Champagne taste beer budget Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 The other night, I was sitting in the garage, takin a break from sorting through boxes, havin a smoke, havin a drink, listening to my kick butt AM/FM/Clock radio that ROCKS the area at the moment, I think it's GPX unit my wife bought at Wally for $9, and reading through a woodworkers rag. Ran across a 1 yr old ad from BOSE for the 3-2-1 system, figured what the heck, I got time, I got a fresh drink, fresh smoke, great tunes and free time, so I called em on the 800 #. I talked to Melisia/Sherry/Yavonne at first, asked a couple percursuory questions, then hit with the big one.... What's the frequency response of this system? She hemmed and hawed for a minute, said that she couldn't find that in her available information, that the power handling was BLAH BLAH BLAH and that it only took up X amount of space. I grilled her a little, that almost all other speaker manufacturers are proud of the response curves their speaks can generate and are happy to publish them, why doesn't BOSE, or if she had the response information for any of their other systems, 801, 901, Lifestyle, etc, she asked me to hold on while she referanced that information...... Enter Lyle/Robert/Alfonso.... We here at Bose believe that the initial intent of Dr. Bose should be honored, and that intent is to provide the consumer with the best possible listening experience for the money they have spent. Considerable research has gone into every speaker we bring to market, and we believe that the listener should be able to discern what sounds best to them without having to resort to a specification sheet. Dr. Bose has always been interested in frequency response, but has never believed it should be used as a selling point, inasmuch as every listener will hear sounds differently, and we leave that decision up to the listener. If you like the sound that a BOSE system rpesents to you, then we would like you to purchase a BOSE system. If, on the other hand, that sound does not appeal to you, then we welcome you to investigate other speaker manufacturers. Obviously, this is not verbatum, but it is how the conversation went to the best of my reccolection. They could not supply ANY frequency response measurements, even when pressed, stating simply, as far as I can tell, that they aren't proud of them, and would rather Baffle Em With Bull$hit than offer them Brilliance to begin with. I do commend them for their honesty though. Hats off to Klipsch for the specs they are more than willing to publish, the accuracy of said specs, and the balls to admit where they are short, but ask for more competition where they know they excell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klipschfoot Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 Bose makes smoke-and-mirrors systems. i.e., You don't ever ask a magician to explain his tricks. You should just enjoy the show. Though, with Bose systems, the ticket is a little high-priced. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddy Dee Posted November 1, 2004 Share Posted November 1, 2004 CTBB, Thanks for the post. Interesting. I just went out to the Bose site and looked over the 68 page user manual. As you say, no mention of specs in any meaningful way. The little system probably sounds pretty good, I'd think. It would be quite interesting to hear the Bose marketing folk talk about their process. They obviously do business with folks who don't find such info to be important. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griffinator Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 The 3-2-1 system is a piece of sh1t, like a 2-channel Acoustimass setup. Only difference is that they use WDST speakers (still with the crappy paper 3 inch tweeters) instead of the cubes... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edwinr Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 Not everything Bose makes is crap. The Wave radio is still a clever design. But this fact doesn't justify asking exorbitant prices from gullible consumers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artto Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 I have to agree with Bose on the frequency response "response". In virtually all enclosed spaces in domestic environments, it's the ROOM that is influencing what you hear in terms of frequency response more than anything else. What you should have asked them is for information on distortion specifications. Harmonic distortion, intermodulation distortion, frequency modulation distortion and transient intermodulation distortion to name a few. The fact of the matter is even their "flagship" 901 has FMD where the 3rd order harmonic distortion is actually higher than the second harmonic distortion product!!! And this is with only two frequencies being played simultaneously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
analogman Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 Do you not have anything better to do than to keep flogging the stupid-***, worn out BLOZE issue? I think the response you received was a good one, if you don't like BLOZE, buy something else. It is as honest as one can get. I personally do not need to validate my choices by talking S@#T, constantly, about other people's choices. And just for the record, I bet you BLOZE owners are a HELL of a lot happier with their crap, use it MORE, and suffer far less anxiety and insecurity than we HIGH ENDERS do. They also piss away less money on tweaks, cables etc. too, and spend more time listening to MUSIC. It is something to think about, the pleasure of the "LOW-FI" Experience. As always, Analogman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZAKO Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 The frequency response of that BOSE is 100hz to 10k hz. (anechoic) Plus or minus 22db Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
