GoFastr Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 I just purchased a RC-64II center from another forum member here to go with my RF-7 classic fronts. I also bought a Acoustech/BIC PL-200 sub in order to upgrade from a 2.0 system to a 3.1 (until I can get my rear surrounds wired up). I must say the center makes a great difference in clarity during blu-ray movies and HD TV channels. I absolutely love it! I was initially aprehensive about the size of the RC-64II but I think I made the right choice considering I had a hard time trying to find a RC-7. Audyssey set them up automatically as follows and I might experiment with some manual settings as time passes. Front Left= -6.5dB, Center= -1.5dB Front Right= -5.0dB, Sub= 0.0 dB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robc1976 Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 I just purchased a RC-64II center from another forum member here to go with my RF-7 classic fronts. I also bought a Acoustech/BIC PL-200 sub in order to upgrade from a 2.0 system to a 3.1 (until I can get my rear surrounds wired up). I must say the center makes a great difference in clarity during blu-ray movies and HD TV channels. I absolutely love it! I was initially aprehensive about the size of the RC-64II but I think I made the right choice considering I had a hard time trying to find a RC-7. Audyssey set them up automatically as follows and I might experiment with some manual settings as time passes. Front Left= -6.5dB, Center= -1.5dB Front Right= -5.0dB, Sub= 0.0 dB It set your center at -1.5Db....your center must be far away from MLP?? It set my center at -8.0 and i am about 12 ft away...I bumped it up to about -6.5. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cornfedksboy Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 Lots of reasons it might have set it at -1.5 db, however, my first guess would be that the speakers were not directed at the mic during the run. Also, with the towers being 1.5 dbs different, it's possible that the amps aren't balanced. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen Traveler Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 Congratulations! I am always happy to hear that someone is pleased pairing the older RF-7s with the RC-64ii and am still curious how it compares with the RC-7....That being said, My front 3 speakers are all about 9 ft from my LP and Audyssey set my RF-7 trim level at -4.5 and the RC-7 at -3. It is interesting that you got "0.0" on the sub....Did you use a mic stand (or tripod) for the calibration and run all of the eq positions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pite Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 RC-64 II - it's a nice dynamic and powerful center channel speaker... [Y] Great, that you like it as well... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoFastr Posted September 4, 2011 Author Share Posted September 4, 2011 It's a big Family Room 25' x 35'. Audyssey calculated my listening posistion at Front Left= 17.5', Center=18.5', Front Right= 19.5'. The listening position isn't exactly centered so that is why the settings are a bit skewed. I did all 6-7 of the Audyssey mic settings and they were in different listening positions, some were even from the side at the bar stools. I didn't direct the speakers at the mic each time because I wouldn't be doing that normally when listening to music or watching a movie. I wanted Audyssey to calibrate the best sound for each position. I have hard floor tiles with no area rugs yet. The walls are cement block and the ceiling is 10' high with sheetrock. I know I need a lot of room softenings which will hopefully bring a better listening experience in time. I need to run Audyssey again for the sub as I haven't had a chance too yet so that is why it is set to 0.0dB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robc1976 Posted September 4, 2011 Share Posted September 4, 2011 It's a big Family Room 25' x 35'. Audyssey calculated my listening posistion at Front Left= 17.5', Center=18.5', Front Right= 19.5'. The listening position isn't exactly centered so that is why the settings are a bit skewed. I did all 6-7 of the Audyssey mic settings and they were in different listening positions, some were even from the side at the bar stools. I didn't direct the speakers at the mic each time because I wouldn't be doing that normally when listening to music or watching a movie. I wanted Audyssey to calibrate the best sound for each position. I have hard floor tiles with no area rugs yet. The walls are cement block and the ceiling is 10' high with sheetrock. I know I need a lot of room softenings which will hopefully bring a better listening experience in time. I need to run Audyssey again for the sub as I haven't had a chance too yet so that is why it is set to 0.0dB. That is a good sized room......mine is 25' X 25'. Tthe most important thing is the first measurment in the "Sweet spot" wich it gets the distance measurments ect. Also when measuring you dont want to go to far outside of the speakers path or you would get a innacurate measurement. I bet the sysyem is going to sound great! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen Traveler Posted September 4, 2011 Share Posted September 4, 2011 I'm not sure how you ran Audyssey but you need to position the mic upward on a stand with the first position at your main Listening position and the rest within the boundaries of your listening positions not getting too close to any walls. You will also want to run all of the positions again with the sub included. Insofar as your speaker distance and room size...Sitting 18 ft away from your front soundstage and still getting those negative trim numbers is a good sign, but I am surprised. {Edit: I'm also wonderiing if you may have your center channel too low or not pointed at the LP, becuase I think it would be within a couple dB of your mains given their similar distance} Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenM Posted September 4, 2011 Share Posted September 4, 2011 FWIW, after my most recent experience with Audyssey, I'd recommend manually checking the trim levels with an SPL meter. After adding my new sub and re-running the setup, things sounded like far too bass heavy. I ran it like 5 more times...same result. Finally did a manual check of the trim levels, and what the heck do you know: pink noise for the sub was right at 75dB like it ought to be. The mains? Ohh Audyssey saw fit to dial them down to 68dB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robc1976 Posted September 4, 2011 Share Posted September 4, 2011 FWIW, after my most recent experience with Audyssey, I'd recommend manually checking the trim levels with an SPL meter. After adding my new sub and re-running the setup, things sounded like far too bass heavy. I ran it like 5 more times...same result. Finally did a manual check of the trim levels, and what the heck do you know: pink noise for the sub was right at 75dB like it ought to be. The mains? Ohh Audyssey saw fit to dial them down to 68dB.This is VERY good info! MY system it sets the trim a bit to low...I go up about 2Db on the sub and I like a lot of vocals on my center so I go up 1.5 on that. So basically you atre saying it set the speakers lower than it should have? I have heard that most SPL meters are not as accurate as Audyssey's mic, not sying yours isnt...just putting it out there. This is good info regardless! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cornfedksboy Posted September 4, 2011 Share Posted September 4, 2011 I use Audyssey as a basline and tweak things from there. I don't have an SPL, but you should be able to fine tune by ear. Basically, with matched speakers set at the same distance I put the towers at the same level and the center within 1 or 2 dbs of the fronts (so long as my amps are matched). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen Traveler Posted September 4, 2011 Share Posted September 4, 2011 This is VERY good info! MY system it sets the trim a bit to low...I go up about 2Db on the sub and I like a lot of vocals on my center so I go up 1.5 on that. So basically you atre saying it set the speakers lower than it should have? I have heard that most SPL meters are not as accurate as Audyssey's mic, not sying yours isnt...just putting it out there. This is good info regardless! If you aren't using an SPL meter yourself then you are setting it to your preference (nothing wrong with that) because generally Audyssey is pretty accurate when it comes to level matching the speakers to each other but some have found it be slightly off by 3 db or so for the whole system... That being said, when it comes to the subwoofer that's where some people seem to be accustomed to their own bass settings which isn't always in-line with level-matching it to the other speakers...Chris on the Audyssey thread at AVS explained that folks sometimes gets used to "bloated bass" and after trying the recommended settings people start experiencing tighter bass that may not have as much reverberation.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenM Posted September 4, 2011 Share Posted September 4, 2011 So basically you atre saying it set the speakers lower than it should have? Yup, by 7dB. I have heard that most SPL meters are not as accurate as Audyssey's mic Consumer SPL meters are by no means precision instruments. However, because pink noise is a broadband signal, it does lead to a relatively accurate reading. This is simply a result of the averaging that occurs which balances out the peaks and dips of the room, the speaker, and the accuracy of the meter that may be an issue at any given frequency. Of note, one recommendation I was given by Ed Mullen over at SVS when I was troubleshooting my issue was to adjust the sub level to about 73dB instead of the usual 75dB. This is because the sub is responding to the pink noise signal at lower frequencies where the meter is naturally less sensitive, and will lead to slightly lower readings than actual. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen Traveler Posted September 4, 2011 Share Posted September 4, 2011 Yup, by 7dB. That's quite a bit more than I have ever seen reported in the Audyssey Thread at AVS without there being error...You should go there and post your results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenM Posted September 5, 2011 Share Posted September 5, 2011 I put a post on there, although I have my suspicions that the mic somehow got damaged; I have successfully set up in the past several times, and only when I got the new sub was there a problem. There are a lot of mistakes one can make, but I've read through Audyssey's material on how to properly perform the setup, and I feel fairly confident that I'm not the problem. Moreover, the results I get are all over the map: distances always remain the same, and that's good, but speaker trim levels varied by as much as 3dB, and the XO was all over the map going from 100Hz all the way to setting my speakers as full range. I would blame changes in mic placement, but one of the advantages to a tile floor is that you can be pretty darned precise when you're setting up a tripod, speakers, and furniture. If anything moved by a single centimeter, I'd be aware of it. Doesn't matter too much in the end; I'm happy with the sound after I leveled things out manually. It does make me wonder what the heck Audyssey did with the EQ side though... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen Traveler Posted September 5, 2011 Share Posted September 5, 2011 I .... Moreover, the results I get are all over the map: distances always remain the same, and that's good, but speaker trim levels varied by as much as 3dB, and the XO was all over the map going from 100Hz all the way to setting my speakers as full range. ... I run large Speakers all of the way around and my Denon (not Audyssey, btw) would find 6 of my speakers as "Large" and Audyssey recommends going back and changing those to "Small," and establishing a crossover....In Bass Mgmt there is an advanced setting where you can see the crossover that Audyssey came up with (it was 40 Hz for my RF-7s & 60 Hz for my other "Large" speakers and it set my RC-7 to 100 Hz). I found that a 60 Hz crossover works best for my Home Theater and left the RC-7 at 100 Hz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenM Posted September 5, 2011 Share Posted September 5, 2011 Yeah, I ended up manually setting mine at 50Hz, which has works well in my setup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robc1976 Posted September 5, 2011 Share Posted September 5, 2011 Doesn't matter too much in the end; I'm happy with the sound after I leveled things out manually. ...This is the most important thing...sounds good to you then a job well done! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenM Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 For those that may have an interest: I didn't get any feedback on AVS, so I went to Audyssey themselves with my questions. Per their advice, the mic is calibrated +/- 2dB with my receiver. I asked if it was possible that the mic were damaged and giving faulty readings; answer is no, if the mic were damaged, it simply wouldn't operate. On my question of why the mains were set so low per my SPL meter, they couldn't really answer that one too well; they agreed that with the receiver's pink noise on the mains, my SPL meter should be fairly accurate, although without examining the meter itself its impossible to say for certain. Either way, the story comes to an interesting conclusion. With one last Audyssey run, I decided to up the gain on the sub a couple notches, I got a much different result. Previously, it had been cutting my mains by 9dB in the trim level; this time, it was only a cut of 4.5dB. With the sub, it cut the gain by 10dB (max is +/-15 for my receiver). Now my SPL meter is recording levels of 72.5dB for the mains and 72-76dB for the sub. Close enough for government work, and it sounded pretty darned good with Tron Legacy on Blu Ray and some AC/DC last night. Why the difference? I have no idea....No change in the primary measurement position from which trim levels are set....So...yeah. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonicSeeker Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 Glad your enjoying it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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