swede Posted September 14, 2000 Share Posted September 14, 2000 For under $5.00 you can sweeten those wonderful "Horns" we all love. Felt and double-sided tape and cut to fit all four sides of the mids and high horns and enjoy! Our local band director was here a few weeks back to listen to my KLF-30's and he said there's that darn blaring Klipsch sound. I had him over tonight, 9/14/00 and he asked if I replaced my loudspeakers. Why I asked: I am listening to a really warm sounding Stan Kenton and man do they sound fantastic!!! ------------------ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLOOMIS914 Posted September 16, 2000 Share Posted September 16, 2000 Swede- I have a brand new pair of KLF-30's, what can I expect by dampening the back side of the horns (Mid and tweeter). Is this something that Klipsch would agree with doing and is just not done at the factory due to cost/benefit reasons. I am very interested in any thoughts or opinions on this. I work for an adhesive/sealant company and we make/sell sound deadening patches and underbody coatings for the automotive industry. These materials provide incredible dampening characteristics. They are very flexible and stick to anything. Should I just pull the tweet and mid horns out of the front and then apply these on the backside (non-viewable) surface??? What will this do to that in your face PWK Horn sound that I love??? Will my speakers now sound like a conventional driver? Thanks, Brett Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pzannucci Posted September 17, 2000 Share Posted September 17, 2000 BLOOMIS914, The main change that I noticed when I used rope caulk on my KLFs is less of a plastic sound, especially on the attacks. The horn seems to resonate slightly at times. No, the horns will not sound like conventional drivers then, just better than they used to. I believe what swede did was to put the dampening material in the horn. Depending on the material, this will totally change the way the horn sounds. Peter Z. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve Posted September 21, 2000 Share Posted September 21, 2000 If I may add my 2¢ worth..you wouldn't have to change a thing with your horns..if you'd go tubes! I changed equipment (solid state) constantly, to avoid the "brightness" of my K-horns..then I realized that they weren't bright when I played LP's (records for you young folk). I never experienced a problem, even with SS gear until CD's came along..but when they did, I found that tube gear made all the difference! Try an Assemblage amp (SET 300B)..you'll love it!! I sure do! My hunt for equipment ended March 2K!! Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djk Posted September 21, 2000 Share Posted September 21, 2000 quote: Originally posted by steve: If I may add my 2¢ worth..you wouldn't have to change a thing with your horns..if you'd go tubes! I changed equipment (solid state) constantly, to avoid the "brightness" of my K-horns..then I realized that they weren't bright when I played LP's (records for you young folk). I never experienced a problem, even with SS gear until CD's came along..but when they did, I found that tube gear made all the difference! Try an Assemblage amp (SET 300B)..you'll love it!! I sure do! My hunt for equipment ended March 2K!! Steve Perhaps you could explain to us how using a tube amp damps the horns and stops them from ringing? For a rude shock play some FM interstation noise through your speakers and then push the tape monitor switch.Now put on a solo piano piece.That ringy/overhang sound turns a lot of people off.These guys have some good ideas that are low cost,work well,easy for DIY,and reversible if you don't like the results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oosting Posted September 21, 2000 Share Posted September 21, 2000 You are better off trying some cheap damping materials before going to $$$$ SET $$$$ amps. You might even try (GASP!) equaization to remove some of the "brightness". Let's see...turn the treble knob to the left 15 degrees or spend $2000 on a new amp...... Ed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klewless Posted September 21, 2000 Share Posted September 21, 2000 hey, How can you really brag about cheap tweeks over the $$$$ SET $$$$ ? I think I still have some very used and very cheap speaker cable some place (the wire actually turned brown inside it's plastic cover). Then you wouldn't have to rotate 15 degrees counter-clockwise! How about $10 - $12 per foot. Any takers? Does anybody know how many pieces of chewing gum would be needed to dampen my LaScala horns? But seriously, most of the tweeks do sound like they make sense (no pun intended here). I do not recall seeing anyone on this board considering the isolation of the woofer from it's mounting board with a good elastic gasket. Speakerlab of old recommended such mounting. That seems like a reasonable tweek to me and will probably try it out some day. If I ever do, I'll post whatever I hear from it. Going to SET is not a tweek though. It is a major step. ------------------ John P St Paul, MN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve Posted September 22, 2000 Share Posted September 22, 2000 djk.. sorry, I thought we were all in this together! Let me back up a bit. I NEVER had a sonic problem with my KHorns, before CD's. It was then that I noticed the "ringing" (as you and others have put it) that I had never experienced with vinyl. But as we all know, we also get the scratches, no matter how much care you take with your records. Knowing that I couldn't halt the march forward in this recording/playback domain, I tried (as have many) other alternatives, like the dynamat trick, clipping the epilyectic (sp?) filter, etc with the speaker itself. While