Jump to content

Side surrounds


Kain

Recommended Posts

Now that many people have told me that your surround speakers SHOULD be placed on the side walls facing each other, I have another question:

When surround effects come in, won't it sound a bit weird that the rear sounds are coming from the sides? And what about the people sitting in FRONT of the side surrounds, will it sound okay for them?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Kain,

with speakers that are made for being on the side, it will not sound weird. It will sound great. You and your listeners will be enveloped with the sound.

By "speakers that are made for being on the side," I mean DIPOLE.

By having two opposed driver planes, with the opposed drivers working out of phase (as one driver goes out the other goes in), sound is radiated back towards the back wall, front towards the front wall, and off the ceiling, creating a diffuse, enveloping ambience.

This is how theater houses are built (although their speakers are monopole - direct radiators, you'll notice they've got 6-10 of them on either side of the room), and the sound is very natural, like you're really THERE (wherever the movie is).

I particularly like the design of my Polk RT f/x's.

They are trapezoidal, with the drivers angled slightly up towards the ceiling to create even more of a radiating effect. They also have a switch to switch them between dipole or bipole, depending on where they're mounted and what sounds better...

I found 2 very informative sites:

The first one, Audiovideo101 - Definition of dipolar , is a straight-forward definition of this kind of speaker.

The second, Surround Speaker Configuration Wars , is an excellent in-depth explanation of surround sound and how different speakers, whether dipole or monopole, handle it.

Hope this helps.

------------------

Front: dbx Soundfield V -5-way w/15" woofers

Center: KLF C7

Rear Surround: Polk RT f/x bipole/dipole

Amp: Yamaha RX-V990 100x3; 25x2

DVD: Yamaha DVD S795 (built-in DD Processor)

CD: Yamaha CDC 575 5-Disc

VCR: Toshiba M752 6-head

TV: Mitsubishi 40" Tube

DirecTV

Sony Playstation connected to V990 for awesome gaming picture & sound!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As with most things audio, there are a variety of opinions on which type of speaker sounds best as a surround. My RS-3's, with its combination of direct and indirect radiation, mounted just to the rear and to the side of the listening position, do the best job of any speaker I have tried thus far, im my room.

Also, even in a home theater environment, your system will be set up to sound best in a "sweet spot" of the listening area. This spot is generally larger than that for stereo only listening, but exists none the less. Therfore, no matter what type of speaker you use, or where you place them, people not in the "sweet spot" will not get the best your set up has to offer.

I hope this helps.

------------------

L/C/R: Klipsch Heresy II

Surround: Klipsch RS-3

Subwoofers: 2 HSU-VTF-2

Pre/Pro/Tuner: McIntosh MX-132

AMP: McIntosh MC-7205

DVD: McIntosh MVP-831

CD Transport: Pioneer PD-F908 100 Disc Changer

Turntable: Denon DP-72L

Cassette: Nakamichi BX-1

T.V. : Mitsubishi 55905

SAT/HDTV: RCA DTC-100

Surge Protector: Monster Power HTS-5000

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Okay, thanks guys. But if surround speakers are meant to be on the side walls facing each other, then why do some people have them on the rear walls facing towards the main speakers? I guess it is just preference?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

"Okay, thanks guys. But if surround speakers are meant to be on the side walls facing each other, then why

do some people have them on the rear walls facing towards the main speakers? I guess it is just preference?"

I think it's more a matter of ignorance, and little choice with room considerations. After all, the "high-end" audio store here in town has their RS-3s on the back wall, too. They don't even know better. therefore, their customers will likely follow suit.

T-man

------------------

KG 5.5 (mains)

KG 2.2v (center)

KG 1 (rears)

KSW-12 (sub)

Denon AVR 681/1601

Toshiba SD-3109 DVD

Kenwood LVD700 LD

Sony CD changer

Sony 27" Trinitron

Sony PLX I

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think the 'professional' recommendation is:

5-7 feet from floor to bottom of speaker, slightly behind listening position.

As far as the "back wall" goes, if you notice on that "surround speaker config wars" page, the only sounds that are specifically recorded to come from the back wall are the THX EX ones (and DD 6.1?) which require a source recorded in that format.

Regular 5.1 surround is meant to come from the side, as in a regular theater house.

------------------

Front: dbx Soundfield V -5-way w/15" woofers

Center: KLF C7

Rear Surround: Polk RT f/x bipole/dipole

Amp: Yamaha RX-V990 100x3; 25x2

DVD: Yamaha DVD S795 (built-in DD Processor)

CD: Yamaha CDC 575 5-Disc

VCR: Toshiba M752 6-head

TV: Mitsubishi 40" Tube

DirecTV

Sony Playstation connected to V990 for awesome gaming picture & sound!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

One of the principle advantages of Klipsch's unique Wide-Dispersion Surround Technology is greater placement flexibility.Due to the full 180 degree coverage pattern,you can place speakers on the rear wall,side walls or even the ceiling.The most common placement is on the side walls,adjacent to or behind the listening/viewing area,or on the rear wall facing the front of the room.

