mobile homeless Posted November 13, 2002 Share Posted November 13, 2002 The cost of tube gear ownership is slightly higher. But the reward it great. Frankly, if they came out with a solid state amp that REALLY DID sound just like a tube amp with all the same qualities, I would BUY IT IN A SECOND. The REAL reason for tube gear is that once you have really tasted it, moving back to solid state is VERY hard to do. Some dont have a problem with this (many have reported as much via this forum). Indeed, I dont mind certain SS amps and like the perspective at times. On the other hand, for long term listening and real musical enjoyment, they dont do it for me, even the ULTRA expensive options, which in many ways, ARE WORSE. The trouble and extra expense is negligable in the greater scheme of things compared to the rewards. I felt like you did one time long ago. I used to run a tube preamp and solid state amps in the 80s and early 90s, most of the time. I sold my last SS amp a few years ago. kh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougdrake Posted November 13, 2002 Share Posted November 13, 2002 Shoe - You would have no trouble using your sub in your setup along with a tube amp, as far as blending it in. The trick may be in sharing it between a tube system for music and an HT system (which would use your SS amp, I assume). To use the sub for music, there are 2 ways to do this (if your tube amp lacks a sub output, as my 43 year old Fisher amp does). One is to hook the speaker leads to the sub, then hook the speakers to the sub. This puts the sub crossover in front of your speakers to let you pull the low bass out of the signal going to your speakers. The other way is to hook a second pair of speaker wires to your tube amp, and run them to the sub and they dead-end there. This sends full range to both the speakers and the sub, and you use the sub x-over to control how high it reaches. If you want to use the sub for the HT and 2-channel, using different amps, you may be able to connect the line level feed from your HT to the sub at the same time you have the speaker level leads from your tube amp hooked to the sub. Better check with Klipsch tech support on that one. But be sure you don't have both amps on at the same time. That avoids having to swap the sub connections between amps (unless you are connecting the speakers to the sub, in which case you'd have to switch the sub connectons to the amp in order to swing the speakers to the correct amp as well). You'll still need to swap the speaker connections between SS and tube amps, switching them either at the speaker end (as I do) or at the amp end, if you have easy access to the rear of the amps. I use banana plugs on the speaker end of my speaker wires to facilitate switching them there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnalOg Posted November 13, 2002 Share Posted November 13, 2002 Hi All, Since were on the subject of amps, I would like some feedback on the sound characteristics of the Musical Fidelity a300 integrated amp, if anyone has any input. I'm going to be driving it with rf3's. I posted this in the past but didnt get much of a response. Sorry for the repetetive post! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mace Posted November 13, 2002 Share Posted November 13, 2002 Hi, Well, somewhere I missed the fact that the 2220 is part of the B&K Reference line. It is my understanding from what I've read here and heard at the dealer that there is indeed more differrence than just watts between reference and the ST line. Although, I cannot specify because I don't know from first hand experience, I've heard the reference line amps are a noticable step above the ST line in sound quality. As far as the tube thing... I'm thinking in about 5-10 years when the kids are older and I've a little more time to futz and compare and buy and sell I may dive into tubes full force. For now, I'm just enjoying immensely what I have - and still trying to decide for certain which pair of speakers to keep (which has become a little more difficult with the better amp). Mace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoe11 Posted November 14, 2002 Share Posted November 14, 2002 dougdrake- Thanks for the great information. ~shoe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougdrake Posted November 14, 2002 Share Posted November 14, 2002 shoe - And, of course, I totally dodged the whole x-over/volume settings issue... That will come with experimentation, of course. I'd try setting the sub x-over about 10-15hz below the cutoff of your mains as a starting point. For volume, you would probably want it to be set to play at the same level as your mains with test signals going through them. A Radio Shack SPL meter is grand for that. The above applies to the non-HT use of the sub. For HT use, you would probably disable the sub x-over and just have your pre-amp/receiver handle the bass x-over. Hopefully, you can adjust the volume level enough from within the receiver's channel levels so you don't have to manually tweak the sub's volume know when you switch from HT to 2-channel use. DD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pettyfeversk Posted November 14, 2002 Author Share Posted November 14, 2002 Well, I hooked up my R-7 speakers to the B & K Reference 2220 and to be honest, I was disapointed with the amp. I had the Adcom GFA 555 and had thought that the Reference B& K was going to be wonderful in comparison. Well, it was better in certain ways(smoother), but I am still not satisfied with the sound from it and am going to go in another direction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kain Posted November 14, 2002 Share Posted November 14, 2002 ---------------- On 11/14/2002 3:58:43 PM pettyfeversk wrote: Well, I hooked up my R-7 speakers to the B & K Reference 2220 and to be honest, I was disapointed with the amp. I had the Adcom GFA 555 and had thought that the Reference B& K was going to be wonderful in comparison. Well, it was better in certain ways(smoother), but I am still not satisfied with the sound from it and am going to go in another direction. ---------------- I would give the Rotel RMB-1095 (200 watts x 5) and the Parasound HCA-2205AT (220 watts x 5) a try. