Heritage

[seti]

Yes and I have talked to Trey about those with no luck. The guy first offered them for about 2K new, then stopped talking.

Bummer deal. At the last Hope pilgrimage we saw the last four Belles on the factory floor.

[heiney]

I purchased the pair of "Belles" that appear in the Shinall website 2 years ago. Total cost delivered to Kauai, Hawaii was about $3600. I have them stacked atop a pair of VMPS larger subs. I am currently driving them with an NAD 218THX amp - the subs are on a pair of Adcom 555's in mono through an Ashley crossover. All driven by a Morrison preamp. The sound is nothing less than is the most lifelike I've heard outside of being there. I purchsed my first pair of LaScalas in the mid 70's, then moved on to Belles. My brother has Khorns so my frame of reference is wide. Gary Shinall is a class guy who produces a product of high value on a well established design. They sound as good as they look. I have previously posted pictures.

[Coytee]

Soooooooooooooooo Heiney... I think the only way we can actually verify the sound is a big audition session at your house.

When would you like half the population of Klipsch website to show up?!!

[ip]

[jwc]

Hey Guys. I was looking into the history of discussion of Shinall on this forum.

This fellow is brought up time and time again. I would recommend you read the thread from 2004 when his website was discovered by Klipsch fans.

04-20-2004

http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/1/367566/ShowThread.aspx

Quote from:
HDBRbuilder

I talked to Mr. Shinall on the phone this afternoon. Here is the scoop from our short conversation.

He sounds like a really nice guy. He is about 60 years old. He lost his long-time job to corporate pull-out to overseas not that long ago. Even when he was working, he built speakers as a sideline thing and has been doing it for over 30 years.

In the 1960's he made a few trips to visit with PWK. He told PWK that he intended to build himself a pair of K-horn copies, because he couldn't afford to buy factory made ones and he thought they were the best speakers made. He bought the drivers and such from PWK for his original copies. Later on in the 1960's, he contacted PWK again and told him he wanted another set of drivers and horns, because he was gonna build a copy of the LaScala for a center channel between his home-built K-horns...BUT he was gonna change the design of the LaScala somewhat so that the cabinet matched up aesthetically with his K-horn copies. PWK sold him the drivers and asked him to send some pictures of what he built. He sent the pictures to PWK, and was very surprised to see the Belle Klipsch come out a year or so later looking very much like the center-channel speaker he had built. He told me that he took great pride in the fact that PWK might have used his re-work of the LaScala cabinet design to base the aesthetics of the Belle Klipsch speaker upon. He did NOT claim to have invented the Belle Klipsch speaker, he just stated that it looked very much like his LaScala re-work design, and he was proud that PWK liked its basic appearance so much that he "adopted" it for the Belle Klipsch.

He has a 3000 square foot shop with a little showroom built into it. He just builds the speakers and puts them into the showroom so that people can listen to them, and if they want them, he will sell them. He said he has been doing this for many years as a sideline and hobby. Most of what he sold over the years was made for people who had heard his speakers and wanted a pair for themselves...basically a "word-of-mouth" advertising thing. I asked him if he intended to expand into a full-blown operation, he said no. He said that he is too old to do anything like that...and he intends to keep things as they are.

His midrange horns are welded up out of sheet aluminum by himself, with welded-on brackets for the drivers to mount to. His XT200 model is built in the same basic aesthetics as the K-horn is (but is NOT triangular in its rear for corner use), with a top-housing containing the tweeter/s and midrange horn, and the lower portion of the cabinet is basically the equivalent of two stacked separate heresy-type sealed cabinets with one 12" short-throw woofer in each one...IOW a large cabinet, with a horizontal divider in it creating the equivalent of two Heresy cabinets in interior volume....sort of a super Heresy. He said the mid-horn is a 600Hz one for that speaker, whereas the midhorn for his K-horn copy is a 400Hz horn. He uses no MDF in his builds, only quality 3/4" plywood. For his smaller speaker, he builds them with butt joints out of a luan-veneered plywood, then veneers over the cabinet's plywood with paper-backed veneer, because it is easier for him than trying to get chip-free miter-cuts using the thin veneers found on TODAY's black walnut-veneered plywood. He prefers the Luan for a good substrate to apply that veneer to because it "grips" the adhesive so well.

