CECAA850 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Just Does not seem right is all, since its Bill's design I'm sure his measurements are correct and my interpretation is not. Is this the same way you interpreted that the F-20 was a rip off of Bills design? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClaudeJ1 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 (edited) Is this the same way you interpreted that the F-20 was a rip off of Bills design? The F-20 is actually a longer front loaded horn with back air chamber. It also benefits from corner loading........down into the teens. Below 20 Hz. the wavelengths get really long really FAST with any subwoofer and it is difficult to get that low for this type of horn without it becoming bigger than the room it's in. Tapped horns, bass reflex, and Infinte baffles with a room full of 18" drivers can be a better solution if that's the goal. Sub bass is the most expensive part of any system. Size-wise and watts-wise. Edited July 29, 2014 by ClaudeJ1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason str Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Looking at the horn from the side its a 3 Ft cube. Looking at the horn from the side it's a 3 foot square. Square, cube. same thing in a 2 dimensional side view like i was speaking of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason str Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Just Does not seem right is all, since its Bill's design I'm sure his measurements are correct and my interpretation is not. Is this the same way you interpreted that the F-20 was a rip off of Bills design? The horm path itself is practically identical, what would you call it ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 The horm path itself is practically identical, what would you call it ? According to Claude the F-20 has a longer horn path. As noted, I don't have the plans for the THT. The reason I asked was because there was a question posted earlier as to how you figure the horn path and how BFM does. It seemed different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason str Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 The horm path itself is practically identical, what would you call it ? According to Claude the F-20 has a longer horn path. As noted, I don't have the plans for the THT. The reason I asked was because there was a question posted earlier as to how you figure the horn path and how BFM does. It seemed different. So i could add a inch or whatever to the La Scala cabinet and call it my design ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 The horm path itself is practically identical, what would you call it ? According to Claude the F-20 has a longer horn path. As noted, I don't have the plans for the THT. The reason I asked was because there was a question posted earlier as to how you figure the horn path and how BFM does. It seemed different. So i could add a inch or whatever to the La Scala cabinet and call it my design ? If your Lascala looks nothing like the original, works better and is easier to build then sure. By your logic, every horn that is anywhere near the same length as another is copying it. I just don't see it. YMMV. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason str Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 The horm path itself is practically identical, what would you call it ? According to Claude the F-20 has a longer horn path. As noted, I don't have the plans for the THT. The reason I asked was because there was a question posted earlier as to how you figure the horn path and how BFM does. It seemed different. So i could add a inch or whatever to the La Scala cabinet and call it my design ? If your Lascala looks nothing like the original, works better If it worked better it would be a plus, no doubt there, the La Scala design has been copied on more than one occasion. and is easier to build then sure. This could be a tradeoff, easy does not always mean better By your logic, every horn that is anywhere near the same length as another is copying it. I just don't see it. YMMV. I never said anything about horn length. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 If you have a copy just follow the measurements of the horn path. I took this as a reference to the horn length. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaddeus Smith Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Has anyone taken the time to ask Lil'Mike? Are all of his designs assumed to be derivative? It seems hardly fair to knock guy on a separate forum without the chance to defend himself. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason str Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Has anyone taken the time to ask Lil'Mike? Are all of his designs assumed to be derivative? It seems hardly fair to knock guy on a separate forum without the chance to defend himself. Good idea, Lil Mike could post on Bill's forum or one of the many DIY forum's and answer any questions about the design. Not sure about the other designs myself but others on a DIY forum may be able to offer more insight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaddeus Smith Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Or you (and therefore Bill) could post on his numerous AVSF threads and ask for provenance of his design(s). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason str Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 I'm just a builder and gave my opinion on the subject and could care less one way or the other. I don't speak for Bill Fitzmaurice and I'm quite sure he does not speak for me. Feel free to post on the subject wherever you feel is best, this may not be the proper place for it in my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Maybe it's just me but I'm having trouble seeing the similarities. If you think about it, the extension is determined by the length of the horn. FLH's with similar extension have to have similar horn lengths, or so I would think. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 I'm just a builder and gave my opinion on the subject Feel free to post on the subject wherever you feel is best, this may not be the proper place for it in my opinion. ? I never would have considered the relationship between the two but you said "The F-20 is just a THT knockoff". I was just curious as to why you thought so or brought it up in the first place. We can close the subject if you like. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason str Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Maybe it's just me but I'm having trouble seeing the similarities. If you think about it, the extension is determined by the length of the horn. FLH's with similar extension have to have similar horn lengths, or so I would think. Straighten the horn path and you will see, the F-20 even uses the same recommended driver. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason str Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 I'm just a builder and gave my opinion on the subject Feel free to post on the subject wherever you feel is best, this may not be the proper place for it in my opinion. ? I never would have considered the relationship between the two but you said "The F-20 is just a THT knockoff". I was just curious as to why you thought so or brought it up in the first place. We can close the subject if you like. Claude brought up the F-20 before i mentioned the subject in post #64, i did not bring it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 the F-20 even uses the same recommended driver The F-20 was designed originally to use up the glut of MFW 15 drivers on the market after that company went belly up. Once those were gone, the Dayton was used as an alternative. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CECAA850 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Claude brought up the F-20 before i mentioned the subject in post #64, i did not bring it up. Yes, Claude brought up the F-20 first. I was referring to your "knockoff" statement. I think Claude has some valid points. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason str Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 The THT was designed around the Adire Tempest 15 but the driver has been discontinued. The Dayton RSS390 is a much better driver anyways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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