neo33 Posted April 28, 2004 Author Share Posted April 28, 2004 I hate to keep moving the Doggies around since they are so damn heavy (almost has a dislocated join in my wrist once, LOL). But I could just send them to Erik if he's willing to look at them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted April 28, 2004 Share Posted April 28, 2004 Neo, Are you a man or a women geezz you would tear your arm right off picking up my amps if you think moondogs are heavy ! Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neo33 Posted April 28, 2004 Author Share Posted April 28, 2004 You can't tell the sex by my avatar eh, Craig. . I don't know how heavy the Doggies are but it sure feel like 100lbs each. I think those MagneQuest Trannies alone must have weight at least 75lbs. Heh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tubelover Posted April 28, 2004 Share Posted April 28, 2004 You need more power. That is all. The miniscule powered SET amps don't drive Klipsch speakers well. I thought that was pretty much a given around here? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allan Songer Posted April 28, 2004 Share Posted April 28, 2004 You funny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan C Inman Posted April 28, 2004 Share Posted April 28, 2004 n Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny dB Posted April 29, 2004 Share Posted April 29, 2004 ---------------- On 4/28/2004 9:41:06 PM Ryan C Inman wrote: "If I could afford a well designed SET amplifier, I'd be using one. I may have to build one in the near future. -Ryan" ---------------- Then all you would need is a pair of Khorns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neo33 Posted April 29, 2004 Author Share Posted April 29, 2004 "If it is a short while, it is exectly as max said, a large cap that needs to drain down." OK, Mark, that must be one helluva big cap in there. I switched the AE-1 from "operate" to "standby" and it continued to play on for about 5 minutes. But if I switched it to "off", it stopped playing immediately. What happen to the cap here? As for the speakers hum problem, I rearranged my cables mess behind the rack making sure power cables don't get in the way of ICs (or if they must, they are placed perpendicular to each other) and also played around with the pot adjustment on the Doggies. I was able to reduce the hum a bit but not completely on all of my klipsch heritages. My Polk RT3s are still dead quiet, though. Why? I also tried different types of 2A3 tubes, RCA black-plates, AVVTs and Sovteks. Interestingly enough, the RCAs had the least amount of hum with the best sound quality and the Sovteks had the most amount of hum. Also, the Sovteks shifted the soundstage slightly to the right. Anyone experiencing this? My next speakers will either be the La Scalas or the Khorns. Edit: tubelover, please take your nonsense off my thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted April 29, 2004 Share Posted April 29, 2004 PWK also said "triode with feedback" -- which is certainly not what we find in most triode tube based amps today. The nerve of that guy knocking my beam tubes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxg Posted April 29, 2004 Share Posted April 29, 2004 Neo, I dont know why I keep answering you - I am the least technical person on the board - it must be my years as a consultant to businesses - never let a lack of knowledge get in the way of giving advice! With that in mind if your soundstage is shifting to one side it would appear that your Sovteks are not well matched and one is outputting higher levels than the other, especially as it does not happen with your other tubes. I dont know how you fix that internally on the amp, but you could always adjust the positioning of the speakers to take it into account (toe in as well for that matter). Craig, Just to pick up on a point regarding hum you cant hear from your listening position, but you can from close too. Having just had my amps serviced I am experiencing a leap in clarity of the sound that I do not believe to be purely imagined and a part of this may well be down to the reduced hum. In other words I think that the hum was affecting the sounds I could hear from my listening position and reducing it has made a definite improvement. Usual caveats - I have a vivid imagination - no dbts have been conducted etc. etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai2000 Posted April 29, 2004 Share Posted April 29, 2004 I am with Max on this one: shifting soundstage indicates some tubes which are not well matched (and not only power tubes), but for to balance this Neo doesn't have to move around speakers as the AE-1 has got a volume pot for each channel....quite handy with Khorns . In terms of hum I had a similar problem with my MC30s. I turned out to be a faulty cap. Ever since being repaired they sound mightily impressive. Mind vs matter -yep, but try to get rid of the former... . Wolfram Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted April 29, 2004 Share Posted April 29, 2004 ---------------- On 4/29/2004 4:17:31 AM maxg wrote: Craig, Just to pick up on a point regarding hum you cant hear from your listening position, but you can from close too. Having just had my amps serviced I am experiencing a leap in clarity of the sound that I do not believe to be purely imagined and a part of this may well be down to the reduced hum. In other words I think that the hum was affecting the sounds I could hear from my listening position and reducing it has made a definite improvement. Usual caveats - I have a vivid imagination - no dbts have been conducted etc. etc.