KLF 20 Midrange upgrades......

[Klipschtastic]

I haven't been on the forum for awhile because I lived in an apartment for a year and half so didn't really use my KLF 20's. Now I'm in a house and ready to crank them up again. I've always liked the lively and dynamic nature of the KLF 20's but on many recordings found them a bit too harsh. So much in fact that I was just about ready to give up and look for some other speakers. I am really reluctant to let go of these though because in a time of skinny delicate looking speakers these things are heavy duty, loud, dynamic beasts. Mine have the Crites Tweeters and stock midranges. Being effectively a newb at the technical aspects of speaker despite having own rf3's since 1999, I began to try and pinpoint the offending driver or drivers. I occluded the tweeters with my hands and immediatly realized the midranges sounded overbearing, especially with guitar heavy music like metal (Metallica Ride the Lightning or with harmonized vocals like on track #8 on Steely Dan's Pretzel Logic). At high volume levels it sounded like the vocals were coming through a megaphone. On Jazz music, the horns do sound great and I'm happy with the way piano comes through without the occlusion.

I covered the midranges' (throats?) with clear postal tape (the type that one would use to seal a box) and Metallica never sounded so amazing. The megaphone sound was gone and these speakers were godlike with the powerful bass and beatiful,crisp highs. I also learned that I am not at all offended by the Titanium tweeters. In fact, they're perfect. My excitement for these speakers is renewed again and I would love to find a way to replicate this sound through upgrades. I'm thinking the Ti midranges with Bob Crites' attenuation modifications to the crossovers may be in order. Could someone who has made these modifications please describe the difference it made in the sound of the midrange horns? I would like to dial back the midranges as much as is reasonably advisable.

Thanks

Jon

[garyrc]

Sounds like you want to pad down the midrange driver without affecting the tweeter. One of the technically minded people on the forum -- maybe Crites (?) -- can probably tell you if this can be done without screwing up. It has been so long since I have thought about L pads, T pads, etc, I couldn't say much except keep trying and someone qualified will answer.

I do know that, way back, a Good Guys sales (or Tech?) person told a visiting Paul Klipsch that he had to pad down a Klipschorn midrange, and heard many colofrul combinations of words in Paul's reply.

Klipsch is known for very present midranges. PWK said something like, "The midrange is where we live." With my Klipschorns, the midrange is too loud on some CDs, but on no movies. Why? Search me.

Edited December 22, 2013 by Garyrc

[Deang]

I have a pair of drop in replacement crossovers for the KLF-20s that I would like to sell. I have upgraded the capacitors and resistors. The sound will be smoother and a little warmer. They are boxed and ready to ship. I'm getting ready to bump my original thread on these -- please see the Garage Sale section if you're interested.

[pzannucci]

One thing that also can help is using a thin, say 1/4 inch thick foam on one or two sides of the horn.

This can significantly reduce the horn brashness and possible colorations. This might be worth a try before trying to do crossover work though knowing what Dean has attacked on other crossover ventures, the crossover update may be your final answer.

Room treatments will actually make significant differences also but if you have significant other acceptance factors, they may not be appropriate.

[Klipschtastic]

Thanks Pzannucci. I actually used plumber's putty on the mid horns and that seems to help a bit. Plus I believe I was a bit hard on the KLF's and may owe them an apology. Yesterday i went into a new hi fi store here in town and listen to come RF 7's and some B&W towers (not sure the model). The B&W's sounded just as bright if not brighter than the RF7's in the store when cranked up with Joe Satriani' wailing guitars. The Rf 7's sounded awesome BTW. I think I'm going to try the Crites midranges next. and then possibly crossover stuff.

[pzannucci]

I thought it was interesting that the last review I saw on B&W speakers show some major issues in the response including peakiness in the mid upper treble. All the article stated was that B&W must know what they are doing. KLF's aren't exactly smooth and depending on the room, can get quite ugly. I'm not sure they are any worse than the much more expensive B&W's. For my money I would choose the Klipsch unless I wanted the false sense of air and detail due to the B&W peakiness.

[moray james]

pzannucci: KLF have some issues but you can work with them. For starters KLF20 were fitted with poly tweeter diaphragms which are the worst diaphragms Klipsch ever made. You can replace them witha a set of phenolic diaphragms but your money will be best spent on a set of Bob Crites titanium diaphragms. One of the other things you need to look into is the baffles. KLF speakers had a manufacturing problem with the adhesive used to bond the front and back baffles to the other cabinet panels which are assembled with a different adhesive. The baffles are bonded with a hot melt adhesive and the reason for this is because the baffles are lamamitaed on both sides with a thin layer of textured black t melamine. The melamine looks great but it is almost as no stick as teflon and that is why a special hot melt glue was used. The problem was the manufacturer of the hot melt made a bad batch and there were lots of KLF with baffles which came loose. If your baffles are loose your speakers will sound awfull. You can check your baffles with a rubber mallet to see if they are loose. I have owned three sets of KLF20 did not check one set before I sold them but the other two both have loose baffles. These are the two major problems with KLF20 or 30 loudspeakers that you will have to deal with. Dealing with loose baffles is a bit of a fus but it is not difficult just a little time consuming but you only need to fix them once and they are very much worth the effort. I hope that this is of interest. Best regards Moray James.

[Dinesh Jonnadula]

I want to upgrade my klf 20's wtih crites upgrades . can you please throw some light on what can be done and how much of a difference it can make?

[Maz4bz]

Hi Dinesh,

I recently acquired some KG 5.5's and have been trying to make as many improvements as I can with minimal outlay before I move to the Crites diaphragms and crossover upgrades which for me will cost $200+. 

 

From what I can tell by reading about the KLF's, these have many of the same potential improvements that my KG's have benefited from.  

 

Of all the changes I have made I'd say adding L-pad modules have had an enormously beneficial impact with almost negligible cost.

 

Looking back up at this old thread I notice the same harshness issue raised here in relation to the KLF's that I too experienced with my KG's. Adding simple L-pads have completely solved this issue for about $1.50 per speaker. My experiences are documented here.

 

Hope this helps.

[Dinesh Jonnadula]

THanks a lot. will try it out