NOSValves Posted March 16, 2006 Share Posted March 16, 2006 Craig...will those amps of yours produce 100 watts rms? Nope but what does that have to do with anything. The speaker is rated to play cleanly to 121dB at 1 meter (when new) although it will surely play above that but at much higher distortion levels. It doesn't take a 100 watts to hit 121dB at one meter. To me if you push the speakers even to there 121db rating it sounds like sh!t. I guess some people have a higher tolerability for having there forehead ripped off then I do. I don't care what amps are used. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Matthews Posted March 16, 2006 Author Share Posted March 16, 2006 Hey, Mike and 6-Foot, do any of you have, or can you get, Santana's song, "Transcendance," off of his Moonflower CD? This is such a sweet song, with a hellacious jam in it, too. I think it would be a great tune to compare overall musical quality. I'd like to hear what you both think after comparing this song through your systems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6foot8 Posted March 16, 2006 Share Posted March 16, 2006 Craig, I must be missing something here. I thought it would take approximatley 64 watts continuous to achieve 122 dBs given that the speakers could still be 104 dB @ 1m\2.83 volt efficient. I must be misinformed, I had no idea those amps would put out that kind of power! I may have to unrack that big BGW after all...[6] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6foot8 Posted March 16, 2006 Share Posted March 16, 2006 Hey, Mike and 6-Foot, do any of you have, or can you get, Santana's song, "Transcendance," off of his Moonflower CD? This is such a sweet song, with a hellacious jam in it, too. I think it would be a great tune to compare overall musical quality. I'd like to hear what you both think after comparing this song through your systems. Jeff...I don't have it but if MIke does we can certainly give it a spin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted March 16, 2006 Share Posted March 16, 2006 Craig, I must be missing something here. I thought it would take approximatley 64 watts continuous to achieve 122 dBs given that the speakers could still be 104 dB @ 1m\2.83 volt efficient. I must be misinformed, I had no idea those amps would put out that kind of power! I may have to unrack that big BGW after all...[6] Yup your figures are correct. But with music you will never have continous 121db levels. I would venture to say if your hitting a continous of about 110db a one meter with most music your staying within the clean output of the speakers on peaks. Just out of curiousity have you had your hearing checked lately? Not to be meant as a slam mind you but I have to wonder about someone you states they have listened at 120db continous that is freakin loud!! Like way beyond concert levels. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6foot8 Posted March 16, 2006 Share Posted March 16, 2006 Craig, I must be missing something here. I thought it would take approximatley 64 watts continuous to achieve 122 dBs given that the speakers could still be 104 dB @ 1m\2.83 volt efficient. I must be misinformed, I had no idea those amps would put out that kind of power! I may have to unrack that big BGW after all...[6] Yup your figures are correct. But with music you will never have continous 121db levels. I would venture to say if your hitting a continous of about 110db a one meter with most music your staying within the clean output of the speakers on peaks. Just out of curiousity have you had your hearing checked lately? Not to be meant as a slam mind you but I have to wonder about someone you states they have listened at 120db continous that is freakin loud!! Like way beyond concert levels. Craig Craig, thanks for clearing that up for me. Yes my hearing is exceptionally good. However, I rarley listen at those levels. I usually am only experiencing peaks in the 105 range at my listening distance. I only like the ability to generate those levels should I desire (mostly when I'm showing off) but I seldom ever do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted March 16, 2006 Share Posted March 16, 2006 Craig, thanks for clearing that up for me. Yes my hearing is exceptionally good. However, I rarley listen at those levels. I usually am only experiencing peaks in the 105 range at my listening distance. I only like the ability to generate those levels should I desire (mostly when I'm showing off) but I seldom ever do. And what happens when you push it up over that level? Or are we talking with the Jubes? Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6foot8 Posted March 16, 2006 Share Posted March 16, 2006 Craig, thanks for clearing that up for me. Yes my hearing is exceptionally good. However, I rarley listen at those levels. I usually am only experiencing peaks in the 105 range at my listening distance. I only like the ability to generate those levels should I desire (mostly when I'm showing off) but I seldom ever do. And what happens when you push it up over that level? Or are we talking with the Jubes? Craig The Jubes sound fine when pushed up to 120 dBs at the driver...never had them higher than that. The La Scalas do not sound very good at those levels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted March 16, 2006 Share Posted March 16, 2006 Craig, thanks for clearing that up for me. Yes my hearing is exceptionally good. However, I rarley listen at those levels. I usually am only experiencing peaks in the 105 range at my listening distance. I only like the ability to generate those levels should I desire (mostly when I'm showing off) but I seldom ever do. And what happens when you push it up over that level? Or are we talking with the Jubes? Craig The Jubes sound fine when pushed up to 120 dBs at the driver...never had them higher than that. The La Scalas do not sound very good at those levels. Okay were on the same page. Now I want to know what my amps sound like pushing them Jubes! Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edwinr Posted March 16, 2006 Share Posted March 16, 2006 The La Scalas can go VERY loud, but I guess like any loudspeaker, when driven close to it's rated output, everything must be working overtime = big doses of distortion and lots of heat being generated. I wonder how long the La Scala could maintain around 120 plus db output. It wouldn't be for too long. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6foot8 Posted March 17, 2006 Share Posted March 17, 2006 The La Scalas can go VERY loud, but I guess like any loudspeaker, when driven close to it's rated output, everything must be working overtime = big doses of distortion and lots of heat being generated. I wonder how long the La Scala could maintain around 120 plus db output. It wouldn't be for to too long. He Edwin, I would run the La Scalas right up to their rated power on occaision but never over. I have never damaged a speaker with the exception of an Altec 811 driver 20 plus years ago. I probably don't push the Jubes much harder than the La Scalas to be honest, because yes they do get loud enough most of the time for me. This project was really about enhancing the quality of the sound at any level. I wanted to "hear" the musicians in my room. I guess I have accomplished what I set out to do. IMO they sound better, but the degree to which is certainly a personal judgement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted March 17, 2006 Share Posted March 17, 2006 The La Scalas can go VERY loud, but I guess like any loudspeaker, when driven close to it's rated output, everything must be working overtime = big doses of distortion and lots of heat being generated. I wonder how long the La Scala could maintain around 120 plus db output. It wouldn't be for too long. I personally would guess ones ears would be hurt more then the Lascala's! 120db constant paying music is fricken crazy! Add what 10db for transient peaks holy moly that is insane! Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockbobmel Posted March 17, 2006 Share Posted March 17, 2006 I just want to share my non technical experience. I have been playing bass through both SS and tube amps for a while. I started out with a pre and Crown power amp. It sounded real good with lots of headroom. I started drooling for a tube amp so I traded it in for an SVT II rack 300 watt tube. That head sounded good but would get real mushy on the B string, so I traded it for an SS Ampeg. Sounded good, but problems- had to trade for an Eden SS. Liked it, BUT, It had a quality that I can only describe as (It's loud but you cant hear it well on stage with the band- no cut) Plus it had an upper mid treble that I could not eq out. SO, I sold it and got a vintage SVT 300 watt 90 lb. monster. Sounded great, LOUD!, a little mush in the low end, but troubles .Sold it for a Mesa boogie 300 watt (12 6L6GCs) rack amp. Now this was the ticket. It still is a little weak in the B string though. (distorts and lost headroom). I recently bought an all SS Gallien-Krueger head used for cheap that is 1000 watts bridged into 4 ohms and it has headroom galore and sounds real clean but fat. I'll try it out this Sat. with a band setting. My guitar player uses a DSP preamp and a SS power amp, and a lot of times I can't tell what notes he is playing on stage, My other guitar player plays a 100w Marshall, and that thing can peel paint! and it sounds great. To make a tube amp work you need super efficient speakers to keep the db up. a 300 watt SVT is 90lbs. That's about as big as they can practically make them. They have used transmitting tubes to get bigger headroom, but the trannys are HUGE and weigh a lot. So my summary is SS (Big watts) for the low end and TUBE for upper mids ant highs for the sweetness and clarity (cut). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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