jvencius Posted January 25, 2005 Share Posted January 25, 2005 Sorry in advance for the very basic nature of these questions (and the rather lengthy nature of this post) so if they've been asked before, just say so and I'll start searching around. As I mentioned a little while ago, I'd like to put together a 2.1 system and while the main speakers are decided (Klipsch RF7's--I auditioned them and nearly bought them on the spot), the amp is completely undecided. Here are some thoughts running through my mind about the amp (in no particular order) and I'd appreciate reactions/inputs about them: 1) I won't buy an amp based only on someone's recommendation, although positive recommendations would help me narrow down the field of possible candidates. Minot, ND (where I'm at now)isn't exactly an audio hotspot, but Winnipeg, MB and Regina, SK aren't far away at all and they're both decent-sized cities and should have better-stocked dealers. 2) Budget is ~$1500-$2500. If I go with an amp at the high end of that price range, I'll probably delay purchasing a sub but the type of music I listen to isn't terribly bass-heavy and that is a compromise I'm willing to make for a short time (until I've got the cash saved for a proper sub). Are there quality separates available at that price range or should I look at integrated amps? 3) I have no brand loyalty at all, so I'm open to any manufacturer's product. A friend whose judgement I trust has recommended the Denon PMA-2000 but without an audition, I'm not breaking out the VISA card just yet. 4) I have no loyalty to SS vs tube amps, so either one is open to consideration. 5) I listen to many many many different types of music. Lately I've been on a punk/oi/hardcore kick, but my CD rack includes a fair bit of opera (learning that my wife's great-grandfather was a singer of some note back in the early 1900's got me listening), a lot of modern Celtic rock, some 70's and 80's metal, quite a lot of bagpipe recordings (both band and solo work), and lately I've been getting into some mild R&B/soul (Joss Stone, Susan Tedeschi, Al Green, et al). Occasionally, when I have one of those "Office Space" days, I'll throw in a John Coltrane CD and pour myself a gigantic tub of Bushmills Black Label and an hour later, all is right with the world. 6) I don't prefer to listen at ear-splitting volumes, so high quality at a lower decibel level is more important than being able to play loud enough to blow out windows from overpressure. 7) I don't have any firm desire for new versus properly serviced/refurbished vintage equipment. If there are any sites where I can go to learn more about two channel amps (I've already found Audiogon), post a link and I'll start the researching. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garymd Posted January 25, 2005 Share Posted January 25, 2005 You may want to look into a vintage, rebuilt scott 299 series amp that has an unpowered center channel. They mate perfectly with a sub for 2.1. Some of the models have a powered center channel but I'm not sure how you'd handle a powered sub with those models. The 299a and b have unpowered centers and I use an RSW12 with amazing success through the center channel of my 299b. I've heard some of the new amps like Jolida will give you the center option also but I've never heard one. Just a thought. Good luck with your search. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxg Posted January 25, 2005 Share Posted January 25, 2005 Are you sure you need a sub? RF7's are hardly bass shy. I think I would go down the route of getting an amp and speakers together and then deciding IF you need a sub at all. As for Tube Vs SS - your ears - your choice - there aint no right and wrong here. Many on this forum do use tubes and love them - but the vast majority of systems out there are SS. Try both and choose. Your budget is certainly adequate to get very decent sound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillH2121 Posted January 25, 2005 Share Posted January 25, 2005 I want to second Max's suggestion. I have had my RF-7s for approximately two months now. They are driven by SS gear - Mac 2125 and C-26. I was aware at the time of my purchase of some comments on this Board that the 7s may need a sub as they are weak on the low end. I honestly do not understand that criticism. Last night I listened to "Rhythm of Love" by Yes (predominant bass line and bass drum/snare drum), some vintage Crosby, Stills, Nash and Young, and Bach Toccata and Fugue in D minor for organ (heavy organ pedal bass line when theme moves to bass). I found the RF-7's to provide an accurate, tight bass response. Its not boomy and it provides musical bass notes, not just the pushing of a lot of air. Give the RF-7s a chance with decent amp and I think you'll be surprised. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jvencius Posted January 25, 2005 Author Share Posted January 25, 2005 I'm not at all convinced that I need a sub. Actually, I'd rather channel the price of a sub into a better amp/cables than buy a sub right off since, like I mentioned, the music I listen to isn't really bass-heavy. One of the demo CD's I took with me when I auditioned the RF7's had some good bass tracks and I thought it sounded fine even without the sub turned on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artto Posted January 26, 2005 Share Posted January 26, 2005 Stick with the Bush Mill Black Label (PWK's favorite, wasn't it?) & I guarantee you it won't make a difference! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dodger Posted January 26, 2005 Share Posted January 26, 2005 Welcome to the Forum. I have been told RF 7s are mainly just moving placement for bass. You don't need to spend all that much on cables. Apature, Vampire wire, bluejean cable are some. I like tube McIntosh, but I also like some of their 2 channel SS. I also like Parasound Halo. Hope this gets a start. dodger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueMonk Posted January 26, 2005 Share Posted January 26, 2005 I am about to move my 7's into a dedicated 2 channel room for music only. After listening to them for a couple years, I have no plans to include a sub. I have a Denon 3802 that is nice in the direct mode, but dream of having a tube Mc. With your budget, you should end up with a very nice system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-MAN Posted January 26, 2005 Share Posted January 26, 2005 My advice is check out McIntosh, either flavor, old or new. You won't make a mistake going there. There are many others worth consideration. My top 3 (relatively in the same price-point) would be: McIntosh Krell Classe I would specifically stay away from the typical SE Asian/Japanese consumer-level gear. Buy US/UK/CAN. It's better in every way. DM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gilbert Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 Excellent questions jvencius. Alot of guys here will give you some sound advice, I just wish I was one of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fini Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 How about a Fisher X-100? I've got one here ready to ship... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jvencius Posted January 27, 2005 Author Share Posted January 27, 2005 ---------------- On 1/27/2005 8:55:22 AM fini wrote: How about a Fisher X-100? I've got one here ready to ship... ---------------- It's an interesting idea, but I'm not ready to start buying equipment just yet (I just made the last tuition payment for EMT-Paramedic school, so I'm out of spending cash for a little while). Sorry... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpm Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 I've heard elsewhere that Mac is having both quality control and customer service problems. Mostly related to the meter lights dimming and going out, and yes, this is a huge deal to Mac lovers. It seems part of the allure is the very cool big blue meters. Make sure you're near an authorized Mac service center. I almost bought a MA6500, but after extensive research and a few emails, I'm holding off. I've lost the warm, fuzzy Mac feeling. At least on their NEW gear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxg Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 ---------------- On 1/27/2005 10:14:24 AM jpm wrote: I've heard elsewhere that Mac is having both quality control and customer service problems. Mostly related to the meter lights dimming and going out, and yes, this is a huge deal to Mac lovers. It seems part of the allure is the very cool big blue meters. Make sure you're near an authorized Mac service center. I almost bought a MA6500, but after extensive research and a few emails, I'm holding off. I've lost the warm, fuzzy Mac feeling. At least on their NEW gear. ---------------- Damn right it is a big deal - a Mac without a blue light is a hamburger! A friend of mine has an SS Mac with 250 wpc I think - mesmerizing to watch and quite pleasant to listen to as well - despite his rather odd Montana speakers. My old Accuphase had meters to - but they werent blue lit so they had to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpm Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 Max, hehehe, I'm not willing to throw down 1/3 the price of a new MA6500 for the blue meters and the name. I truly believe it's similar to paying way too much for the NAME on items like Porsche, BMW, Lexus, Mercedes, et al... Granted, these items and big dollar amps are nice, and probably better quality parts in them than your household Asian amp, but I know damn well you're paying a ton of money for the name and country of origin... I'll bet at least a third. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxg Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 ---------------- On 1/27/2005 10:51:07 AM jpm wrote: Max, hehehe, I'm not willing to throw down 1/3 the price of a new MA6500 for the blue meters and the name. I truly believe it's similar to paying way too much for the NAME on items like Porsche, BMW, Lexus, Mercedes, et al... Granted, these items and big dollar amps are nice, and probably better quality parts in them than your household Asian amp, but I know damn well you're paying a ton of money for the name and country of origin... I'll bet at least a third. ---------------- Certainly you pay for a reputation and therefore a name, but take a moment to ponder how these goods got their name. The Mac in question is 25 years old, has never been serviced and has played, as far as I know, every day of its life. Similar to Porsche, Merc, BMW et al - you are paying for engineering as much as for the name. Names are made on the back of quality. this relates equally to country of origin. Why is it that an item made in Germany, England or the US can charge a higher price than one made in China? Right now there is a quality gap. This gap is certainly closing - but watch out because the prices are too. I just ordered a TT from Clearaudio. I paid a high price for it. I expect it to be built and engineered to the highest standards and to last a lifetime (or 2). Looked at like that - it probably isnt really that expensive. My current project was far cheaper (assembled in Eastern Europe) but probably wont see out another couple of years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxg Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 Sorry to be hi-jacking again but here is a link to an interesting Turntable review on a TT from China. http://www.tnt-audio.com/sorgenti/opera_lp5_e.html The interesting thing - other than its gorgeous looks and obvious quality is its price - 4,800 Euros (about $6,200)! Quality aint cheap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpm Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 Take a gander at the prices in this rag. www.musicdirect.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillH2121 Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 My Mac amp and preamp is approximately 30 years old. In that 30 years I have spent a grand total of $175 for service and to replace a couple of worn out caps. That's what is associated with a name. The equipment brings me the same pleasure now that it did when, as a young 21-year old, I saw those blue meters dancing in the dim light of my first apartment and listened in wonder to Mahavisnu Orchestra, Coltrane, Miles, Hendrix, et al. Further, I can probably sell that amp and preamp for close to what I paid for it. Is Mac the best equipment out there? - probably not - but it has some of the most loyal customers and you've got to admit there must be a reason (hint - it ain't just the blue lights). Yes, I'm biased and don't mind admitting it - its a combination of nostalgia and an appreciation of style/form/function. BTW - I also own a Mercedes and lust for all things Porche 911 and anything that looks like Charlize Theron. There's most likely a connection here - I'll contact a therapist and inquire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gilbert Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 As much as I do condone threadjacking, you guys need to get back on track and help this guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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