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted November 14, 2002 Share Posted November 14, 2002 To my mind, B&K has not been the same company since the mid-90s. I think they changed design teams and their chief tech Ed left. I am not sure about this but seem to remember a total restructure of the company. If you really want a jump up in sonics and power with more of a black backround, go for the Bryston 4B-ST (note: the model back from the latest SST). The 4B-St is a sigificantly more powerful amp than the 3B-st and will sound an order of magnitude better than the Adcom. Only get this amp used or heavily discounted as it is discontinued. I think the Bryston 4B-ST is a VERY nice amp for solid state with EXCELLENT clarity and tremendous bass, an order of magnitude more extended than what you have heard in the Adcom and new B&K. Of course, I prefer tube amps but if going solid state, the 4B-ST is VERY nice. Dont get the 4B either; go for the ST version - USED of course. It also has a 20yr transferable warranty. And if you DO opt for B&K, get the older models such as the B&K EX-442 or the B&K ST-202, and amp that is actually CHEAPER than the 555 but much smoother and more refined. I am interested what you are looking for in an amp actually. Have you heard many amps? kh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pettyfeversk Posted November 14, 2002 Author Share Posted November 14, 2002 To: Mobile Homeless I had the same Adcom GFA 555 for over 15 years and have not had the opportunity to hear other amps with my system other than Adcom and B& K. I have listened to friends systems with various other amplifiers along the way. To answer your question, I am looking for an amp that delivers a smoothness in sound that allows your to listen for long periods without feeling the harshness or fatigue that you get with the Adcom. There is a hardness to the Adcom sound. When I have heard pleasing sounding systems in my friends homes, the amps produced a quality soundstage that was easy to listen to and also lifelike in terms of depth and clarity. That is the best way I can describe it . I dont claim to be an audiophile. I just possess very good hearing and can discern different sonic quality. I know the Adcom is a poor match for my speakers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted November 14, 2002 Share Posted November 14, 2002 You need to get your feet wet, but I can understand you not wanting to take the over the head plunge with tubes. Though the 4B-ST is great -- a nice high-wattage ultra-linear tube amp will hook you forever. Just sell the Adcom stuff and buy a Jolida integrated. The SET amps I just got are wired to the 4 ohm taps on the transformers, and I just realized yesterday that I only got 9 watts!! I did some Alice in Chains tonight and rearranged the fuzz in my ears. 50 or 60 watts of tube power will blow your mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soundthought Posted November 14, 2002 Share Posted November 14, 2002 Hi gang. I heard somewhere that the GFA555 makes a dandy amp stand. For certain, they can be modified into a sturdy foot stool. Just glue a throw pillow on top and Voila'. You've got Musical Comfort. J/K Actually, Dean had mentioned a couple weeks ago, the fact that the GFA555s are good for sub amps. Just a thought. Good luck and may the farse be with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pettyfeversk Posted November 15, 2002 Author Share Posted November 15, 2002 Thanks to all for the advice. I plan on listening to many more amplifiers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mace Posted November 15, 2002 Share Posted November 15, 2002 You may want to try some McIntosh SS amps as well. It seems most on this BB are happy with them, especially the older one. I've never heard one so I can't speak from personal experience. Mace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted November 15, 2002 Share Posted November 15, 2002 Too much money! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted November 15, 2002 Share Posted November 15, 2002 I dont know of that many who love the McIntosh Solid State on the 2 Channel forum, to be honest. A few, yes. I think they are WAY outclassed by a host of other amplifiers, some mentioned here. kh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mace Posted November 15, 2002 Share Posted November 15, 2002 on McIntosh.... Well, when I did my query a while back McIntosh rated as favorable, anyway. It was just a suggestion... Mobile: Did you ever get ALK's for you Cornwalls?? If so, would I be so lucky to find a review posted somewhere? Mace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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