this did indeed accomplish some sonic improvements, they were (as stated in posts before this) "tweaks". YES, improvements, but small in size! I had always read about tubes/horn combos, and I think (you included) are looking for the "holy grail" of music enjoyment. The Assemblage SET300B wasn't that expensive (compared to the big names, Cary, etc) and it came with a 30 day return guarantee! All told, I opted for the upgrade, good SET tubes, etc, and still did it (shipping and all) for 1600.00 Not pocket change,no, but check out other SET amps! I'm sorry you took my comment wrong, but I was so elated with my find, I wanted to pass it on! I just want all the horn-loaded speaker fans to check out tube amps! Regards, Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djk Posted September 22, 2000 Share Posted September 22, 2000 quote: Originally posted by steve: djk..I tried (as have many) other alternatives, like the dynamat trick, clipping the epilyectic (sp?) filter, etc with the speaker itself. While this did indeed accomplish some sonic improvements, they were (as stated in posts before this) "tweaks". YES, improvements, but small in size! Steve When I pointed out to my mother that it was a waste of time to wash the storm windows before hanging them every fall because the inside windows were dirty I had to wash them too.Then it rained right after I got them all up.So much for being right.I'm glad you finally got yourself a good sounding amp.Now you can hear the benefits of damping your horns and eliminating the eliptical filter that were barely discernable to you previously.I have always had access to state-of-the-art electronics so my experience is different than yours.After reading the Richard Heyser review of the Klipschorn in Audio about 12 years ago and his comments about the time/energy response in the 6khz region of the tweeter I realized what the problem was.I dashed behind the Klipschorns with a pair of wire cutters and snipped out the eliptical filter.The change was so obvious that everybody asked me if I had cut out the tweeter.Female vocals show the biggest change.The tonality of the horn ring is quite different between the metal and plastic horns.The metal horn lacks damping.The plastic horn lacks rigidity.I find it easier to make the metal horns sound better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elso Kwak Posted February 28, 2001 Share Posted February 28, 2001 Hi, The ringing is in the CD and I mean that literally! It is due to the digital (oversampling ) filter. Watch the 1000Hz square wave on your scope and see the ringing. I just completed my KWAK-DAC and that is a non-oversampling dac. Now I have decent CD-sound and a PERFECT square wave on the scope! I dampened the metal K400 midrange horns but I could not hear any difference. ELSO ------------------ ELSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discorules Posted February 28, 2001 Share Posted February 28, 2001 So I wasn't just hearing things. I've heard this ringing on several brands of cd players. Is it inherent in CD or is it about how the CD is played back, i.e. one bit vs multibit, mega oversampling etc.? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T2K Posted February 28, 2001 Share Posted February 28, 2001 How about just applying some of the damping material over your ears.It's quick and easy. Would that work? Just wondering. Keith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdm56 Posted February 28, 2001 Share Posted February 28, 2001 Damping materials? SET amps? Just call me tin-eared, but I just luvz the sound of my '98 k-horns "as-is"! And I run cheap "mid-fi" (I hate that term AND whoever came up with it) Sony gear. I'm all solid state and listen almost exclusively to digital (CD and DAT). So if anybody should be having horn-itis, it should be be. I admit, I am toying with the idea of some kind of damping on the squawker, but then again, "if it ain't broke..." ------------------ JDMcCall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elso Kwak Posted March 1, 2001 Share Posted March 1, 2001 Hi, Discorules, The ringing is entirely due to the oversamplinging filter. Some VERY expensive DAC's like WADIA and Mark Levinson use a tremendous amount of computing power to oversample without the ringing. I can not afford them. So it is the way the CD is played back. If you have a bitstream or delta-sigma DAC the ringing digital filter is build in the DAC chip. Crystal published the ringing on the pulse in the CS4328 datasheet but on later models they simply skipped the pulse response! The only DAC's suitable for non oversampling are TDA1541, AD 1851 and with some tricks AD1865 or AD1861. See also my answer to Bernie at http://www.diyaudio.de/forum/messages/248/html ------------------ ELSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenB Posted March 2, 2001 Share Posted March 2, 2001 DJK & others, Okay, I know dynamatting works for my older set of Khorns & La Scala's which have the cast aluminum K401 mid horn. Makes your system sound more like a 2-way speaker, & smoother. I also have a newer set of Khorns with the PLASTIC squawker. Is dynamatting them the way to go ala the metal horns? It seems like since it's a different animal, damping should be handled differently. Also, happened to be into my La Scala bass compartment and noticed that the scews could be tightened several turns against the wood face, and since I thought they should be tight, I did so. Is there a proper "torque" setting for the gasket interface? Or is a reasonably tight interface always better? Wondering if I did the right thing, and since I did a bunch of other stuff at the same time I can't listen to the change easily. Thanks for your responses..Ken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.