heresy2guy

Are you indigenous to Texas, Jeff? You sound like a transplanted New Yorker.

Brothers In Arms is a really sweet-sounding CD...crystal clear, with lots of dynamic range...the CD truly sounds awesome on high efficiency Klipsch, particularly the La Scalas and Khorns. -H2G

JC's "DBB" speaker is an evolution of his "Cornscala". You should check that one out - dual bass bins, dual Cornwall K33 woofers, far less cone excursion, much more bass. Sounds like it would be a definite improvement of the Cornscala, which itself is an improvement over the Cornwall and the La Scala. -H2G

LOL

I've got both Heresy IIs and La Scalas with AL3 crossovers and the bass between the two is fundamentally different, not only in sound, but in intensity - the La Scala bass will definitely deliver a swift "punch" to the chest that the Heresy II can't even come remotely close to doing. My wife knows nothing about speakers but even she admits that when you crank the volume, the La Scala will "thump" you while the Heresy II won't. And like I said before, the folded horn bass of the La Scala doesn't sound anything at all, to me, like the sealed enclosure of the Heresy II. I will say that the La Scala sounds like a Heresy II on steriods with respect to the midrange, probably because they both share exponential squawkers, but the La Scala's massive squawker is crossed over so much lower and its sensitivity is so much higher that it enables you to hear infinitely more detail then the Heresy II. It's truly a night-and-day difference in this regard. I'm happy with my La Scalas sans subwoofers when listening to music but am not happy at all when listening to a DVD/Movie. The low end requirements are totally different. Music demands fast, accurate bass while a movie soundtrack (T.Rex roaring, explosions, etc...) demands something a bit more boomy, or exaggerated, to coin Doc Who's term.

Amy, I actually liked the old, original search function better - the one used before the "new" forums came online. What I found most useful about that particular search function is that it would simply give you your results by individual thread, not the individual responses (or posts) WITHIN individual threads. For instance, if there were 1,000 results for the searched term "Heresy", but those results were found in, say, only 10 individual threads, then your search result would yield the titles of those 10 individual threads and nothing else. This allowed you to see exactly how many threads there were on a given topic and allowed you to then search each thread individually. The "newer" method of searching, which was employed when the new forum came online, was to list all 1,000 postings individually, and, to make matters worse, the postings (results) wouldn't be in any particular order, which meant you had 1,000 links to browse and then click through, which didn't make for efficient searching. In my opinion, I'd rather have my search return 10 threads on the term "Heresy" then 1,000 individual postings on the term "Heresy". Of course, the newest Google method of searching is worse still, but at least it's only temporary. Perhaps we can get the old, original method of searching back? Thanks, H2G

Thanks for taking the time to post this! I sorta collect 'em in a way (older Klipsch literature); makes for good reading when you're ummmm...taking care of personal business - lol. -H2G

I loaded tons of spec-sheets sometime ago...don't seem to recall if Cornwall was there (Cornwall II certainly was). Do a search under "check out these 1980s spec-sheets"...or something to that effect, and you should find it. -H2G

I agree 100%. Da' Bird's pretty funny, and his posts certainly add some levity around here.

Biggest difference between KG4 and Forte, to me, is the midrange. KG4 uses a conventional cone for the midrange while the Forte uses a compression driver mated to a horn. I too feel that the KG4 sounds "muddy" compared to my Heresy of La Scala. I attribute the muddiness to the midrange. The horns are able to open-up the sound and allow it to pan out into the room the way in such a way as to make what you're hearing sound "live." The KG4, with it's cone-driven midrange, seems, "closed," or "muddied" in direct comparison. This is something that I've noticed again and again when comparing a horn loudspeaker to a conventional (cone) loudspeakers. Horns really do make a huuuuuge difference and are, in my opinion, responsible for the "open," "live" sound that Klipsch is famous for.

