Problem with speech/high frequency sounds from my RC-64/RF-83 setup.

[garyrc]

It might be better to add a tweeter (or supertweeter) to each of the front channels than to get a new receiver or amps.

Our second system (in the bedroom, for TV and DVDs) uses Klipsch Promedia. I have heard that they were carefully voiced when designed by the people at Klipsch, but the sound has never been crisp enough, way duller than that of the Klipschorns & Belle Klipsch center in our main room. We mounted a pair of 34 year old EV T-35 tweeters (the same tweeter Klipsch markets tested/selected models of as K77s in Klipschorns, Belles, La Scalas, &, I believe, La Scalla IIs) just above the Promedia boxes, and fed them through equally old EV X-36 crosover networks with a couple of attenuators we bought cheap at Radio Shack. After playing with the attenuators a bit, the result is amazing! Clear, undistorted, crisp, sometimes shimmering music (cymbals), with very articulate crisp speech. The system has a lot of "air" and the illusion of depth. The power amp being used is the very inexpensive one in the Promedia, being fed with either the RCA flatscreen's "audio out" (for TV shows) or directly from the DVD player (for movies), through a Radio Shack switchbox. No preamp or receiver is needed.

[willland]

The tweeter operates, it just seems that is not operating properly, like you said, with weaker highs. I've played music through it and, while it strongly outputs cymbals, it seems to be missing the highest detail parts of the cymbals.

Wboffthe lake,

I think I may have a solution to your problem. I too, but only somewhat have noticed a slight tonal difference between my RF-63's and my RC-64, much in part possibly due to the RC-64 having a sealed cabinet and different crossover points. I have a pair of B&K amps(neutral/warmish tone) driving the front soundstage and they tend to roll off and smooth out the highs which is more pronounced with the RC-64. I just bought an Acurus amp which are known to be on the brighter side of neutral(like an Adcom) and now have it just powering my RC-64. The highs are more extended and more detailed and clearly are more tonally matched to the RF-63's.

http://community.klipsch.com/forums/t/151132.aspx

If you find there is nothing wrong with the operation of your RC-64, maybe you should pick up a used Acurus or Adcom amp and just hook it up to your RC-64 and see how it sounds.

http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?ampstran&1313555680&/Acurus-A150-

Clermontcop on the forum has a very nice Adcom amp he could sell you if you are interested.

Bill

[rayians]

I'm experiencing a very similiar problem. The RF-83's are extremely crisp and while the RC-64 sounds very good, the higher end highs are not nearly as prominent as they are in the 83's.

So far I changed the channel each speaker is on (put an RF-83 as center and RC-64 as a front), and still the RF-83 sounded much crisper. I also went as far as to take each speaker apart and actually swapped the tweeters from one speaker to the next. Same result, the RF-83's were still much crisper.

I am thinking the difference has to lie in the crossover network. The RF-83's high frequency crossover is listed at 1650 Hz, while the RC-64 is listed as 1150 Hz and 1800 Hz.

Therefore I am considering changing crossovers. My question is would putting an RF-83 crossover network in my RC-64 potentially harm it?

[rayians]

I finally figured out my problem with a good bit of experimentation. What helped me figure it out was when I set the RC-64 and an RF-83 directly next to one another and hooked up only the tweeter of each. I then hooked up the RC-64 as a right channel and the RF-83 as a center and voila, the RF-83 is now muddy and the RC-64 was bright and crisp!

Therefore it was obvioulsy the output of my Yamaha receiver. However, it was purchased brand new and the EQ was set properly. I can only assume it was set from factory that way, why I am not sure. I picked up a Pioneer VSX-1121-K and it sounds AMAZING! Not to mention, there is plenty of adjustment left on the EQ unlike the Yamaha in which all the high frequencies were cranked up and I still wasn't happy with the sound.

If any other Yamaha receiver owners are having a similiar problem with your center channel not sounding as crisp as your fronts, perhaps you should upgrade your receiver. You won't believe the difference!!

[garyrc]

Therefore it was obvioulsy the output of my Yamaha receiver.

If others are having this problem, pour throught the receiver manual. I don't know if this has anything to do with the problem, but some receiver/preamp/speaker manufacturers are paranoid about the slightest trace of sibilance, so they attenuate the highs in the center (dialog) channel, or provide a switchable
attenuation. Make sure you don't have this (stupid) feature switched
on. Sometimes it is couched in language such as "Movie" and the manual
tells you that it is to turn down the treble when playing DVDs and Blu-rays, because they are often too bright (false!). A little sibilance is a natural feature of speech and singing, and most recordists are careful to keep it from getting out of hand.

[rayians]

I figured it was something like that, like Yamaha set it up so I couldn't make my center channel too brassy. Speech sounded okay through it for the most part, but unfortunately there are other sounds that come through the center channel besides the human voice. When a sound went, for example, left, center, right, it always seemed to fade off when it hit the center. It was never a setting on the EQ or the gain. I spent hours making sure they were set as accurately as can be.

I went through my manual and menus on the Yamaha at least 5x thinking there was some sort of setting I was missing. Unfortunatley there was NO setting to be had on mine, it was factory preset and I could do nothing to change it (well, except sell it and get my Pioneer). Thats pretty poor engineering in my book. It's left such a bad taste in my mouth I swore I'd never buy another Yamaha again!

In the end all that matters is the Klipsch speakers now sound great together and I've got a solid foundation to build an amazing system around!

[Islander]

Some Yamaha AVRs have an equalizer for the centre channel so it can be tailored to sound more like the main speakers. Does yours have this feature? It's called GEQ on the menu, for Graphic EQualizer.

[rayians]

There was a GEQ for each individual channel. I had all high frequencies all the way up on the center channel and it still didn't sound nearly as crisp as the fronts that were set roughly half to three quarters of the way up.