He told me that he recently put up a website because somebody had suggested he do so. His website got the attention of Audiogon folks, who in turn got its attention on this forum. He is aware of this thread, and has read it. He sounded hurt about it...and doesn't really understand why he is getting "bashed" so much on this forum. He feels that he is just trying to make a long-time hobby of his pay for itself and show a bit of profit...especially important now that his job left these shores.

I asked him if he had any help or expected to need to hire anybody for his little business. He said that he didn't want to deal with employees and all that, and it would remain a one-man operation as a sideline. He lamented that on occasion he gets a handful of special-orders, but trying to get them out in the high quality build he is proud of causes him to stay up late at night in order to meet the delivery time he gives the customer. He keeps his operation's sales primarily within a small radius of the shop because he normally delivers them himself or the buyer comes to pick them up.

I suggested that in his website he give full credit to PWK for his cornerhorn model design. I think he intends to do so. He said he has had lots of emails ever since this thread began and he can't get anything done AND properly answer all the emails he has at the same time, but he will do his best. He said he answered 25 emails last night alone!

This is what went on in the conversation with him. I will NOT comment on any ethics involved or anything else. Everybody has their own set of ethics and everybody has their own sense of right or wrong. It is not up to me to make those parameters for anybody else. He has a great respect for PWK and his speaker designs...that much was obvious to me...and for ME, that is enough! Anybody else on this forum trying to turn a hobby into something that can support itself and maybe make a bit of profit on the side? Just a thought.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I personally wouldn't have a problem buying from this guy.

jc

[seti]

Hey Guys.  I was looking into the history of discussion of Shinall on this forum.

This fellow is brought up time and time again.  I would recommend you read the thread from 2004 when his website was discovered by Klipsch fans.

04-20-2004

http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/1/367566/ShowThread.aspx

Quote from:

HDBRbuilder

 

I talked to Mr. Shinall on the phone this afternoon. Here is the scoop from our short conversation.

He sounds like a really nice guy. He is about 60 years old. He lost his long-time job to corporate pull-out to overseas not that long ago. Even when he was working, he built speakers as a sideline thing and has been doing it for over 30 years.

In the 1960's he made a few trips to visit with PWK. He told PWK that he intended to build himself a pair of K-horn copies, because he couldn't afford to buy factory made ones and he thought they were the best speakers made. He bought the drivers and such from PWK for his original copies. Later on in the 1960's, he contacted PWK again and told him he wanted another set of drivers and horns, because he was gonna build a copy of the LaScala for a center channel between his home-built K-horns...BUT he was gonna change the design of the LaScala somewhat so that the cabinet matched up aesthetically with his K-horn copies. PWK sold him the drivers and asked him to send some pictures of what he built. He sent the pictures to PWK, and was very surprised to see the Belle Klipsch come out a year or so later looking very much like the center-channel speaker he had built. He told me that he took great pride in the fact that PWK might have used his re-work of the LaScala cabinet design to base the aesthetics of the Belle Klipsch speaker upon. He did NOT claim to have invented the Belle Klipsch speaker, he just stated that it looked very much like his LaScala re-work design, and he was proud that PWK liked its basic appearance so much that he "adopted" it for the Belle Klipsch.

He has a 3000 square foot shop with a little showroom built into it. He just builds the speakers and puts them into the showroom so that people can listen to them, and if they want them, he will sell them. He said he has been doing this for many years as a sideline and hobby. Most of what he sold over the years was made for people who had heard his speakers and wanted a pair for themselves...basically a "word-of-mouth" advertising thing. I asked him if he intended to expand into a full-blown operation, he said no. He said that he is too old to do anything like that...and he intends to keep things as they are.

