sootshe Posted November 8, 2009 Share Posted November 8, 2009 Hi all, Finally got the Trachorns up & running, so here are a few action shots. I was originally going to stain the horns to match the cabinets but that was a disaster! The paint shop I went to mixed the cans of stain up & they ended up a horrible orange colour. After many hours I finally ended up with them as you see them now. They have 2 coats of grey undercoat, 3 coats of satin black enamel & 2 coats of satin clear lacquer. I jigsawed the original motor board to accept the larger horn which meant removing the grill cloth, making the cut out & re installing the grill cloth...turned out better than I thought it would. All that,s left to do now is veneer the bass reflex cabinets. And how do they sound? I originally built these cabinets for my wife to use as a second set of speakers. My reference has always been my Altec Model 19's that I have had for about 15 years. Whenever I would listen to another system or another pair of speakers I would come home, put the Altecs on & always think that they were the better sound. When I got the LS home in standard form (Crites stamped woofer, K400/K55, CT125's & A 4500's) I found that I couldn't listen to them as they had no bottom end, were glary & generally not very pleasant, but that was OK as they were only my second pair of speakers & the Altecs were still my favourites....then I met you guys!! First was the bass reflex cabinets, plus cast frame woofers....now I had some sort of botom end. Then was the crossovers (change to ALK Universals), much more refined & detailed (the Altecs still beter overall) & now the Trachorns. Well, I'm afraid the Altecs now take a back seat & I don't say that lightly, as I really wanted the Altecs to still be better. The Trachorns have changed the whole character of the sound. No more constriction, edginess, harshness. The sound is now completely natural & a lot more open. I hooked the Altecs up again for a comparison & they now sound strained in comparison. These horns open the sound up completely & produce an effortless quality that is hard to beat. As you can see, I'm extremely happy with my final result....thanks for all your help. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sootshe Posted November 8, 2009 Author Share Posted November 8, 2009 And another Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sootshe Posted November 8, 2009 Author Share Posted November 8, 2009 Another Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sootshe Posted November 8, 2009 Author Share Posted November 8, 2009 Thats all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
consistent Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 Great job, I thought you 'banana benders and rum drinkers' only surfed...i was wrong! What plans did you use. Cheers Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blvdre Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 I can't say that I've seen an open horn mounted within a grill before - I think you may have started a new trend. Looks great! IMO, horns need to be shown off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Robinson Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 Ditto to the above. I also love the T-77 up on that block ... Very cool ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sootshe Posted November 10, 2009 Author Share Posted November 10, 2009 Great job, I thought you 'banana benders and rum drinkers' only surfed...i was wrong! What plans did you use. Cheers Steve Here are the plans for the basic cabinets. My inspiration for the design goes to Greg Roberts & the wondeful work he does....much better than I could ever do. He deserves all the credit for the way these turned out.Now all the hard work is done all I have to do is sit back & enjoy....oh & finally have a bit of time for getting back to the surf. PS: The tweeters are now removed from their stands & sit directly on top of the horn cabinets....they were just too high with the addition of the bass reflex cabs. Sound now much better. LaScala11.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Klappenberger Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 John, It seems to me that you could improve things by moving the tweeters back a bit until they are position directly above the squawker drivers. With them sitting free on top like that, it should be easy to do. That would improve the time alignment between the squawker and tweeter. It might improve your stereo image and reduce smearing of the highs. There's quite a bit of overlap between the two with my universal network. I'd like to know if you think it helps any. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sootshe Posted November 10, 2009 Author Share Posted November 10, 2009 John, It seems to me that you could improve things by moving the tweeters back a bit until they are position directly above the squawker drivers. With them sitting free on top like that, it should be easy to do. That would improve the time alignment between the squawker and tweeter. It might improve your stereo image and reduce smearing of the highs. There's quite a bit of overlap between the two with my universal network. I'd like to know if you think it helps any. Al,Yes, I used to run them this way & felt that it was better with the drivers aligned. With the addition of the bass reflex cabinets the top of the horn cabinet is now an extra 10 inches higher. If you put the tweeter in line with the mid driver it needs to be some 6 inches higher then the cabinet in order for it to have an uninterrupted line of sight to my seated position. To have them this high, to my ears, seemed to overide the advantage of having the voice coils aligned. I've found the best compromise for my set up is straight on top of the cabinets right at the front & slightly angled to the listening position. Ah, I tell a lie... the best position is as I've just described, but with the tweeters mounted vertically. (I just can't live with the look of that just at the moment - maybe I'll get used to it) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Roland Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 Hi John, Your setup looks great. I have owned both Cornwalls, Klipschorns and Altec Model 19s, which are my current hi-eff speakers, along with a pair of Quad ESL-63. Anyway, I am wondering what midrange driver you're using with your Trachorns. Are you using the stock K-55V or something else? I had a pair of Trachorns when I owned my K-horns, and they were the smoothest mid horns I ever had with Klipsch's midrange driver. Enjoy your