"It has been a long time but I remember the Fortes sounding a lot more like live music and the KG4s being like recorded music for lack of a better explanation." - RPLACE _________________________ I always notice this myself and it's always evident when I'm comparing a three-way vs. a two-way speaker. Or, maybe I should say, a horn-loaded midrange speaker vs. a cone-driven midrange speaker because there are some two-way speakers out there that use a single horn for the mids and highs. A conventional cone simply cannot, to me, produce the "LIVE, RIGHT-THERE" sound that a horn can. Consequently, like you said, I too find that cones produce a LESS-live, more "recorded" sound. IMHO, horns sound "live" while cones sound "dead." Then again, some people may interpret "deadness" to mean "refinement" but that's their rightful opinion. I feel that a speaker's job should be to try to recreate that "live" sound and nothing does that better, to me, then a horn...and a horn-loaded midrange in particular, since, as PWK once said, "The midrange is where we live." -H2G

" I also prefer the "B" style look with the riser / space between the top and bottom sections. I don't think they made an aesthetic improvement by eliminating it. It was probably done for cost savings." - JMON _____________________________ I agree; I too like the "older" Khorn with it's "riser / spacer" better then the new version. With respect to the La Scala, however, I think the newer version looks much more handsome. The Heresy III looks the same as the Heresy II, with the exception of the arched risers. -H2G

Any thoughts on utilizing this horn http://www.usspeaker.com/paudio%20ph-4525-1.htm with the Radian 850PB?? P.Audio PH-4525 - 2" - 90°x 40° Horn 2" THROAT SIZE - 90°x 40° DISPERSION - ABS + GLASS FIBER PH-4525 Item Price: $105.99 HORN MODEL PH-4525 Specifications Throat Size 2" / 50mm Dispersion 90°x 40° Cutoff Frequency 400Hz Mounting Type Bolt-on Construction ABS + Glass Fiber Net Weight 3.52 lb. / 1.6 kg. Mounting Information Overall Width 17.72" / 450mm<?XML:NAMESPACE PREFIX = O /> Overall Height 9.8" / 249mm Overall Depth 9.09" / 231mm

It seems to be boiling down to the age-old debate over two-way vs. three-way. I must say, however, that I'm a bit surprised over the apparent three-way fans who have posted thus far. In the four years or so I've been surfing this forum, I seem to recall most people being in favor of a two-way design IF the driver and horn are up to the task. To my knowledge, PWK seemed to subscribe to this method of thinking as well and this no doubt left its mark on a lot of people here on this forum, myself included I'm not afraid to admit. Dennis - Did Radian ever respond to your results (probably not I'd imagine)? Do you still have 'em and would you mind posting 'em by chance? Was it an exponential or tractrix horn that you used for the test of the 850 PB? I myself was thinking along the lines of a big ol' tractrix horn, with the theory that the lower I could cross it, the better, especially since I love how the midrange horn of my La Scalas drop all the way to 400hz. But perhaps the reason PWK crossed it so low has something to do with the relatively poor bass response of both the La Scala and the Khorn cabinets in the upper regions?? I seem to recall reading a few posts somewhere along the line that focused on just this issue and one that specifically talked about the Jubille bass bin going so strongly into the 800hz region that there wasn't a need to cross over at 400hz like on the Khorn or La Scala. Or perhaps the higher crossover point simply focused on the fact that PWK wanted the Jubilee to be a two-way speaker, so....perhaps a higher point was needed in order for the horn to try and reach all the way to 20kz as flatly as possible with no obscene dips in the 400-800hz region??? I'm just guessing here guys...so feel free to chime in here and help me out - I'm no speaker "expert" - lol.