His midrange horns are welded up out of sheet aluminum by himself, with welded-on brackets for the drivers to mount to. His XT200 model is built in the same basic aesthetics as the K-horn is (but is NOT triangular in its rear for corner use), with a top-housing containing the tweeter/s and midrange horn, and the lower portion of the cabinet is basically the equivalent of two stacked separate heresy-type sealed cabinets with one 12" short-throw woofer in each one...IOW a large cabinet, with a horizontal divider in it creating the equivalent of two Heresy cabinets in interior volume....sort of a super Heresy. He said the mid-horn is a 600Hz one for that speaker, whereas the midhorn for his K-horn copy is a 400Hz horn. He uses no MDF in his builds, only quality 3/4" plywood. For his smaller speaker, he builds them with butt joints out of a luan-veneered plywood, then veneers over the cabinet's plywood with paper-backed veneer, because it is easier for him than trying to get chip-free miter-cuts using the thin veneers found on TODAY's black walnut-veneered plywood. He prefers the Luan for a good substrate to apply that veneer to because it "grips" the adhesive so well.

He told me that he recently put up a website because somebody had suggested he do so. His website got the attention of Audiogon folks, who in turn got its attention on this forum. He is aware of this thread, and has read it. He sounded hurt about it...and doesn't really understand why he is getting "bashed" so much on this forum. He feels that he is just trying to make a long-time hobby of his pay for itself and show a bit of profit...especially important now that his job left these shores.

I asked him if he had any help or expected to need to hire anybody for his little business. He said that he didn't want to deal with employees and all that, and it would remain a one-man operation as a sideline. He lamented that on occasion he gets a handful of special-orders, but trying to get them out in the high quality build he is proud of causes him to stay up late at night in order to meet the delivery time he gives the customer. He keeps his operation's sales primarily within a small radius of the shop because he normally delivers them himself or the buyer comes to pick them up.

I suggested that in his website he give full credit to PWK for his cornerhorn model design. I think he intends to do so. He said he has had lots of emails ever since this thread began and he can't get anything done AND properly answer all the emails he has at the same time, but he will do his best. He said he answered 25 emails last night alone!

This is what went on in the conversation with him. I will NOT comment on any ethics involved or anything else. Everybody has their own set of ethics and everybody has their own sense of right or wrong. It is not up to me to make those parameters for anybody else. He has a great respect for PWK and his speaker designs...that much was obvious to me...and for ME, that is enough! Anybody else on this forum trying to turn a hobby into something that can support itself and maybe make a bit of profit on the side? Just a thought.

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 

I personally wouldn't have a problem buying from this guy.

jc

 

Thanks for posting JC very interesting info!

If he was manufacturing speakers that were discontinued and no longer produced that would be a different story. DIY reverse engineering or buiIding as a hobby is different than starting your own knockoff company. I have seen a few sites where they reproduce Hartsfields or old western electric horns. This is a great service as they are keeping older horn technology alive. It is just my opinion but I'd still rather buy used klipsch. Apparently this has all been discussed to death I'm just catching up : )

http://www.classicaudiorepro.com/index.html

http://www.audioanthology.com/

[jwc]

I hear ya.

That "belle-like" model he has is a beauty. If I were to seek such an option say as a center channel...I would get the cabinet only. Jam a K33 or Crites in there and make the top end (possibly K510) to match fronts. After market XO not a biggie. Put in an ESN700t and get a PEQ. Done deal....beauty.

No.....not interested in buying a loaded Khorn clone.

jc

[heiney]

Coytee,

If you expect to be in the neighborhood - the west side of Kauai - email - I'd love the company - anybody that comes this far should get a chance to critique Gary's creations.

Mike

[Daddy Dee]

jc,

Thanks for finding HDBRBuilder's post in the archives.

[Wrench722]

Here are some Pic's.

[Wrench722]

Two Look all 3/4" Plywood!

[Wrench722]

Three

[Wrench722]

Four

[seti]

It looks like they have the wrong brand tag.

[whatever55]

If I could find a used Klipsch I also would buy one ( for a reasonable price of course)

Also I would rather but from someone in the US rather than China.