---------------- This would be absolutely possible but the hum would have to be substantial and from a source that was detrimental to the sound. For instance in a push pull amp that has true "HUM" it can be poorly matched output tubes which are running wildly different currents together in a channel which creates the dreaded "Notch distortion" by fine tuning the bias and balance of these tubes the sound of a PP amp will improve greatly in the clarity and imaging department. In a well designed push pull amp "True Hum" should not be present at all at least audibly speaking even from right in front of the speaker. My statement above about amps coming back described as hum were hissing and buzzing through the mid and tweeter that are just the facts of life with some vintage tube amps. I guess hum could effect lower powered amps more the higher powered since they have less available power so the amp wasting its resources on producing this hum could distract from the music. But we know your amp is not in the low power category for sure. Wolfram's example is a perfect case that his hum distracted from the actual amps performance not destracted the listener ! Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted April 29, 2004 Share Posted April 29, 2004 Neo, The preamp still playing is par for the course my Mapletree, Scott 130 do the exact same thing preamp don't use high current like a amp so it takes a good bit longer for them to drain the PS caps. The tubes being wildly mismatch amp to amp could easily cause the shift in sound stage. Get your tubes tested ! A Moondog is a terrible thing to waste Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxg Posted April 29, 2004 Share Posted April 29, 2004 "But we know your amp is not in the low power category for sure." Chuckle. Nope - not a low power item. I'll be posting observations on the change from EL34's to 6550's soon. And FWIW, I think you accurately described the source of my hum - so its nice to know I probably wasnt imagining the improvement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted April 29, 2004 Share Posted April 29, 2004 Yup your bias balance was way off it has to be reallyoff to make the amp start audibly humming. This will really result in increased distortion and lack of clarity. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebse2a3 Posted April 29, 2004 Share Posted April 29, 2004 neo33 ask? OK, Mark, that must be one helluva big cap in there. I switched the AE-1 from "operate" to "standby" and it continued to play on for about 5 minutes. But if I switched it to "off", it stopped playing immediately. What happen to the cap here? I believe what is happening here is when you go from "operate" to "standby" the tube's heater is still active letting the tube still produce current(sound) untill the "Plate voltage/Power supply capacitors" drain down. When you switch to off the "heater voltage" is removed and the tube stops producing current(sound) much faster. All this would be normal and it just shows the preamp has a large power supply reserve which is a good quality to have. mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neo33 Posted April 29, 2004 Author Share Posted April 29, 2004 "With that in mind if your soundstage is shifting to one side it would appear that your Sovteks are not well matched and one is outputting higher levels than the other, especially as it does not happen with your other tubes." Max, these Sovteks were supposedly a perfect matched pair. I played them back on one of my much cheaper SET monos and I didn't notice the soundstage shifting problem. The Doggies must be quite sensitive. I did notice, however, one of the Sovtek had a blueish glow around the plate. I know Kelly praised the Sovteks but IMO, I think they are one notch below the RCA black-plates in sound quality. Has anyone try the AVVT on the Doggies? They are quite amazing (such huge tubes), but for some reason, I still prefer the sound of the RCAs. Comments are welcomed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edster00 Posted April 29, 2004 Share Posted April 29, 2004 ---------------- On 4/29/2004 11:15:53 AM neo33 wrote: I know Kelly praised the Sovteks but IMO, I think they are one notch below the RCA black-plates in sound quality. Has anyone try the AVVT on the Doggies? They are quite amazing (such huge tubes), but for some reason, I still prefer the sound of the RCAs. Comments are welcomed. ---------------- neo33, I agree with your assessment of the Sovteks and RCAs. I did try a pair of AVVTs also, but the pair I had were noisy (in my system). I ended up selling my AVVTs to a person with less sensitive speakers than my K-horns, and he loves them. I know others here on the BB really like them also. If you own a pair, stick 'em in those 'doggies and take them for a spin! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Mobley Posted April 29, 2004 Share Posted April 29, 2004 I'm planning to use the Sovtek in my SETs that are under contruction. I 've noticed Kelly's praise of these tubes but have also noticed that he's recommending on a bang for buck basis, not that they're absolutely the best. IIRC, he had some kind of RCA BLackplate for those special occasions when he really wanted the best out of them. But, it's been awhile since I've a post about this from him, so I could be way off. Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edster00 Posted April 29, 2004 Share Posted April 29, 2004 ---------------- On 4/29/2004 12:28:40 PM Tom Mobley wrote: I'm planning to use the Sovtek in my SETs that are under contruction. I 've noticed Kelly's praise of these tubes but have also noticed that he's recommending on a bang for buck basis, not that they're absolutely the best. IIRC, he had some kind of RCA BLackplate for those special occasions when he really wanted the best out of them. But, it's been awhile since I've a post about this from him, so I could be way off. Tom ---------------- You are spot on Tom, that is Kelly's opinion as well as my own after rolling the Sovteks, RCA blackplates, KRs and AVVTs. I know there are others who's opinion I regard highly on this BB that really like the AVVTs and those that really like the KRs as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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