music! George Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 John: Very nice work. Those look terrific. I know how much 'fun' it is to take a saw to your La Scalas. I love the look of the Trachorns on that custom grille. Excellent! Now, to add to your frustration, I might suggest you take a look at the Eminence APT-150. Same driver as the Crites tweeter, but the larger horn made a nice, subtle difference in the highs on my system. I know, it is always something, but if you get a chance, get a pair of those and give them a listen. I just added the APT-150's to my Khorn Trachorns. Since you have your tweeters above, that would work for you as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sootshe Posted November 10, 2009 Author Share Posted November 10, 2009 George, I'm using the stock K55 & can't believe how good this driver sounds when you give it half a chance. Many here are going to 2 inch format & from what they say that is another step forward again, but for the time being, I'm more than happy with the stock set up. My reference has always been the 19's, but these LS are sooo much better, so I've made a huge leap forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 John, take a look at the tweeter setup in this thread. Bruce put his APT-150 on top like you did your CT-125. http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/p/124797/1266254.aspx#1266254 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sootshe Posted November 10, 2009 Author Share Posted November 10, 2009 John, take a look at the tweeter setup in this thread. Bruce put his APT-150 on top like you did your CT-125. http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/p/124797/1266254.aspx#1266254Rudy,Yes, I've seen those pictures before, but never took much notice of them....now I see what you mean. I looked up the local distributor for Eminence here in Oz & have sent him an email asking if he will supply just the horns only....don't really feel like splurging out on new tweeters when I've just bought these...but thanks for the tip....I'm sure it will be an improvement & I wouldn't mind a tad more top end. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 An Eminence rep should certainly help. When I checked into it, I could not get just the horns. So, I sold the CT-125s and picked up the entire APTs. I realize it is easier for me to get that done. I hope you can get it to work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marvel Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 My CT125s are still installed int eh cabinets.One of my sons had purchased a pair of the Eminence horns and drivers for a project, but I ended up with them. The difference is amazing. A much bigger sound is the only way I can explain it. Having them aligned with the mids made a HUGE difference. I can only imagine what the midrange upgrade would do for the sound.Knowing all the upgrades I could do, I could easily live with these... Bruce Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Klappenberger Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 Guys, If you are going to start changing the horns on the same driver that Bob uses to make his CT125 you might as well move to a new horn with an even better driver yet. I like the Beyma CP25 myself. Remember that the big advantage of Bob's CT125 is that it an improved driver on a drop-in horn. If you are going to sit it on top, you don't need the drop-in feature horn or the driver that fits on that horn. Just go for a better complete tweeter! BTW: I see your point about the extra height messing up the sound path. Here's a silly idea: hang the tweeter, verticly mounted, off the "inboard" side of each speaker in alignment with the K55. It will certainly make for an interesting experiment! Al K. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudy81 Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 I have owned the CT-125s, which I really liked. I have auditioned the Beymas in my home during the Vtrac demo and now have the APT-150s installed. For my ears, I preferred the Eminence driver. Fairly recently I changed the CT-125 to the APT-150. That horn change made a very noticeable difference in the highs. The CT-125 produces a very nice sound, to my ears, but it is easy to locate that tweeter 'audibly'. When I installed the APT-150, I found the soundfield much larger and more diffuse, yet still precise in instrument localization. It is now very difficult to locate the tweeter 'audidly' from my sitting position. Imaging is still outstanding, but the soundstage seems more open and spacious. My center channel still has the CT-125, and will stay, since I can't put anything on top of my La Scala due to the height of my projection screen. The good thing is that for a center channel, the tweeter location is not nearly as critical. I hope I have been able to explain the difference I heard between the Crites horn and the Eminence horn. BTW, my tweeters are on the inside of the Khorn top hat relative to my sitting position. I have tried them on the outside, but found I prefer them on the inside. I liked the APT horn so much, I already sold my CT-125s. The horn makes a very noticeable difference. I also found that USspeaker is on back order until January. Most online retailers are out of stock, I don't know why, but it seems those drivers are being bought up....at least according to the USspeaker customer support rep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjgeraci Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 Sootshe, congrats on your beautiful Lascalas and your Trachorn experience. I've enjoyed the Trachorn/902 combo so much that this week I moved them back up front (and yes, even though they have one inch throats). I also agree with Rudy. I've owned Beyma CP25s (they currently sit on a shelf), JBL 2404s (they are in another setup), and I keep coming back to the Eminence sound - at least for quasi-Heritage. Maybe its the phenolics. The Eminence are very reasonably priced, but I personally dig the sound. After all, much of our various listening experiences are subjective as to likes and dislikes. Although yes, as a general preference, I prefer higher quality drivers. But, there are exceptions. I also have heard dramatic differences in the type of horns coupled to the Eminence supertweeters, with the various APT designs having better dispersion that the K 77 design. As for the open horn look - I agree that it really suits the top end of large Heritage. After all, enclosed is a pic of my rear surrounds.................... Carl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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