BillH2121 Posted January 23, 2005 Share Posted January 23, 2005 I just read a thread on the Audiogone site where some posters agreed that SS amps should be left on 24/7. They believed that a SS amp sounds best after it has been on for 8 hours. While I might believe the sound portion of the assertion, wouldn't this result in excessive heat in the unit? Granted there's sufficient air circulation, should I leave my Mac gear on all the time? Thanks for your reponse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUDA Posted January 23, 2005 Share Posted January 23, 2005 My logic could be flaW!! i believe that since there is no load on system then stand by mode is active no real heat,it idle i suppose could be like a door bell only when push is engage that any real load is applied. thus no load no heat. where in a tube amp is utalising power any time it is turned on due to tubes burning liken unto a light beign turned on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artto Posted January 23, 2005 Share Posted January 23, 2005 Contrary to popular belief, transistors do deteriorate over time due to usage, however, very slowly when compared to tubes. Heat is the major enemy of all electronics. How much heat the amplifier produces is the result of any number of things, including what kind of circuit topology it is, its power output capability/size, what kind of load its driving, how good/bad the heat ventilation/dissipation is, etc. Turning electronics on and off frequently is never a good idea as every time you do this it provides a jolt to the circuitry and the circuit takes some time to stabilize (usually no where near the 8 hours mentioned in the above post unless something is drastically wrong) . However it can actually be dangerous to leave consumer (audiophile) grade tube gear on all the time (fire hazard) because the voltage and heat levels are typically much higher than solid state. Many electronic devices today are not actually off when you turn them off. They often remain in a standby mode, or low-powered state until turned on. Older tube equipment, especially in professional audio/music applications, often had a standby switch to keep the tubes warmed up and ready go when needed to prolong tube life. So basically, it depends. If for instance, you have a 400 watt per channel class A transistor amp, you probably wont want to keep it on all the time for power consumption and heat reasons. At the other extreme its not good to turn your component(s) on and off for every little thing all the time either. A Harmon Kardon receiver I bought last year went out on me within a month. It was left on all the time. The second unit did the same thing. The third one (a newer model that they replaced it with), had a changed design and obviously improved ventilation but still ran hot so I provided a little more space above the unit, so far, no problems. My Crown pro audio amps I leave on all the time with no problems, but they are made for continuous full output operation under even the worst conditions. In general I leave my main control center/high-level preamp, tuner and CD player and small 30 watt solid state power amps on all the time. The tube gear I usually turn on about an hour before any serious listening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt1stcav Posted January 23, 2005 Share Posted January 23, 2005 Everyone has their own opinions on the matter. For me it's a matter of economics...if I'm not home or I'm asleep, the computer/audio components are turned off. I'm on a strict budget, and cannot afford the luxury of paying exceedingly high electric bills (especially during the summer months here in Florida when the air conditioning is on almost non-stop), just to keep everything powered up to save on the lifespan of the electrical circuits in my equipment. Plus with all the frequent and horrific thunderstorms we have here in "lightning alley", I'm not going to take the chance on having my components fried due to lightning strikes (even with my line conditioner/surge protector, during a thunderstorm my gear's unplugged from the wall outlet)! Call me paranoid. Just my two cents worth... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yaffstone Posted January 23, 2005 Share Posted January 23, 2005 I've never heard SS get any better with time on. Tubes will since the thermionic emission is a function of plate temperature but not so with transistors. The doping in the silicon will migrate with time and temperature so it's best not to keep transistors hot for no reason. Turn on jolt will damage SS circuits also, so turn it off if you won't be listening for a while. Leave it on between sides of the album. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrMcGoo Posted January 23, 2005 Share Posted January 23, 2005 I have opted for electronics that run cool. I ventilate the warmer running gear. I leave it on for extended periods. My gear never dies of old age; it is replaced due to obsolescence. I attribute the longevity to in depth surge protection and heat dissipation. Bill PS: In the winter, the energy cost of continuous operation is minimal. In summer, I turn the gear off more frequently. B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicholtl Posted January 23, 2005 Share Posted January 23, 2005 I know a lot of SS amps nowadays, such as the Parasound Halo's I run, are designed so that they sound their best the instant they turn on. I forget the name of this technology employed, however. I do think though, that leaving them turned on 24/7 just for the sake of being "at their peak" at moments notice is excessive and a little wasteful of power. Especially during our current energy crisis. But I suppose if you have the money to burn, or you drive a Hummer; then the environment, or your energy bill, most likely isn't the first thing on your mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillH2121 Posted January 23, 2005 Author Share Posted January 23, 2005 While I do have concerns about power consumption costs, etc, my primary concern is the health and well=being of my 30-year old amp and preamp. If leaving the equipment on has no detrimental effect but adds to the quality of sound, then I would gladly leave it on. My experience has been that the equipment seems to heat up if left on for extended periods. Maybe I did not have adequate ventilation at that time though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fish Posted January 23, 2005 Share Posted January 23, 2005 I don't go for the 24/7 at all.I do think ss sounds better after about a 1/2 hour though,at least mine.I just put on something and let it warm up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tkot Posted January 23, 2005 Share Posted January 23, 2005 i have an nad 7150/2150 combo that has been powered up(excludeing power outages)since 1983. on the advise of the salesman in the shop i purchased them from. in the ht room i power everything down during idle times.the system draws a little over 3 amps at idle. i do think it takes just short of an hour for everything to warm up to temp and sounds better at temp. jay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seismic_Pulse Posted January 28, 2005 Share Posted January 28, 2005 ---------------- On 