There are several threads on Khorn/Jubile projects and/or modifications already in the forums. I know that PWK originally wanted to make the Khorn a two-way speaker but due to driver limitations, had to resort to a three-way. He apparently got his wish with respect to his final project, the Jubilee, since it's of a two-way nature with one horn going from circa 700-850hz or so (I don''t have the stats in front of me) all the way up to 20khz. Radian offers the 850 PB 2" compression driver that looks good on paper and I was wondering if anybody's heard it before and if so, on what horn? It seems to have great frequency response (smoother and better extended then even Radian's flagship 950 PB) and is 113db efficient with good power handling. Anybody have any thoughts as to the type of exponential or tractrix horn that could be used to cover from approximately 500-750hz all the way up to 20khz for a two-way Khorn or Jubilee? Here's a link to the driver: http://www.radianaudio.com/products/compression/2_driver.php4?viewT=compression&viewC=2_driver&viewI= Specifications 651PB 760PB 850PB FREQUENCY RESPONSE 500 Hz 20 kHz 500 Hz 20 kHz 500 Hz 20 kHz MAXIMUM POWER HANDLING* 50 watts RMS 60 watts RMS 75 watts RMS SENSITIVITY 110 dB, one watt at one meter 111 dB, one watt at one meter 113 dB, one watt at one meter RECOMMENDED CROSSOVER 500 Hz, 24 dB/octave 1200 Hz, 12 dB/octave 500 Hz, 24 dB/octave 1200 Hz, 12 dB/octave 500 Hz, 24 dB/octave 1200 Hz, 12 dB/octave NOMINAL IMPEDANCE (LF/HF) 8 or 16 ohms 8 or 16 ohms 8 or 16 ohms D.C. Resistance 6.2 or 12.4 ohms (±10%) 6.2 or 12.4 ohms (±10%) 6.2 or 12.4 ohms (±10%) VOICE COIL DIAMETER 3.0 (76.2mm) 3.0 (76.2mm) 3.0 (76.2mm) THROAT DIAMETER 2.0 (50.8mm) 2.0 (50.8mm) 2.0 (50.8mm) VOICE COIL MATERIAL Edgewood copper- clad aluminum Edgewood copper- clad aluminum Edgewood copper- clad aluminum DIAPHRAGM MATERIAL 0.002 (0.05mm) heat-treated aluminum alloy 0.002 (0.05mm) heat-treated aluminum alloy 0.002 (0.05mm) heat-treated aluminum alloy DIAPHRAGM SUSPENSION Mylar® Mylar® Mylar® MAGNET 49.6 oz. (1.41 kg) Ferrite V 49.6 oz. (1.41 kg) Ferrite V 72.0 oz. (2.04 kg) Ferrite V FLUX DENSITY 16,400 gauss 17,000 gauss 19,000 gauss INPUT CONNECTORS Goldplated push-button terminals Goldplated push-button terminals Goldplated push-button terminals MOUNTING Four 1/4-20 studs, on 4.0" (101.6mm) centers Four 1/4-20 studs, on 4.0" (101.6mm) centers Four 1/4-20 studs, on 4.0" (101.6mm) centers DIMENSIONS 6.50 (165.1mm) diameter, 2.62 (66.5mm) deep less studs 6.50 (165.1mm) diameter, 2.85 (72.4mm) deep less studs 7.50 (190.5mm) diameter, 2.85 (72.4mm) deep less studs WEIGHT 9.0 lbs. (4.18 kg) 11.0 lbs. (5.09 kg) 14.6 lbs. (6.63 kg) *EIA Standard RS-426A through a 1 kHz 24 dB/octave Linkwitz-Riley crossover. 651PB Amplitude vs. Frequency of the Radian 651PB measured on a 2 (50.8mm) high frequency horn with a one watt (2.83 Vrms) input at 8 ohms. 760PB Amplitude vs. Frequency of the Radian 760PB measured on a 2 (50.8mm) high frequency; horn with a one watt (2.83 Vrms) input at 8 ohms. 850PB Amplitude vs. Frequency of the Radian 850PB measured on a 2 (50.8mm) high frequency horn with a one watt (2.83 Vrms) input at 8 ohms. Mylar is a registered trademark of Dupont. Specifications subject to change without notice. Click Here To Download The PDF Format Of This Product Sheet!

