Ou8thisSN Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 okay, so over spring break, thats coming up next week, I will try your way, no treble, no bass, just tone defeat mode all the way. Lets see if I can kick my withdrawal in a week.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 tweaking the tone controls is never a bad thing...that'd be like telling your recording engineer to never use EQ because the same effect can be accomplished through totally tweaking out the room and picking the right mic and getting everything exact to within .0000000001mm. the tone controls are there to make the music sound better and thus more enjoyable. if you want to hear what the engineer hears, then build a room that mirrors every studio of every label you listen to and listen in its respective room. at the same time though, training your ears is never a bad thing and over-EQing will take away from the music...so instead of just cranking the lows and highs all the way right away, i would suggest that you make a small incremental change (like +1 or +2 dB), listen for a bit and then change it some more until it's just enough to meet your satisfaction. also, don't get caught up in the numbers game or what shape the EQ curve might look like...trust your ears. so if you're like me and like to be at certain numbers more than others, then close your eyes and force yourself to use your ears btw, i have a denon 1803 and wanted to mention that the low boost starts happening just at 80 Hz and affects every frequency below it the same (kinda like a lowpass filter at 80Hz with attenuation). the high frequency starts happening around 8kHz and effects every frequency above it equally (just like a high pass filter with attenuation). I was bored a while ago and decided to test it out. i might be wrong about the 8kHz as my memory isn't too good, but im certain about the 80Hz (which is relevant to this thread) i just wanted to clarify that it's not the 200 Hz and 5kHz mentioned earlier (at least on my reciever anyway). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 Why thank you DrWho. Finally, someone who understands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wheelman Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 Dr who man i used to watch that growing up on pbs. We didnt' have cable so the only thing we got was pbs for free. That was the only show worth watching. Moon that would be awesome to have a real hometheater, but i have mine in my living room. I listen mainly to music. Adjust away but i bet if you got used to no eq with a good amp of course (which you do)you will hear things you probally havent heard before. Bass lines will be more intelligable and the real important mids. I noticed when i first quit using the eq i thought it was a flat sound. But listen to a good recording and I was like wow! That's how it's susposed to sound. Some recording sound better eq'd because their crappy not the music the production. I had awesome results without a sub with my sf-2 without an eq and bass boost. They play real low at high spl's and that made it hard to buy a sub. But i am glad i did the wow factor is much better. Something you can't live without once you have had one. I was always thinking of my old subwoofers when i watched a movie. I wonder how that would of sounded with that sub or that sub. Don't forget a coax though that is important if you have a cheap toslink. They can be real tinny on cd's. But sound awesome on movies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 I do use coax. I have used both, to be honest I was not able to tell the difference. But then I may not have really listened either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 ahhhhhhhh, another fan!!! I like the show so much that I've got all of Tom Baker's episodes on video. Well actually, my dad recorded them when I was little and I watched them growing up...I actually liked the show more than all the cartoons and kids stuff we're hoping to buy the entire dvd set when they come out with every season of the show (i wonder if it's out already, it's been a while since i checked). back to the EQ issue, based on moon's room and all the stuff he's doing in there, i can understand why he cranks the highs and lows...with a very narrow room and lots of speakers, the sound can easily become congested sounding, but with a boost in the highs sounds typically become a lot more clear. all that to say, there is a time to use EQ and a time not to use EQ. IF the music does indeed sound better without it, then of course you don't want to play with it But if it sounds bad, who's to say making it sound better is "wrong"? I will agree that an untrained ear initially tends to make things have a "Hi-Fi" sound by overexagerating the highs and the lows, but that's usually fatiguing and hopefully over time the person begins to realize it. At first, the hi-fi sound always sounds better (at least in my experience), but over time one begins to realize that a less exagerated EQ curve does indeed sound better and more natural and realistic. After a little training of the ear, a person should begin to dislike the hi-fi and can start enjoying the music a lot more. I think that a lot of people that say not to touch the EQs are trying to say to avoid the "hi-fi sound" and perhaps might be a little too agresive in trying to avoid it. I just think there are way too many variables involved to make a blanket statement to never touch the tone controls. for what it's worth, i've been mixing for 11 years and have always used tone controls with my reciever at home and i can attest that proper tweakage of the EQ does indeed allow for a much more realistic sound (and i know this because i was the one doing the recording and got to hear the live stuff). At the same time though, improper tweakage sounds like crap (i'm always over eq'ing my pc speakers and all that...but perhaps that's because they're crappy speakers and i want to make them sound decent) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIbor Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 I use the tone defeat mode for dvds, but for regular tv viewing and and fm radio I have the bass and treble cranked. I guess with a flat setting it should sound as it was intended??? Do most people have to turned flat for all audio listening, dvd, tv, radio, etc?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skonopa Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 ---------------- On 3/10/2004 7:04:49 PM TIbor wrote: Do most people have to turned flat for all audio listening, dvd, tv, radio, etc?? ---------------- I leave mine flat for all sources, including the TV and radio. However, I don't listen to the radio on my system (I don't even have the antenna hooked up to the reciever's tuner). The radio in this area is all bull$#!