Fortes & Tubes: Buying Help

[ChipByrd]

I posted a similar message a few weeks ago. I am still looking to try some tubes. Here's my dilemma: I am an electronic moron. I have been reading about push/pull, ultra linear, SET, etc. I have some basic understanding of how these work, but not enough to be truly helpful. Add to the mix Chinese vs. American, old vs. new and i find myself utterly confused.

So... I am looking for suggestions. Here's my musical criteria. I want to experience the "airy highs" and "pristine mids" that I hear people talking about with acoustics and vocals. At the same time, I sometimes listen to classic rock and I do want strong bass. (As an aside, that's a part of what hooked me on the Fortes-good, solid, musical bass.). From what I've read, you will give up some bass control when moving from SS, and that's ok. I am not a bass head, but with some music you just need a bit of slam. I listen to music at moderate to moderately high volumes, but never ear splitting levels.

I would like to keep the cost for an integrated tube amp under $1500.00 and under $1200.00 would be even better. Used is likely preferred. I currently have Cambridge Audio separates (840w & 840e), which I really enjoy. But I have heard so much about tubes and horns I want to give them a shot. After a month or so of living with tubes, I will either sell the CAs or the tubes depending on which setup my ears like best.

Anyway... I would appreciate any suggestions you men might have.

One final thing, is there anyone near West Michigan running tubes and Fortes who would be willing to invite a novice over for a listening session ?

[tube fanatic]

The only way to know what you will enjoy is to hear the amps in your system. Perhaps you can find a dealer who offers a return privilege (i.e. Decware) so you won't get stuck with something which isn't pleasing. Or as you asked in your last sentence, perhaps there is someone in your area who is running tubes/Fortes who can give you a listen (keeping in mind that it won't sound the same in your room.)

[ChipByrd]

Since
I will probably go used, I don't know if the dealer/demo thing will work. And I
know that every piece of gear will sound a bit different in every room. The
problem I have is that I don't know anyone local who even owns tubes, much less
combines them with Fortes.

Maybe it would help if I mentioned a couple I have found at
different places for sale. These are all between $800 - $1400:

Raysonic SP-66

Jungson DA-88TI

Jolida 502 CRC

Cayin
A-55T

PrimaLuna
Dialogue Two

Are any of these models sleepers that I should definitely
consider? Are any of them dogs that I should avoid?

[tube fanatic]

In general Jolida, Cayin, and PrimaLuna have all gotten good reviews of their products. Do a search and you will likely find actual reviews of those specific amps which will help you to make a decision. If any of the sellers are close to where you live, perhaps they would be willing to bring the amp to your house for a listen. Of course, buying used you have no way of knowing if any work has been done on them so it is always a bit of a gamble. You also don't know how many hours of use the tubes have seen, so you could wind up having to replace some in short order. As far as asking price goes, look around online to see what similar amps have sold for on the various sites (and offer a lot less to get negotiations going!) Good luck with the search and post any additional questions as they arise.

[NOSValves]

No sleepers on your list but the Cayin and Primaluna line of integrated amps are a good value in entry level tube gear. Your budget is too low for the really killer stuff. A used properly rebuilt Scott or Fisher brand vintage amp in the 30 WPC range would be the true sleepers!

[finallygotmyheresies]

I suggest buying a tube amp that is well regarded on this forum. If you aren't happy with the sound then you would be able to sell it here and try another one.

I started with a Dared VP-20, bought used here. I then moved upward and onward to a McIntosh 240 and then 275 bought locally and finally to a VRD that I got used on here as well.

With patience the used market can allow you to experience different pieces of gear without taking a 25-50% hit associated with buying and selling new gear.

I say use the judgement of the local gurus and you will be very happy with the sound you get. I sure have been.

[ChipByrd]

A used properly rebuilt Scott or Fisher brand vintage amp in the 30 WPC range would be the true sleepers!

If I may ask about the competition, there is a modded Scott 222c for sale that was worked over by Mapleshade. The guy is asking $799, but I imagine I can talk him down. Would this be a sleeper?

[Ski Bum]

That Scott may be a good choice. (I cast a skeptical eye toward Mapleshade due to their hucksterism of expensive woo products, but they do make great sounding recordings, and at least some of what they do does not rely on magical thinking.)

Also, peruse the Garage Sale section of this forum. There was a NOSvalves refurbed Scott posted here just a couple weeks ago, which, since the one who refurbed it is in this conversation, may be less of a mystery than the Mapleshade refurbed one. One of my Decware amps is still listed there too, if you want to make me an offer.

[muel]

If I had a Mapleshade rebuilt Scott I think I would send it to Craig to have him reconnect the tone circuit. My understanding from their advertising is that they bypass that section which is where some of the "magic" lives IMHO!

[jcmusic]

I posted a similar message a few weeks ago. I am still looking to try some tubes. Here's my dilemma: I am an electronic moron. I have been reading about push/pull, ultra linear, SET, etc. I have some basic understanding of how these work, but not enough to be truly helpful. Add to the mix Chinese vs. American, old vs. new and i find myself utterly confused. So... I am looking for suggestions. Here's my musical criteria. I want to experience the "airy highs" and "pristine mids" that I hear people talking about with acoustics and vocals. At the same time, I sometimes listen to classic rock and I do want strong bass. (As an aside, that's a part of what hooked me on the Fortes-good, solid, musical bass.). From what I've read, you will give up some bass control when moving from SS, and that's ok. I am not a bass head, but with some music you just need a bit of slam. I listen to music at moderate to moderately high volumes, but never ear splitting levels. I would like to keep the cost for an integrated tube amp under $1500.00 and under $1200.00 would be even better. Used is likely preferred. I currently have Cambridge Audio separates (840w & 840e), which I really enjoy. But I have heard so much about tubes and horns I want to give them a shot. After a month or so of living with tubes, I will either sell the CAs or the tubes depending on which setup my ears like best. Anyway... I would appreciate any suggestions you men might have. One final thing, is there anyone near West Michigan running tubes and Fortes who would be willing to invite a novice over for a listening session ?

Hi Chris,

I have a rebuilt Scott 299 that Craig did about 6 years ago, it is matched to my Fortre II's and you better believe the sound is awesome. Just find the right tubes to match your likes and enjoy!!! Craig does first class high quality work on the vintage stuff you can't go wrong with one of his rebuilds.

Jay