I'm amazed at how many people fall for the "don't touch the tone controls" crapola that almost all of the self-proclaimed blue-blooded "audiophiles" try to shove down your throat - it's total BS. If you're going to follow that line of thinking, then why are you here and why do you have Klipsch speakers? Don't you know that nearly every "audiophile" looks down his nose at Klipsch and basically considers them to be obnoxious, coarse, crude, and extremely vulgar loudspeakers??? To me, the tone controls are there for many reasons like helping you adjust the music due to: a) bad recordings, differences in audio equipment & speakers, c) differences in room designs and their associated harmonics, and d) your own individual, personal taste....or any combination of the above. In my view, anybody who believes in that old "you've gotta leave the tone controls flat" nonsense is, very simply put, a sucker. By the way, there have been several threads in this forum over the past few years focusing on this very issue.... -H2G

Awesome Game 2....that's the way a World Series game should be played; extremely exciting to watch!!! -H2g PS - Go Sox!!!! []

If you're a Forte lover then you'll feel short-changed with the Heresy because it simply can't come anywhere close to putting out the kind of bass that the Forte could; you'll feel as though there's a "hole" in your music, as you rightfully should, because no matter what Heresy you're looking at (even Heresy III), it's not going to go down to 32hz like the Forte. I believe Gary made the comment about the Cornwall and I must say I agree - if you love the Forte, you would probably love the Cornwall since they're both well-rounded speakers, sonically speaking, offering good highs, outstanding midrange, and deep, powerful bass. In short, they give you everything from the top to the bottom with no audible "hole." The only problem with them would be the WAF; perhaps, as Dr. Who suggested, a pair of Khorns would work??? Believe it or not, Khorns, when tucked into their corners, are far less obtrusive then Cornwalls...or especially La Scalas, and they simply outclass the other speakers we're talking about. Of course, if the wife's only interested in the slim, tall, tower designs that are so popular today then she'll probably give you a thumbs down on any heritage speaker...

The monstrous, seemingly magical, La Scala squawker is responsible for that "live, right-there" sound. So you see, size DOES matter (lol). [] -H2G

Wow - they let their signature "A Legend In Sound" die????

LOL []

Just wondering: From what vendor did Klipsch purchase the Forte woofer that so impressed Julian Hirsch (I know, I know...like anybody cares what he thought - lol) in his Stereo Review test of 1986? I was actually amazed to see such a favorable review of what was essentially a heritage-cousin in a major audio publication. Everybody knows the Forte had tremendous bass output, and it even floored Hirsch (particularly the low distortion), so I'm curious as to who made it since I doubt Klipsch manufactured it in house. I think they used Eminence for the Heresy II woofer back then...perhaps they did for the Forte as well??? -H2G

I like your signatures, Bob! By the way, your advice about not rope-caulking the metal horns can be construed as heresy around these parts - lol. I for one have never rope-caulked any metal horns and my all my current speakers utilize the plastic ones, but still, rope-caulking tends to be seen as something Moses carried down the mountain with him - lol. -H2G

It's proabably one or more of the internal fuses...simply unscrew the case, lift off, and have a quick look-see. This exact thing happened to an old JVC receiver I had years ago... -H2G

Don was a very interesting guy. He was half-jewish ("Only the good half," as Ray Liotta once joked about himself in the movie Goodfellas - LOL) and dropped out of school and lied about his age in order to join the Marines and fight in WWII. He took part in the now-historic Guadalcanal campaign (our first Pacific-theater "victory" in what came to be known as the U.S. "island hopping" strategy wherein we made our way closer and closer to mainland Japan with each costly, bloody, island victory). As a reward for his participation in Guadalcanal, he developed malaria... After being treated for the horrible disease, he was sent back to the states and became a DI (drill instructor). His real name was Donald James Yarmy, which he changed to simply Don Adams after marrying his first wife, Adelaide Adams. He worked as a commercial artist after the war and did stand-up comedy at night, which obviously paid off for him. Don was what could be defined as the quintessential American renegade who did things his own way and took many, many chances but was blessed with a good business sense that served him well later on in his life. Semper Fi, Don. -H2G