+ anyway, so I don't even bother. However, I may seriously consider getting an XM Radio tuner for my home system, but with the Music Choice channels I have on my DirecTV service, I don't really need it. But I digress... To be honost for difficult listening environments, I would much rather attempt to solve sound quality issues with speaker placement and room treatment before resorting to the tone controls or an equalizer. It all seems to sound plenty good enough in my room without needing to adjust any of the tone controls, regardless of the source being fed into the system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olorin Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 Nevermind, if I'd read more carefully I wouldn't post stupid things first then catch them later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doudou Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 if you have a klipsch sub you can hook both of the 2 lfe in with a Y addaptator it will make a +6db gain for bass. one some dvd the bass channel is sometimes +10db. so you have bass with dvd and not with music... try a Y addaptator to feed both of the lfe in on the sub. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KAiN5 (banned ) Posted March 11, 2004 Author Share Posted March 11, 2004 I noticed another thing. If I play a CD and walk around the room, in some areas the bass is so much louder and cleaner. Do I have a placement issue? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m00n Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 Kain... I don't think you necessarly have a placement issue. I think it's just one of those things... it is what it is. (wow, what astounding insight with that statement eh? ) My theater is the same way. It's not just low frequencies though. I think you may be able to help it, but I'm not sure you would ever be able to cure it all together. I could be wrong and there might be a cure, I just have not heard of one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ou8thisSN Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 ---------------- On 3/11/2004 2:17:13 AM doudou wrote: if you have a klipsch sub you can hook both of the 2 lfe in with a Y addaptator it will make a +6db gain for bass. one some dvd the bass channel is sometimes +10db. so you have bass with dvd and not with music... try a Y addaptator to feed both of the lfe in on the sub. ---------------- using a y adaptor at the source and turning up the gain on the sub are the same thing. you dont get additional bass by using a y adaptor. OT: well I have 1 presentation in Gender Studies and my spanish homework, afterwhich i'm off to spring break with a few new DVDs, namely LOTR ROTK and Matrx Revolutions. I will try it your way with the tone defeat. We'll see if the Machina Duex Ex (sp?)'s voice sounds as good as it did in the theaters, as it could with/without tone defeat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wheelman Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 I did the Y thing with my sub and it is crazy loud. It was before because Harmans give crazy output to the sub. But now i have to have it below a quarter up. Or it will just drown out my klipch's. Boy before it was hard getting a sub that would keep up. Having it get louder quicker i would think it means your going to have less amplifier distortion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael hurd Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 "if you have a klipsch sub you can hook both of the 2 lfe in with a Y addaptator it will make a +6db gain for bass." " you dont get additional bass by using a y adaptor." There is only one LFE input. It bypasses the crossover in the subwoofer. There are 2 rca connectors - white and red. Using a y connector will double the input voltage signal, as it combines L+R. So you in effect will get more out. This works well with some subs that are lazy to wake up, as some receivers do not put out sufficient voltage, until the volume is up quite high. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEAR Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 "Since I do not have a subwoofer yet, will it be safe to set my mains to Large and crank the bass from 0 dB to +12 dB (that is the max it will go) on my A/V receiver?" Get a grip on reality,you are beyond help if enjoy listening to max out bass gains.Maybe those who wear explosive nail packed belts may like this too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wheelman Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 ---------------- On 3/11/2004 4:06:56 PM michael hurd wrote: "if you have a klipsch sub you can hook both of the 2 lfe in with a Y addaptator it will make a +6db gain for bass." " you dont get additional bass by using a y adaptor." There is only one LFE input. It bypasses the crossover in the subwoofer. There are 2 rca connectors - white and red. Using a y connector will double the input voltage signal, as it combines L+R. So you in effect will get more out. This works well with some subs that are lazy to wake up, as some receivers do not put out sufficient voltage, until the volume is up quite high. ---------------- now wouldn't this leed to a cleaner sub sound with less distortion, because of the less gain needed to acheive the volume you like? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doudou Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 i think so... set your sub at the place you listen to the music and walk arround the room.the place where the best bass is the place where you should place your sub. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doudou Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 oops i ve forgoten a piece of my post : i mean i think it may be a placement issue. and i made a mistake:i was talking of the rca connectors of course. sorry... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ou8thisSN Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 back from Spring Break. On the way down, I turned off the tone controls in my car's reciever, and the sound was incredibly muddy! it sounded awful, the bass was so indiscriminant, it sounded like a mess. after about 2 hours, i couldnt stand it any longer and turn the controls back on. So i figured, maybe a car's environment is different than at home. The acoustics might mandate the controls to be used to compensate for the awkward environment. So at home, I watched a few movies and played some music with the tone defeated. It again just didnt sound as good, same muddiness. In any case, i guess i am in moon's camp. While I dont have the tone controls cranked, i have the bass at like +3 and the treble at like +5. i guess if it doesnt hurt the speakers, i'm definitely leaving them on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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