Taken from Klipsch WDST speaker owners manual.Now we are all wiser.

Keith

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think part of the problem is vocabulary and misplaced goals left over from the "Quad" era. At that time the goal seemed to be sound from all around, and specifically from the four corners.

This never really worked out for several reasons. One was that the encoding systems of the day were primitive. But also, our experience of sound seems to be based more of front and "ambient" rather than front and back.

Listen to real sound in most locatations, we hear what is before us with accurate placement. Most of the rest like hall ambiance, crowds, rain, birds, are usually not detected from being specifically behind. Rather, not specifically placed at all. Hence ambiant.

Of course there are exceptions. However, rear speaker placement can lead to the perception that ambient sounds are behind, rather than everywhere.

The ITU and most HT sites recommend surround speaker at 90 degrees, plus or minus 10 degrees.

Of course the placement of the listening position can lead to ambiguities of what is being suggested. We're often on a sofa located against the wall opposite the mains. Therefore the surrounds are at the back corner of the room, AND also 100 degrees off axis. But this is not to say they are where they are because they're "rear".

As implied the good Phil H., sometimes you're forced to place the surrounds on the back wall just because of the room. It can work well. However, I think the lesson is not that surrounds should be 90 degrees plus 45 degrees = 135 degrees from staight ahead. Just that the wide dispursion allows flexibility in placement.

Nothing about surround speaker placement is written in stone. Experimentation is necessary for your situation.

Regards,

Gil

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Gil is exactly right.Sometimes a person has no choice as far as side placement goes and must place the surrounds to the rear.The coverage pattern of the WDST surrounds will compensate for rear placement,somewhat.

When placed on rear walls the speakers should not be placed near corners.

Keith

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Speaker placement is an experimental process since the characteristics of speakers and the acoustical properties vary over such a wide range. Its good to start with the manufacturers recommendations along with material like that provided in the above links. Gil is right; rear placement was a quad requirement. I would add to that that many DSP modes work best with rear placement, High side placement is really a movie thing and if you have 6,1 you need the back walls for the rear channel. I have the LaScalas stacked with the top one slightly to the rear of my listening position and angled forward. The bottom Scalas fire backwards and bounce off the rear wall. I had to experiment a lot before I came up with this arrangement. While my Heritage system is best for musicals and concert DVDs, the THX is really better for all other DVDs. . I have my Klipsch Heritage system set up so I can use either the side LaScalas or the rear firing ones in any of my DSP modes More and more, however, for most music I am just using the Klipschorns in stereo. They create their own magic!

HT-1 Klipsch Heritage (music oriented)

Klipschorns w/ ALK crossover upgrades

4 Klipsch LaScalas (surround & rears)

Heresy components in custom cabinet /monitor stand (center)

Panasonic 32 Monitor W/ component video input

3 Sony CX400 CD changers

Sony CX-200 CD Changer

MSB Technology Digital Director w/ jitter reduction

Nirvis DXS digital controller (auto selection of whatever changer is playing)

Nirvis Slink-e computer interface (downloads cd info, programs & controls changers).

Nirvis CDJ (CD Jukebox Software)

Monster 5000 Power Center (serves HT-2 also)

Sony Viao Laptop Computer

Sony S530D DVD Player

Sony 798HF VCR

Sony XA1ES CD player

Sherwood HX-PRO dual cassette deck

Dynaco PAS4 stereo preamp W/ Tesla Tube upgrades (also outputs to HT2)

Technics SL3300 DD Turntable w/ Shure cartridges

Outlaw 1050 6.1 A/V Receiver

Perpetual Technologies P1A Digital Correction Engine (jitter reduction, 16 to 24 bit conversion, future speaker frequency correction, and room acoustic correction )

Perpetual Technologies P3A DAC ( plus 44.1k to 96k CD upsampling)

Klipsch KSW-15 sub (for DVD LFEs )

Klipsch LF-10 sub

Phillips Pronto TS2000 Programmable Remote

Scientific American Explorer 2000 Home Communications Terminal

X10 computerized lighting controls

Radio Shack Wireless Remote Control Extender

HT#2 Klipsch THX (movie oriented)

4 Klipsch KT-LCR THX Speakers

4 Klipsch RS-3s (side & rear surround)

2 Klipsch KT-DS THX Surrounds

10 Linaem Tweeters

Outlaw 1050 6.1 A/V Receiver/Preamp

Sony X111 ES CD Player

Sony 775HF VCR

Sony STR-G3 (supplemental amplification for extra speakers)

Toshiba 61 High Definition TV

Sony NS700 Progressive Scan DVD

Toshiba 4205 DVD/ CD Changer

Klipsch SW-12II Sub

Klipsch LF-10 sub

Sony AV2100 remote

Scientific American Explorer 2000 Home Communications Terminal

X10 Computerized Lighting

Vibrapods (vibration isolation)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...