1/23/2005 3:42:40 PM jt1stcav wrote: Everyone has their own opinions on the matter. For me it's a matter of economics...if I'm not home or I'm asleep, the computer/audio components are turned off. I'm on a strict budget, and cannot afford the luxury of paying exceedingly high electric bills (especially during the summer months here in Florida when the air conditioning is on almost non-stop), just to keep everything powered up to save on the lifespan of the electrical circuits in my equipment. Plus with all the frequent and horrific thunderstorms we have here in "lightning alley", I'm not going to take the chance on having my components fried due to lightning strikes (even with my line conditioner/surge protector, during a thunderstorm my gear's unplugged from the wall outlet)! Call me paranoid. Just my two cents worth... ---------------- I am the same as you when it comes to unplugging anything and everything worthwhile in my house before/during a storm. Several years ago my receiver, at the time, met its untimely death due to an oncoming storm. We heard a crack and what looked like a spark across the screen of my TV. Within a second or two smoke started rolling out of my receiver. I learned my lesson the hard way. Luckily nothing else I owned at the time was damaged and I still have the TV. I was lucky to have purchased the receiver from Brandsmart in Florida. The warranty they offered at that time covered electrical surges. I guess you could say I didnt really learn the hard way because I ended up upgrading my receiver. If I leave my house for the majority of the day and I see that T-storms are possible I unplug it all. Whenever I go on vacation I do the same. Even if I am home but going to bed and there is a chance of storms I unplug it all. "Call me paranoid" BTW I had surge suppression gear equipped with a trip switch connected to everything and the switch did not trip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dodger Posted January 28, 2005 Share Posted January 28, 2005 The NAD that I have has standby. I switch it off the standby light comes on. As was stated, heat is the enemy of equipment. Mentioning tubes, put a thermometer by the unit, get an accurate reading when they're off, turn on, wait an hour, check temp, wait another hour and check temp again. Do the same with SS. All you need is warm up time, more is a waste of electricity and life of the unit if it has no direct standby, as say tube amps for musicians. For us older folk, do you realize how terrible the sound was when we were younger? No 24/7 on No "Burn-in" Used cables that came with the unit Used zip cord for speakers Used the antenna that came with tuners Used tone and / or Loudness Played LPs Had no spikes for speaker stands Used $5.00 Telefunken tubes Listened to cassettes 78s, 45s, 8 tracks Had Quad units Used Reel to Reel and too many to name other bad things. It's a wonder that we can even recognize sounds let alone good sound. dodger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-MAN Posted January 28, 2005 Share Posted January 28, 2005 Here's my Socratic question: Do you leave your lights on 24/7? Probably not, and there's your answer. Exactly the same parameters apply to both situations. DM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrMcGoo Posted January 28, 2005 Share Posted January 28, 2005 DM, I respectfully disagree on the light bulb analogy; they are designed to burn out. I have some 130v lamps in my family room that have lasted over 20 years. They are on a rheostat, so no voltage spikes can hit. The 120v lamps burn out very fast in comparison. When do the lights usually go pop? When you turn them ON. Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Garrison Posted January 28, 2005 Share Posted January 28, 2005 I have an older Rotel integrated amp (circa 1985). It sounds better after it warms up. I've turned it off three times (to move) since 1993. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted January 28, 2005 Share Posted January 28, 2005 save your money and keep the stuff off, i will admit that my nad stuff sounds a lot better after i have let it all warm up after a few hours of listening at low volumes and then i will turn it up loud and listen hard, but it doesn't seem to be worht the money... it costs about $5 a month more to leave a computer on at night in sleep mode when its not bbeing used heat will kill your system faster too, keep that in mind as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minn_male42 Posted January 28, 2005 Share Posted January 28, 2005 turn it off when not using it enviromentally much friendlier than leaving it on all the time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillH2121 Posted January 28, 2005 Author Share Posted January 28, 2005 I asked this question on the McIntosh forum on the AudioKarma Board and additionally asked if any representative from Mac had made a recommendation. I have gotten no response re the Mac "official" position. While I understand that there are financial and environmental concerns that militate toward turning the units off and on, the thing that caught my attention was the assertion that they should be left on - it was good for the unit and produces better quality sound. That is also where the lightbulb analogy fails. Can it really be good for an amp to be on all the time or is it merely a matter that it creates no harm - or is it harmful? I don't think there's been a definitive answer given and perhaps there is none. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-MAN Posted January 28, 2005 Share Posted January 28, 2005 ---------------- On 1/28/2005 2:36:15 PM MrMcGoo wrote: DM, I respectfully disagree on the light bulb analogy; they are designed to burn out. I have some 130v lamps in my family room that have lasted over 20 years. They are on a rheostat, so no voltage spikes can hit. The 120v lamps burn out very fast in comparison. When do the lights usually go pop? When you turn them ON. Bill ---------------- Bill, you know I gotta argue on this - The lifetime of electronics is also rated in time "on", even at idle. There is a idle wattage rating which indicates the amount of heat generated and the power consumed at idle. While the philosophy of "always on" is viable in the case of computers for extracting the maximum life out of the hardware (including lightbulbs, to a degree), it is not a particular advantage in general audio electronics. Bear in mind that the ventilation requirements are quite different between the two. It is typically the heat that eventually leads to failure in electronic components combined with time causing physical changes. And most audio gear is not efficently ventilated to prevent heat build up, and it will certainly outlast any computer that you have! My MC300 power amp is rated at 450watts - that's the equivelent of 4-1/2 100 watt lightbulbs. Leave that on all the time - not me! I look at it like an engine, you gotta count the miles. Lower=better. Same with hours on electronics. DM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minn_male42 Posted January 28, 2005 Share Posted January 28, 2005 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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