analogman Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 An after thought: People that WANT BLOZE, (or think they do) have to jump through far fewer hoops to cop. It is, after all, a business activity as well. Regards, Analogman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brap Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 Agree with Artto -- you hear the room. On the other hand from what I read -- BOSE don't KNOWS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Champagne taste beer budget Posted November 2, 2004 Author Share Posted November 2, 2004 I, too, agree with artto, the room will likely play as much a part in the way your system sounds as any specs you'll find for anyones' piece of equipment. I do not, however, feel I was necessarly bashing BOSE. At least that was not the intent of the post, sorry if it came off that way to you analogman. If you check my history, I am not one to criticize simply for the sake of it, unless I have an ongoing negative experience with someone or something. I agree that for most of the buying public, BOSE makes good sounding stuff, even if they do play their name as a trump card to inflate prices somewhat. Then again, most of the buying public doesn't have 200, 500 or thousands of posts on an audio forum. In the same vein, for most people, Craftsman makes perfectly acceptable hand tools. I, on the other hand, use my tools hard every day, and have been for 25+ years, hence I step up to Snap-On. Sure they cost more, but the fit, finish, warranty and dealer service is a premium I'm willing to pay for. I have nothing against BOSE, I just thought it odd that one of the most often researched specs is one they don't care to make public. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
analogman Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 Snap-On and Craftsman is a good analogy. I would be willing to bet Craftsman kicks Snap-On's *** with regards to sales in UNITS and DOLLARS, and their service and marketing is superior as well, (more consistent). I agree, over all, Snap-On product is superior, but the service you receive is only as good as the guy on the truck that stops at your shop and his inventory. It did not used to be that way. BUT Snap-On still F$%KS it's dealers and ultimately the mechanics with their ridiculous mark ups and franchise rules, and continues to market as if it were the good old days. Snap-On's tool quality "ain't" what it used to be. They get away with this S$%T because of a loyalty built LONG AGO, much like what I see happening with Klipsch, P.W.K. must be rolling over in his grave. Go to your box and pick up a twenty year old Snap-On wrench, then compare to a similar one you bought in the last year. I think you will get my point. No matter what things used to be, or what they should be, BLOZE, like Craftsman, EARNED THEIR MARKET SHARE AND CUSTOMER LOYALTY, regardless of the fact that there are CERTAINLY higher quality options. Klipsch had the head start on BLOZE, if they have lost it, it is their fault. You can fill a page with the GREATS that lost it because they did not get the game. Klipsch has some of the greatest product going, it is their responsibility to create and maintain awareness. I may be wrong, but the majority of discussions on this forum pertain to the Heritage models, which I have not seen lately at Best Buy or any where for that matter. Same sort of thing is happening with JBL. Maybe we could all learn something from BLOZE. As always, Analogman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-MAN Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 It is a simple marketing fact that name recognition is where its at, not whether the product(s) are any good. BLOSE is certainly a better marketeer than a speaker designer. Why is it that Klipsch is typically compared to BLOSE anyway? There is only KlipschCO to blame for that one. DM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
analogman Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 You said it D-MAN! Analogman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neo33 Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 "Not everything Bose makes is crap. The Wave radio is still a clever design. But this fact doesn't justify asking exorbitant prices from gullible consumers." WAVE stands for We Aint Very Efficient! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
analogman Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 beer budget, If you do not criticise "simply for the sake of it", then why did you need to make a call so that Melisa, Sherry, Yavonne, Lyle, Robert AND Alfonso could ALL, in their own way, tell you once again what I am sure you already knew, AND THEN run back here to tell us about it? Just an exercise to satisfy your intellectual curiosity, perhaps? Wonder how many customers were on hold while you exercised your "need to know"? Your friend, Analogman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Champagne taste beer budget Posted November 2, 2004 Author Share Posted November 2, 2004 I was curious if they actually had specs since I had heard they did not publish them. Sorry I do not remember the actual names of the two people I spoke with last Friday at 9:30 at night. I used the multiple names to infer that, I'm sorry if you did not understand. I doubt that there are only two people working at the BOSE customer service 800 number, though that may be an incorrect assumption. If that is truly the case, I would like to publicly apologize to whoever was placed on hold for the 2 or 2 1/2 minutes that my call took. Peace, Love and Bobby Sherman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-MAN Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 ---------------- On 11/2/2004 5:45:43 PM neo33 wrote: "Not everything Bose makes is crap. The Wave radio is still a clever design. But this fact doesn't justify asking exorbitant prices from gullible consumers." WAVE stands for W e A int V ery E fficient! ---------------- Nah, everything that they make is OVERPRICED for what it is... Now THAT'S marketing! DM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oscarsear Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 Ah yes, business in America. One needs only look at the annual auto ads to discern the intent of marketing, product curves, customer loyalty, etc.... The "BLOZE" man was right. If you like that sound of what "BLOZE" makes then we'll sell it to you time and time again at the highest price the market will bear. When the new system gets tired and sales slow down then we'll crank out a shiny newer box with a snappier name or jingle. Quality speaks for itself but business propogates income. Even Klipsch focuses its primary business endeavors on audio-video speaker systems because that is where most of the current US market is. Big A/V retailers are where you'll find the most prevalent Klipsch product exposure. Audio purists are relegated to esoteric outlets and the enjoyment of the finer refinements in reproduction technologies. "BLOZE" doesn't give a "carp" about what anybody other than what their targeted customer profile thinks. I can guarantee it and will gladly sell you an extended warranty to boot!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
analogman Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 beer budget, I understood exactly what you meant. Your pal, Analogman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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