one is the biggest since one of our ancestors picked up a rock, looked at his mate, and said something like "Shtone." Yeah, I know you are a professional skeptic and I am a dreamer. You keep on skepticizing, as I and all need someone to handle that, and I'll keep on dreaming. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Islander Posted March 5, 2011 Share Posted March 5, 2011 Here's another interesting guy, Mark Changizi. Mark Changizi makes a lot of sense. Thanks for the link. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted March 5, 2011 Author Share Posted March 5, 2011 OK, Mark, we are getting on to a possible area of contact. I haven't followed your links yet, but will. However, do you not feel that the Arab uprisings are almost entirely due to the availability of information? It's the very thing that has allowed dominination of peoples from day one. The web has ended the ability of the Lords and Ladies to control mass communiction. Now, consider being able to "feel the attitude" of any person or group on the planet in milliseconds. Hard to imagine, but I can sort of get a sense what it would be like. The "big lie" hasn't a chance when confronted will billions of "little truths." Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Islander Posted March 5, 2011 Share Posted March 5, 2011 However, do you not feel that the Arab uprisings are almost entirely due to the availability of information? It's the very thing that has allowed dominination of peoples from day one. The web has ended the ability of the Lords and Ladies to control mass communiction. Tell that to someone in China, where the Web and its content are tightly controlled. As well, recent flash mobs have been organized in China in the name of the "Jasmine Revolution", as the North African events are being called. However, when would-be protesters show up, they find only police and other security forces at the location, who promptly arrest them.The Chinese government is using the Web to stay ahead of protesters and dissidents, nipping any unrest in the bud. This is only one way they're showing how Web-savvy they are. The cyber-attacks and cyber-spying on other nations are other ways that we know about. How many more of their secret activities have yet to be discovered? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted March 5, 2011 Author Share Posted March 5, 2011 Well, I'll reply to Mark and Islander basically the same message. Things are hardly the same as the past x thousand years. It's a new dawn and China or nobody else can stop it without shutting down the entire world wide data infrastructure. There are leaks, and they are growing. They shut down the web in Egypt but it wasn't airtight and it was too little too late. China is ripe and will be changed as well either voluntarily, as it has gradually over the past few decades, or suddenly. I am hardly predicting a wave of "truth, justice, and the American way" here but the will of the people in whatever form it takes. So far, in the Arab world, it's far more liberal and diverse than anyone would have believed. Again, I suppose I am a cockeyed optimist, but I see more good than bad in current events and technology. I see people power growing and more on the way. Knowledge is power, and we are awash in it with more on the way. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Islander Posted March 5, 2011 Share Posted March 5, 2011 What happened to the 20 hour work week that futurists writing in 1958 promised resulting from the "transistor?" It turned out to be a carrot on a stick. Likewise the wheel, the steam engine, the human genome. Yeah, and where's my jet-pack? <wink> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Islander Posted March 5, 2011 Share Posted March 5, 2011 This song was written in 1982, but as the title I.G.Y. indicates, it represents the view of the future in 1957, which was the International Geophysical Year, for all of you who are too young to remember that. Humanity is slowly marching to that happy and healthy future, but there are so many stumbles and misteps on the way...I.G.Y. by Donald Fagen: Standing tough under stars and stripes We can tell This dream's in sight You've got to admit it At this point in time that it's clear The future looks bright On that train all graphite and glitter Undersea by rail Ninety minutes from New York to Paris Well by seventy-six we'll be A.O.K. What a beautiful world this will be What a glorious time to be free Get your ticket to that wheel in space While there's time The fix is in You'll be a witness to that game of chance in the sky You know we've got to win Here at home we'll play in the city Powered by the sun Perfect weather for a streamlined world There'll be spandex jackets one for everyone What a beautiful world this will be What a glorious time to be free On that train all graphite and glitter Undersea by rail Ninety minutes from New York to Paris (More leisure for artists everywhere) A just machine to make big decisions Programmed by fellows with compassion and vision We'll be clean when their work is done We'll be eternally free yes and eternally young What a beautiful world this will be What a glorious time to be free Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted March 5, 2011 Author Share Posted March 5, 2011 Yeah, and where's my jet-pack? <wink> Well, no jet pack, but the device you are using to communicate this message is completely beyond the wildest dreams of those prognosticating in 1958. That communcator you carry in your pocket is pretty "trekkie" too. I just don't do pessimism. It's easy, but no fun at all... Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Islander Posted March 5, 2011 Share Posted March 5, 2011 That communcator you carry in your pocket is pretty "trekkie" too. Yes it is, and 3D printing is the replicator in its infancy. Right now, it's just used for prototyping of parts in plastic and some food prep, but it has enormous potential.More info: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3D_printingAnd it's available now, starting at $29,900: http://www.dimensionprinting.com/3d-printers/3d-printing-elite.aspx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted March 6, 2011 Author Share Posted March 6, 2011 Yes it is, and 3D printing is the replicator in its infancy. Here in Houston they are experimenting with the 3D printing of organs...I kid you not. VERY basicly inkjet technology printers that lay down a single layer of cells each pass. Considered very promising. These "gadgets" are natures way of accelerating evolution, IMHO. Obviously, others mileage varies on that. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted March 6, 2011 Author Share Posted March 6, 2011 Mark, seems like everytime we get close together on a point you fire a shotgun blast of red herrings. I see nothing in your post that directly address the single, clear point I made that you appear to be addressing other than your comment that my admitting bias towards optimism was irrelevant. I cannot tell whether you believe that government's ability to control information is important or not. I maintain it's been the main agent of control for x thousand years, and that weapon is rapidly becoming impotent. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted March 6, 2011 Author Share Posted March 6, 2011 Well, all I can say is you seem to be out of sync with most on this. Right, middle, and left all seem to agree that it is person to person communication the internet driving the current uprisings. I see no sign of them being staunched and, in fact, it seems they are able to work around these issues with increasing ease. In any event, shutting things down after the horse is out of the barn is too late, and trying to keep things shut down simply doesn't fly anymore. Even China is fumbling around trying to justify its policies to its own people. Personally, I think China is ripe for change. They may run the guy standing in front of the tank down this time...but the image will be everywhere and fuel the flames. We'd likely be in an entirely different situation today if that tank had simply kept moving. I, for one, and heartened that real "people power" is being fueled by access to such a wide variety of sources whether person to person...as we are doing...or through the untold terabytes of stored wisdom (and ignorance) that is available to all. Maybe you see nothing new, but I sincerely hope you are missing something here. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Islander Posted March 7, 2011 Share Posted March 7, 2011 Knowledge becoming understanding. Understanding becoming wisdom. Easy to write, not so easy to do. We're gaining knowledge far faster than we're gaining wisdom. Let's hope wisdom starts catching up soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted March 7, 2011 Author Share Posted March 7, 2011 Knowledge becoming understanding.Understanding becoming wisdom.Easy to write, not so easy to do.We're gaining knowledge far faster than we're gaining wisdom. Let's hope wisdom starts catching up soon. TRVTH Amen Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Islander Posted March 7, 2011 Share Posted March 7, 2011 Self-replicating machines are coming closer to reality, even in a desktop home form: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RepRap More about the concept: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-replicating_machine I haven't seen any info about anyone combining a self-replicating machine with an AI, but odds are that some people are doing it somewhere. As the saying goes, if something can be done, someone will do it. Once that idea becomes practical, it would be some kind of singularity, or at least a significant moment in history. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallette Posted March 7, 2011 Author Share Posted March 7, 2011 Some advanced thinkers have suggested that such technology could terraform Mars in a century. Basically, seed a few replicators that contruct machines to rapidly increase the cloud cover. Most of this stuff is a matter of will power and vision, not available science. The last "great American project," the Super Conducting Super Collider, was a victim of lack of both. No telling what we'd have learned by now if the skeptics and demagogues hadn't made a football out of it ridculing the scientists because they refused to predict in advance what it would reveal. Dave R2A waving goodbye to brother R2 who is now on ISS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Islander Posted March 7, 2011 Share Posted March 7, 2011 This very idea was covered in realistic detail in the Mars trilogy, by Kim Stanley Robinson. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mars_trilogy It should go better than the smaller-scale efforts on Earth that were done thoughtlessly, like the Anglo-forming and Euro-forming ideas in North America that have left us with a number of troublesome foreign plant and animal species that are nearly impossible to eradicate at this point. The early colonists missed seeing familiar plants and animals, so they released a few that reminded them of home, never imagining how they'd disrupt the ecosystem, since the very concept was still somewhere in the future. The rabbits and cane toads didn't work out too well for Australia, either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtimer Posted March 7, 2011 Share Posted March 7, 2011 Mark, seems like everytime we get close together on a point you fire a shotgun blast of red herrings. I see nothing in your post that directly address the single, clear point I made that you appear to be addressing other than your comment that my admitting bias towards optimism was irrelevant. I cannot tell whether you believe that government's ability to control information is important or not. I maintain it's been the main agent of control for x thousand years, and that weapon is rapidly becoming impotent. Dave http://techcrunch.com/2011/03/06/in-search-of-the-internet-kill-switch/?icid=main%7Chtmlws-main-tarana%7Cdl4%7Csec1_lnk1%7C205091 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSnyder Posted March 7, 2011 Share Posted March 7, 2011 Paranoyd much? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Islander Posted March 8, 2011 Share Posted March 8, 2011 Paranoyd much? Being paranoid is no proof they're not out to get you... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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